Hi all,

Im new to the forum as a member but have viewed many posts over the years in researching guns and other things.

I have a rare un-fired still in cosmoline and in the crate Winchester model 70 bull gun in 300 H&H that I am trying to find a home for and am wrestling with putting it in auction or trying to put it up for private sale.

My goal is to post it here to give interested Winchester collectors and opportunity to express interest and call me with questions before I proceed.

Welcome aboard.
I'm tempted to say it's collector value is next to nil as someone has committed the ultimate sin of actually inserting the bolt into the receiver.

I'm just kidding!!

Very nice piece and someone will be along directly to take it off your hands or at least give you a very good idea of the market value.

The stuff dreams are made of....

Thanks for sharing and welcome!

Wow, how cool! It looks like it has some nice wood as well!

Eric

MisterGreen: I am interested in your Rifle but I have "forgotten" your phone number.
Maybe you could post a price range here?
I have a similar Rifle in the same caliber and its still with its crate - I store my unfired Rifle out of its crate though.
My 300 H&H Bull Gun has serial number 535,XXX (I date my Bull Gun to September of 1961 manufacture though).
Best of luck in selling your rare and fine Rifle!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Interesting. Welcome to the fire. Why is the crate labeled "Hong Kong"??

BSA, I was wondering the same thing.

Eric

Varmint guy, why is the crate labeled "Hong Kong". Was yours like this as well???

Bsa1917hunter: I don't know about the Hong Kong designation on the crate?
I will go check my crate to see if the address is on the sides - the "top" of my crate is missing I do remember that
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Here is another that sold via RIA last year. Same box. It shows the labels.

http://www.rockislandauction.com/viewitem/aid/58/lid/404

Bsa1917hunter: Nope no "Hong Kong" markings on the wood of my crate.
I always assumed if there were a "mailing address" on the crate it would have had to have been on the missing top.
The end flap of my crate is blue and white Winchester paper label glued to the wood - but again no address there.
Hong Kong? I wonder if Hong Kong folks could order or OWN guns back in the 1960's?
I am not a very "worldly" person so I can't answer my own question.
What a super cool gun though that MISTERGREEN has there.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Alright, "hong kong" crate aside. The red book of Winchester values says a rifle in 98-100% condition is worth "$4,440.00". I've personally never seen a 300H&H bull gun. It definitely has cool factor written all over it...

Check out the RIA auction link I just posted Varmintguy. It has the same label as yours I would assume. Are there any other similarities with yours? It has the Hong Kong label.

Join the club buddy. I agree, it is a super cool rifle too.

MisterGreen: I went to the link you provided and I am now guessing that there is/was a U.S. military base somewhere near Hong Kong and that Lt. had the Rifle shipped to him?
How interesting.
And I had better "update" my various inventories (both on-line and hard copies) as per the "estimated price" this Rifle was given!
Is there a notation as to waht it did sell for?
My E-mail is: [email protected]
By the way my "end flap" label is exactly like the one in the auction house photos - complete with the on label and off label hand written serial numbers (one is written on the wood).
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

MisterGreen: The wood screws in my crate seem to have a more bronze or copper tint to them than yours?
Perhaps it was the lighting in my gun vault?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Yep servicemen could order the rifles and have them shipped over seas. My 375 was shipped to Korea in late 1950, then had some engraving done over there, then brought back to the states where it stayed in Kansas City until I bought it and moved to NM. Still trying to track down who the engraver was.

Very nice rifle you have there.

Mr Green, If you and Varmint Guy do not trade I would love a chance at your gun.I am still beating myself up for not buying that exact gun in 300WinMag. very best WinPoor

PM'd you Winchesterpoor.

Hi MisterGreen, For some reason the PM did not come thru, you may want to try my email, [email protected] , thanks the most WinPoor

The gun posted as lot 404 in the April 2013 auction did not sell as I went back and checked realized prices. very best winpoor

Those two are 117 apart in serial numbers with such a similar history.
I wonder if they were ordered as rifles for a team?
Lot 404 has the name of the serviceman who ordered it. Interesting research project for sure!

To those serious Winchester collectors. I am more than likely going to be listing this in the auctions to let the price sort itself out.

The question is, do I take it out of the box for photos? My gut tells me no. You can still see the cosmoline which would have been removed if this was fired.

Thoughts?

Mr Green, I may well be wrong but I thought they were shipped with the bolt out, can the bolt be removed without un- bolting from crate? very best on a true collector piece. Very Best WinPoor

Don't remove anything. If barrel has grease inside you don't have to do anything if not you might want to lift the bolt and withdraw it part way to create air flow through the bore. Dead airspace is conducive to metal oxidation.

I would not remove rifle out of the crate prior to sale. Winchester folks just like S&W folks like original undisturbed look. Don't worry nobody knows if the gun was shipped with bolt inserted or not. Remember wood crate is different from a cardboard box.

No you leave it in the crate just as it is. Right now it is truly NIB or NIC as it were! Any serious M70 collector will much prefer it the way it is than removed from the crate and cleaned up. Remember to high end collectors (and this is who would be bidding on this rifle) they don't want them to fondle , they want them to put away to gain value or to brag that they have it. Bull guns are quite rare but there are a lot more of them out of the crate then in, your's is probably the only one that is truely NIB and that gets a lot of bragging rights to a collector.

Roger Rule I am not, model 70's ,cardboard or wood crate were shipped with bolt out. that much I will bet on! I have had the priveledge of opening 2 unopened cardboard pre 64 mod 70's. No wood crates to date... very best WinPoor

MisterGreen contact Steve over on Rim Fire Central. Steve (Seewin) will tell you everything you need to know...best

Better yet...

Steve's email [email protected]

Holy Crapp!!!!! there's a pile of feed sacks out in the barn that wont mop up the drool I'm losing.

VERY NICE PIECE Mr. Green.

This is a rough one. As much as I would like to keep it, it would just live in an unseen place for most of it's life.

I collect Smiths, Rugers and Marlins. Being able to transition this one will allow me to pick up some that I have been working to find.

My goal it to sell it in the most respectful way in hopes of it finding a home in a great Winchester collection while finding the appropriate value to the market.

My greatest thanks to all that have commented, assisted or shared interest.

Regards

Hi MrGreen, I gave you a call but I forgot 2 or 3 hr time change. I have a very good friend in Idaho that I buy Drents Partridge Hound dogs from, his wife brought the last male to GA and I met them at the International terminal in Atlanta to pick the female up from Holland. I left you a voice mail, call when you get a chance. very best WinPoor

I would certainly deface and devalue this fine weapon were I to buy it Mr. Green, a 20X Lyman Super Targetspot in appropriate [period correct] mounting hardware would be utilized and the weapon would be fired as intended, I couldn't resist it.

Man, chop and flute that barrel, stick it in a Micky and cerakote it, and that's one hel of an elk killin machine

I made a weak attempt at humor when I posted that the bolt was inserted into the receiver.
This rifle has been around the world but its not the same as an unopened NIB.
Is it of less value because of that?
Not in my opinion but then again I'm not in the running to buy it.
Land that package for sale in western Canada and I'm not going home without it.

I think I have traded with this fine gentleman on this crate gun. Im giving a K more than I wanted but maybe I will be around long enough to get it back, I have my eyes on a 30 power Mitchell that would look real good sitting on top of this classic bad boy! very best WinPoor

Congrats Winpoor!

Top notch post. If it's going to winpoor, you'll know it's going to a good Winchester family. It will fit in very nicely with his collection. Be warned though, he'll be slapping on a scope and trying that rifle out... I don't think it will be in the crate for very long. The crate will probably end up in his barn somewhere, probably next to the feed sacks and rolls of barbed wire...

Blasphemous!!! Save the elk killin machine treatment for the ones that have already been defaced and defiled.... Once that happens, it's game on... ....Let the elk killins begin!!!!

It'd make a nice donor..

No kidding BSA, I'd be in enough trouble for just shooting it, "Gitem" A LOT worse trouble.

Congrats on a fine acquisition Winchesterpoor.

Congratulations, Winpoor!!

The crate gun is not home yet. Im giving him what we agreed on but he wants till Sunday to smoke it over! That is fine, I want a three day ,non shoot look see as well! very best WinPoor

Good luck Steve.

Good luck Steve.

Geezus rosco!

To be perfectly honest I would not know what to do with this crate and it's contents if it belonged to me. I guess I would sell it too. Damn I wish that 10mm Ruger revolver with 6.5" barrel didn't have extra cylinder box and papers so I could buy it. Man, to a shooter ANIB stuff really sucks!

NIB or NI crate does not bother me one bit! My 7th removed uncle is Stonewall Jackson,of Civil War fame.. If I could get my hands on his gun I would clean it up a shoot hell out of it! very best WinPoor

It does the soul good to have a couple of 'special' rifles....whether or not one chooses to shoot them is a different matter.

Winchester lovers, I may well leave it in the crate and use it to try and find the crate bull gun in 300 win mag I let get away 10 or 15 years ago as I thought 2K was just to much money on a bull gun! very best WinPoor

The winpoor I know is going to take that rifle out of the crate and shoot the sob....

Winchesterpoor: I have been busy three mountain ranges east of here, chasing guns and lost track of this thread for a day or two.
I am so happy you are acquiring this woderful Rifle.
If you dare shoot it I will Hunt YOU down, and, well YOU KNOW!
IF... you insist on soothing your soul (ego?) by shooting an old, cool, 300 H&H Bull Gun then mosey on up to SW Montana and we will take out my first year manufactured, mint condition, "300 Magnum" and under my strict supervision you can fire this 78 year old Rifle.
There have been MANY dozens of instances in my long gun collecting past when I gave MORE money for a firearm than I wanted - as of today I don't resent any one of those investments/purchases.
Granted, I don't recall ever giving "a K" more than I thought a gun was worth at the time.
Take pleasure in pride of ownership of that Rifle - offending its status by taking it out and shooting it is blasphemy - I am sure.
Again good for you.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
P.S.: Long live the Riflemans Rifle.

You Win Varmint Guy! The gun is going to be delivered to a good pal in Idaho that I get my Drents Partridge Hounds from, I will not even see the gun till the next litter happens and Im taking my 12 yr old nephew out to pick the pup and gun up then. I may swing by you and shoot yours so as not to commit the sin! If I can track the 300 win mag Bull gun I let get away several years ago, that is going to be a different story! thanks the most, I do have a soul but dont have an ego!..... LMAZZO very best WinPoor

Varmint Guy and I go back many years, I met he and a good friend name Dutch on a web site called WSSM zone as I bought a .25wssm coyote lite on a fluke, that gun has counted for untold whitetails and coyotes, I also bought a truck gun in .223 wssm that was a truck gun as I was having trouble with a black headed buzzards pecking the eyes out of baby calves hanging halfway out the Moma cows, I tried calling fish and game as one eyed purebred calves do not sell very well! long story short that .223wssm was a 2 shot wonder, it had a thin barrel and shot 3 wandered off like a drunk! The black headed buzzards figured out real quick when the big white GMC pulled in pasture during calving season something was about to explode! The red and blue headed buzzards that I grew up with were no problem at all! They wait on road kill or something to die before they do their job,the black headed ones are very aggresive, they weigh about a lb and half less than the turkey vulture, again I have no problem with the turkey vulture at all.... good guys! I still have both those wssm jobs and both are accurate, I shot later ones that were true POS, Winchester let some late stuff out the door with no QC at all!!! I was lucky. Ammo is getting hard to find, I bought a case of the 110 gr accubond .25wssms and a case of the 64 gr .223 wssms so Im set for life, the .223wssm has 250K miles in the back seat of my feed up truck,cold dirty bore it will shoot eyes out for 2 shots.... very best WinPoor

Here is something one does not see everyday.

.30-06 target rifle

Dreadfully expensive, but one would be like the 'White Feather' fella.

BINGO, Slavek! I have a stilth mount that would work great on that bad boy or an 8X Unertl! Had I not just broke the bank on the crate gun that one would have to come to SW GA.... Anybody need a BASS boat with less than 50 hrs? LMAZZO very best WinPoor

Dog Dam you Slavek , did you have to post that! Jeeze ,very best WinPoor
No worry, that gun sold 2 years ago, I just talked to ex owner! WinPoor

That rifle was nice. I liked that 24" heavy tapering barrel.

Slavek, My favorite gun that will be the gun they prob. push off in the hole with me at the end is one just like the one you posted except mine is a 56' that was factory D&T, it has target stamped in trigger, clip slotted but I have it in a bedded low comb stock. If I do my part it will cloverleaf groups all day. I check zero and nail whitetails with it using Winchester 168 gr blackbox ammo or Hornady M1 Match ammo loaded with 168 gr a maxes at a slow 2700 ft/sec. I will not hunt any woodstocked pre 64's in real bad weather, I grab the synthetic stocked guns for that and clean as soon as I take the deer to the barn. Varmint guy fusses at me about the pre 64's but trust me they all get great care! very best winpoor

Another Winchester mod 70 target I wish I had not sold!

very best WinPoor (bottom gun is the one I sold for a whopping 1100 bucks!)

Congrats Winpoor on a very nice adoption. This combined with Eric's M70 that belonged to Roger Rule are two of the nicest rifles I have seen in a very long time.

Once while contemplating dropping a large pile of hard earned dollars on a Parker 28ga a friend told me "you can pay to early but never to much for a quality firearm". I wouldn't worry about the extra K in the overall scheme of things.

Have you ever used the 75gr Hornaday V-Max in your 25WSSM? It's awesome in my Cooper.

GSPfan, My gun shoots the 110 accubonds(black box) and 120gr PEP (grey box superX) so well I have never hand loaded, I also have 50 Berger 115 VLDs that I have not loaded and tried yet that are supposed to be the bomb once you get the OAL set up!, thanks for the tip, I will give them a try! very best WinPoor

My Cooper is a Varmint model so I have only used the lighter bullets. It's deadly out to 400 yards on Prarie dogs but I have to admit a hit at that distance is more luck than skill. I have used the 110gr Accubond in my 257 Roberts with great success.

Mr Varmint guy, Its all I can do to keep this ole gal in the crate!It made its way to my gunsmith FFL in Tallahassee FL Friday late.. I have a box of 180 accubonds and 185gr berger vld's burning a dog damn hole in my gun safe along with a one piece redfield jr base and rings that I always wondered what I would do with and a 36X leupold !!!! Between all the odd ball parts and bullets this thing sure is calling my name!!! My gunsmith and FFL says I can't have my own dam gun!!! He knows I rather shoot this thing than watch the super bowl...Its safe till Monday at least..Out of 3 pre 64 mod 70's from this Idaho collection the 95% 338 win mag is the only one he will let me bring home and thats due to the fact they know I have no 338 win mag ammo.. very best all WinPoor

Bingo, I just found 120 rounds of Winchester 230 gr fail safe ammo in Tallahassee, any of you guys shoot this ammo in their 338 win mag? thanks and very best WinPoor

Check out what I found on GunBroker.com! https://www.gunbroker.com/item/783667653

I had a bull gun. Near new, hell of a big rifle. Bull guns don’t move well. Randy Shuman had one for years that was new in the crate. I don’t know if he ever moved it. I traded mine for a new Cooper 264.

Good luck on your sale.