Just got really interested in the AR type rifles thanks to Billy and was looking at the SIG556 Classic have anyone dealt with these or have one if so how are they compared to the Colts, S&W, DPMS, RockRiver etc. in durabilty, reliabily, and accuracy. I her the chrome lined barrels last, but will lose a little bit in accuracy compared to others without the chrome lined barrels. Thnaks in advance.

NO opinions

The SIG556 is not an AR type rifle. The only thing AR in it is the caliber and the fact it uses the same magazine.

I prefer AR's.

Ok just learning about them anyone care to enlighten the subject some more as to my post above?

Not sure why a Democrat would need an AR or a Sig. Obama will protect you.

I'd be happy to do that Popapi. The Sig556 is a proprietary design from Sig that uses the same caliber as the AR-15 (.222/5.56) and the same magazine (because they are so popular and ubiquitous.) Apart from that the SIG556 is more of an Ak47 knock off or the earlier SIG55X design.

The AR-15's attractions as a rifle have to do with light weight, "mil-spec" parts and add-ons and the fact you can make your AR be YOUR AR by the simple expedient of changing out parts and mixign and matching them. This is something you cannot do with a SIG556. This does not detract from the SIG556 design as to its reliability, accuracy and ergonomics; it's just not an AR-15.

If you want a taste for what you can do with an AR-15, get the Brownells catalog dedicated to ARs, it's in its fourth edition now. You compare it to the same catalog for a SIG556, this one would be much smaller and would only contain the parts that you can attach to the rails, such as scopes, lasers, etc.

One last item that really turned me off the SIG556 is that they make the upper be the numbered part; the one that has to go through an FFL. For the AR-15, only the lower is the numbered part; With one lower, you can have as many uppers are you want and you can buy them over the Internet and have them delivered to your door. So with that lower, you could have an SBR, a carbine, a target rifle and a space gun. You could even have a piston-powered upper if you wanted to. You can even have uppers in different calibers.

The AR is far more versatile than the sig556.

I have both AR's and Sig 556's, they are pretty similar in that they are semi-auto 223's and use the same magazines. IMHO both have advantages and disadvantages.

As mentioned earlier the AR-15 on account of it being available and popular for 40years or so has ton's of aftermarket parts and variations available. If you like 1911's and Ruger 10/22's because you can customize them the AR is for you. AR's can be tuned into extremely accurate rifles for target shooting and/or Varmint hunting.
The disadvantage to an AR compares to a PC and Mac thing, like a PC an AR has lots of parts available for it the problem is that the quality of those parts can vary quite a bit. There are lots of AR's that are shoddily built, slapped together and are likely to break the first time you run them hard. They need to be run wet with lube to run properly.
I think if you will read around a good bit about AR-15's you'll find that they are kinda 3 tiers of AR's made: 1. cheap ones built to sell on price 2. Mid-tier guns that are better made but still not full mil spec 3. Higher end Mil-spec guns that use better parts inside and don't break as often.

As for as Sig 556's go, I haven't had a single malfunction with any of the three I own. In general I think they are a more reliable firearm than an AR, even than the higher grade AR-15's. Sig bolts for example are rated to last twice as long as AR-15 bolts. If reliability is your primary goal I'd lean to a Sig 556 - but toss the mags that come with it and use good ones like Magpuls, H&K or Milsurp mags.
As to accuracy my Sigs have been 1-2 MOA guns whereas some of my AR's a 1/2 to 1 MOA guns, AR's in my experience have been a little more accurate.
There aren't yet as many options for customization of SIG's but more options are coming out. The rifles haven't been out for near as long as AR's but they are becomming popular so more stuff is being made for them.

So my summary would be that AR's are more versatile and SIG's are more reliable. Choose accordingly.

BTW in OKC Outdoor America had good prices on the Sig's. They were several hundred less than H&H. I bought a 556 Swat at OA for $500 less than H&H had them (sorry it was the last one at time). If you decide on a 556 Classic I'd wait till Outdoor America had them for $1350 or so instead of paying $1899 or more at H&H......................................DJ

The assumption that a piston driven gun like the Sig 556 could be more reliable than the AR platform comes from the comparison of the AK 47 and AR.

The piston driven SIG 556 does run cooler and cleaner in the breach area which may give it an advantage (time will tell).

However, the Sig 556 (and other new piston rifles) are built much tighter than the AK 47. There is less room for debris/dirt/sand to get into the action of these guns but its also less room for it to get back out.

I have read more that a couple of reviews on the Sig saying it would be fine for urban combat but would not fare very well in harsh operating climates.

The AK shines for its reliability because of its loose operating tolerances combined with its piston driven system.

IMO if you are looking for reliability there is no advantage to these new tight tolerance piston guns over the AR platform.

If you want a piston gun get a good AK IMO.

My pick is still the DI AR platform from a top tier company.

Your right just like to have one don't need it for protection thank you kindly for chiming in Sir.

FTR, and TimberBuck thanks for your replies very helpful! DJ I was at OutDoor America talking to BigJohn about the SIG and feel in love with the rifle not to much concern about accuracy if it'll shoot 1-2" groups I'm satisfied. To say the least I'm looking at the reliabilty aspect of the rifle being that I just want to buy only one, seriously thinking about headed back there this week and picking the classic up I can't see them being any cheaper unless you know something I don't LOL. H&H are quite a bit higher than anywhere I've seen, the only reason I go in there is to pickup some much needed reloading items and see and talk to the Guys I've known for awhile that works there.......other than than thatI stay on the gas. Thank you very much for the information you provided I wholeheartedly appreciate it!

Anytime, Marcus.

TenFo! Your post really got the ball moving to get one of these picking it up tomorrow! Your a Gentleman and a Scholar thanks again!!!!!!!!

Popapi, Big John, Kent, Steve and the young guy in tactical are really nice helpful guys. I think you'll be glad you picked up one of the Classic's from OA. We'll talk later about which optic to try ...............................DJ

Heck ya those Guys are great, Kent was on me pretty hard on saturday to pick the rifle up then being that I didn't know awhole lot about the 556 or any rifle of that nature I told him I wanted to research alittle bit before purchase. When you and the other Gentleman chimed in with the information posted my mind was made up, this morning I called John and told him "You'll see me tomorrow" he laughed and said good deal. I want to thank you and others here on everything, and yes looking forward to talking about optics later ! Last but not least how do you feel about the 1:7 twist the classic have?

I prefer the 1/7 twist in 223's because I like the way 77gr Sierra's shoot. They shoot quite well in my 556 Classic. A 1/7 will still shoot 55's ok but most of my 223 shooting is done with 69-80gr bullets.

As far as Optics go, my favorite for the 556 is an Aimpoint M-4. Battery life is incredible, one single AA battery and you can pretty much leave it on for 5 or 6 YEARS and not have it run out.

The biggest thing you want to watch for on a 556 Optic is the mount. I also like Eotech sites but they overhang the rail enough to where they interfere with the bolt handle. Get an optic that the mount isn't much wider than the rail. I haven't had a Trijicon yet but they might be a good choice if you want a little magnification, but mine all have aimpoints of one flavor or another................................DJ

Fantastic information. I'm going over to the websites of the optics you listed above. Lord willing the rifle I'll be getting will have the SigSauer sight(RedDot) on it which I will sale. The M4's are nice DJ, which trijicon do you like? Hey just to let you know I'll be taking this dude coyote hunting as well!

Was meaning to get there this morning to purchase but had a funeral to attend, kinda glad I didn't go because I found out Sig makes these dudes in OD green which is shonuff eye candy to me .

Tonight I'll be pondering on getting the black classic or the rare OD Green! I really appreciate the information you presented on the 1/7 twist, because I would really like to shoot some heavy stuff through it!!!

You cannot overstabilize the bullet. You will like the 1/7 twist for the heavier stuff. If you get a chance try the Hornady 75 gr TAP in it. We'll make a conservative out of you yet!

TenFo your crazy dude thanks for the info. elkhunter!

If you are thinking of using the rifle as a Coyote gun you might want a scope with a little magnification. You might look at something like a Leupy 1.5-5 with a hvy duplex reticle or go out to Gene Sears and buy one of the fantastic low powered Nightforce scopes (talk to BJ for the best price).

If you are mounting really about any optic you can't do better than a Larue mount.

http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/StoreFront.bok

Larue stuff is the very best made period. Be forewarned that there stuff is so popular that there can be a signifigant wait for it, Soldiers and Operators come first, but it's worth the wait.

The mount that comes on the M-4 is pretty good. H&H has them for around $725 or so if you want one quick. You might save some shopping around but H&H isn't too far off. Larue has a package deal that's real tempting but I don't know how long you'd have to wait.

On one of my other 556's I have a Comp M2 Aimpoint in a GG&G mount. It's lighter than the M4, cost less but the batteries it uses are the round camera type batteries that cost more and are harder to find than AA's. Still a good site though. H&H has some of these at not too far off prices.

If I were you I'd go down to H&H and talk to Twan. He's a really good guy and a freind of mine. He'll show them all to you. You might also look at the Leupold tactical scope. I think it's a 1.1-4 and is pretty cool on a tactical rifle, Twan has one on one of his AR's. I don't have one myself but have been thinking about one. Sears may or may not have these cheaper than H&H.

Usually H&H keeps a better selection of sites for AR's and 556's in stock. Some of them they have decent if not great prices on but at least you can look at them side by side.

The coolest trijicon IMHO is the one that has the red dot scope piggybacked on top so you get the best of both worlds. It will cost you more than your rifle though!

If you handload I recommend that you find some 69gr Sierra matchkings and load them behind 26.0grs of Varget in commercial cases. This load has shot goot to great in just about every 223 with a 1/9 or quicker twist that I've tried them in (probably a dozen or so!). It's a good solid load to start from.

Good luck with your 556! Tell Twan I said hey and sorry I can't afford the SCAR yet! .............................DJ

Goodness DJ you are the HUCKLEBERRY! I'll go out to H&H tomorrow and talk to Twan and relay your message this will give me the opportunity to speak with Will and Clay also! The Nightforce scopes are nice...WOW!

I'm going over to check out the Larue products along with the GG&G mounts, and leupold tactical scopes you mentioned.

I Will be reloading for the rifle and will try the load data you posted. DJ I appreciate you helping me Guy. I feel you know I would do the same for you.
Marcus,

DJ I like this set up here!
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/catalog/P1011567.JPG

That one might be hard to beat.....................DJ

Marcus,

Larue or GG&G QR mounts are very nice and worth the $$. SOmeone else here said buy once cry once. Buy the best one you can first and never look back. I like the Leupy 1.5x5 with with German #4 illuminated. this gun has a 1/7 twist and put every52 to 55 gr bullet under a 1/2 inch at 50 yds with scope and irons even with me shooting.

The Hornady 75 gr TAP shoots one hole out of my Armalite M15A4T. The load DJ quoted shoots very well too, although I substituted H335 as I did no thave Varget at the time.

Well since you said that, this setup has to be of quality, reliability, and durable. I decided to go with the green classic 556 that has the SIG Sauer Mini Red Dot Sight which I'll be selling as soon as BJ get the rifle in(2 days). I'll also look at the NightForce optics while there. I figure on down the road I'll be looking into the Comp M2 Aimpoint you recommended, which I REALLY do like! Hey just want to say thanks again for the information you provided and when I get this dude in and shoot it I'll give you a report..............man I hope it shoost ATLEAST a inch!

WOW!!!! I was going to comment on the above post on the Leupy 1.5x5 and forgot to do so until I read your post. I'll be looking at it as well Elk! To say the least I would not have known these rifles were so accurate until my buddy Billy, DJ, you and others have mentioned it. I just want a setup that will be durable, reliable, and accurate simply because I feel this will be my ONLY rifle of this nature, so I'm glad you Guys chimmed in on not just only the rifle, but the mounts and optics.

I'm doing alot of reading and research on the above items because I only want to do this once .

DJ and Elk which mount and why? I like the GGG-1383 FLT Accucam QD Scope mount, but have heard ALOT of the LaRue Tactical SPR / M4 Scope Mount QD LT-104's go to some of the darkest parts of the world with the military. As for optics I've decided to go with the NightForce NXS 2.5-10x24 for now!


http://www.gggaz.com/index.php?id=238&parents=69,128
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=30

Marcus,

I wanted to mount the scope farther forward so I could put my BUIS on too. I like the GG&G but the Larue has smoother lines. On the CQB I could have used almost any mount but on an M4 with a shorter top rail a forward mount was necessary for me. My prejudice lies in the fact that I can purchase GG&G at dealer cost. Larue at retail......

Good deal as per the dealer cost! I'm leaning towards the GG&G it's lighter and being able to move the scope a little farther is a plus to me. Is 155.00 a good price on the GGG-1383 FLT Accucam QD mount?

Marcus,

IIRC yes it is as retail is $190. GG&G offers discounts to LEO & military. The price you lis is pretty close to dealer I am thinking. I am not where I can look it up right now. Whichever way you go the QD option is a plus.

If you are not in a big hurry sign up for their email. They offer specials now and then at very good prices.

Signing up now!!!!! Thank you Sir!

I would go with the Larue. Their adjustable clamp returns to zero better than most of the competitive mounts.........................DJ

GG&G clamp is adjustable also and returns to zero on mine without issue. I do like the lines of the Larue though.

Thanks Guys!!!!!!!!!!!! Will do one or the other thanks again for your expertise!!!

Marcus just pick the one you like the best. They are both solid mounts. Post pics when you get that gun together!

O yes without a doubt on the pics. I thought the rifle(GreenOne) would be in today ordered on Wed. and BJ said 2 days so hopefully on monday. I'm ready to pat that rascal!

You are hooked already! Beware it cannot stop with just one! They are too much fun!

Please don't say that.............I'm afraid you may be right I was trying to psych myself out Elk .

C'mon Marcus! Where are the pictures?

Well Elk thought you wanted to see it with the nightforce on it(which have not came in). Got it but down here in Louisana on vacation til monday and will post just the pic if you want to see this beautiful rascal!

Alway wanted to shoot one Marcus. Going to have to bug a friend that has one to be able to try his out! Post a pic when you can!

I'll post him with some of his siblings shortly!

Marcus, you're going to love that 556. A few months back I was in the same boat and decided to go with the sig. Now I've been bit by the bug and I'd like an AR as well. Anyways, enjoy yourself...you're going to find that ammo has a way of disappearing quickly with that rifle. It is flat out fun to shoot. BTW, check out this site, particularly the sticky about how to treat a new 556 before shooting:
http://www.sigarms556.com./

I know it's a Sig specific forum but there seems to be alot left to be desired in the gun and CS.

Thanks Whip!

I've never owned an AR. Shot M16A2s in the AF without any optics. If I'm hunting 4 legged animals, especially ground squirels wouldn't any good 3-9x variable scope work well?

Yes get the SIG, it will serve you well. There are no problems with the gun, none what so ever, customer service is great, the bolt will last a million rounds, it shoots into .1 inches at 300 yards great gun. I hope people buy a million of them. They are much much more reliable than any AR. You deserve the SIG jump right on it. Don't do a web search on any of the AR forums that say its a total POS, its just jealousy and prejudice and ignorance. Get one and be prepared for anything that comes at you.