#2284301 - 06/30/08 09:11 AM
Dip & Pack Costs?
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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Just received a payment request to begin preparing my trophies taken a few weeks ago in the Eastern Cape, RSA. They want $740. for 6 animals (5 capes), of which $175. is for "paperwork" ??? I only paid $250. 4 yrs ago for 10 trophies I took in Namibia. They are also estimating a 3-4 month "turnabout" time before delivery to a shipping agent. I received my trophies from Namibia in less than 4 months.
Is this out of line?
Can I realistically do anything about it if it is?
Thanks for any comments.
Chuck
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#2284354 - 06/30/08 09:50 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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tbear
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Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 1621
Loc: Reston, Va.
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I'm having my taxidermy done in South Africa. This eliminates the dip costs. I am planning on ocean shipment to Port of Baltimore, Md. & to receive myself.
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I eat Spam & I can focus a scope
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#2284374 - 06/30/08 10:02 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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pinotguy
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Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 441
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It seems that all costs for Hunting Safaris have increased, so it's natural for the Dip & Pack expenses to have gone up as well. Did you take any CITES-listed animals? If you did, that may explain the "Paperwork" fee and added delays. Also, RSA may have different laws (and corresponding expenses) than Namibia, that govern Trophy exportation. To be honest, that quote seems fairly reasonable. I just saw a post over on AR where the shipping fees have really gone through the roof, especially for mounted trophies.
Not sure about any recourse you may have. If you used a booking agent, you might contact them to see if they can help. You may also want to contact the safari operator/PH to see what they can do. I doubt they'll be of much assistance at this point because their liability and responsibility usually ends at the point in which the trophies are delivered to the Dip & Pack firm.
As costs (Dip & Pack, shipping, and taxidermy) and the hassles involved (bureaucracy, instability (see Zim.), etc.) have increased, I wonder if American sportsmen, who hunt in Africa, will start thinking twice about trying to get their trophies exported. The head-aches associated with this now, make it seem to be more than what most people are willing to deal with, or can afford. (I'll be in Namibia next year and I'm leaning toward NOT dealing with Trophies but taking a ton of photos.)
Hopefully, everything works out well for you. Most likely, you'll just have to wait things out and pay the costs.
_________________________
I'm becoming more tolerant of intolerant people.
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#2284424 - 06/30/08 10:28 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: pinotguy]
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medicman
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Registered: 11/17/07
Posts: 327
Loc: Ontario Canada
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Tell me if you can what dip and pack actually is. Is it tanning as well? Would it not be beneficial to have mounting done where the animals naturally occurr so anatomical correctness is maintained? I am a novice to trophy prep, not only in Africa but also in North America.
Randy
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#2284437 - 06/30/08 10:35 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: tbear]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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tbear,
The place doing the prep is a taxidermy shop, the owner of which is good friends with my PH. When it became obvious I wasn't going to have the mounts done by them I was wondering if that influenced their packing prices. I have a couple friends who are taxidermists here in the US, and quite frankly, the work I've seen done in RSA doesn't come close to the quality done here. As it has been explained to me, the African shops simply don't have the quality of raw materials nor the skilled labor available to them that U.S. shops have. Plus the difference in shipping costs were significant for me.
Do appreciate your comments though, and am aware many hunters choose to do the same as you.
Thanks!
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#2284452 - 06/30/08 10:47 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: pinotguy]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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pinotguy,
Thanks for your thoughts.
No CITES animals. 1 Cape Kudu, 1 Blk Wildebeest, 2 Impala (1 cape), 2 Cape Bushbuck.
The post on AR mentions high "shipping" fees, which were not included in my price for prep. I fully expect to pay a substantially higher fee for shipping, due to increased fuel prices, etc.
Normally, I would have checked these costs ahead of time, but as you mention, things are a bit unstable in Africa right now. My hunt was originally scheduled for Buff in Zim, which was cancelled causing me to substitute this hunt at the last minute. Since the Dip & Pack was arranged by my PH, I would consider going to him for some relief, but wanted to hear the experiences of others to see if the prices warranted a complaint.
Thanks again,
Chuck
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#2284481 - 06/30/08 11:10 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: medicman]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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Randy,
Dip & Pack involves removing all excess material (meat, etc.) from the hides and skulls, drying and "dipping" the hides in chemicals to prevent their destruction by moisture or bugs, as well as partial "bleaching" of the skulls. Then the wrap to prevent breakage and "Pack" in an govt approved box (usually very heavy, waxed cardboard). Arrangement is then made to have box delivered to or picked up by international shipping agent.
The items are already tagged with my name, Custom's Broker address, as well as address for tannery in U.S. where the Broker will deliver to. Trophy report paperwork was already filled out by myself and the PH for the gov't report. I may be wrong but the only paperwork the SA taxidermist should be doing is a shipping label and the bill they sent me.
As to having the mounting done here or in Africa, I've made a few comments above but my basic understanding is the cost for taxidermy is cheaper in Africa, the shipping costs are naturally higher. Question of comparison and personal opinion as to quality. In my opinion, most of the work I've seen done in U.S. has been a step above that done in Africa, whether the taxidermist has ever been to Africa or not.
Thanks,
Chuck
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#2284482 - 06/30/08 11:10 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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atkinson
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Registered: 03/04/01
Posts: 1326
Loc: Filer, Idaho, USA
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Your pricing is in line...Like everything else costs go up..bought any fuel lately?
All animals must go through the dip and pack phase, else they don't make it into the USA, its a sterialization process of sorts. they are dipped in a vat of Hydrogen Peroxide and something else to kill the bugs and germs, whatever..
I always suggest to my clientele to have all your taxidermy done in the USA, where you have some contact with your taxidermist. it might save you a trip to Africa and you may never see your trophies again if something goes wrong on the Africa end...As to cost? well shipping on those big mounted trophies is sky high and you have not saved a dime, it about evens out. I can't tell you the number of times a client has called me and held me responsible for the high cost of shipping his trophies home..I refer him to my email telling him not to have his taxidermy work done in Africa for that very reason, he did not listen and I am not going to accept the blame..He checks and either apoligises or I never hear from him again..
Just suggesting that you be aware of the pitfalls of African taxidermy, wheather you want to agree or not is up to you..and yes taxidermy problems can happen in the USA, but you live here and its easier to handle sometimes...
Edited by atkinson (06/30/08 11:12 AM)
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Ray Atkinson
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#2284489 - 06/30/08 11:20 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: atkinson]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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Ray,
I was typing as you wrote your reply, and am thrilled to death that my statements agree with yours!
I have no intention of having the taxidermy done in RSA.
I'm more than willing to pay the necessary fees for required work, but since I wasn't able to check out the costs before the trip I'm just asking opinions from more experienced folks such as yourself.
I really appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge.
Chuck
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#2284555 - 06/30/08 12:07 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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JJHACK
Campfire Guide
Registered: 01/30/01
Posts: 4252
Loc: Touchet Wa. & Ellisras South ...
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Namibia does not have the same strict regulations that RSA has. RSA has made the decision to eliminate any possible chance of infestation from bugs/disease into the USA. This works while the specimens are in the control of the taxidermist, but it's out of control after they are shipped. Often the staging area at the airport/ warehouse is filled with crates that may have infestation which can transfer between crates. The use of good treated wood reduces this cross contamination almost completely.
They also now require certified and treated wood products for the crates( additional expense). Namibia will allow you to take the semi dried skins home in your checked bags, or in a seperate box. They don't require the same regulations for capes, skins, and horns to leave their country.
It stands to reason that the cost would not be even close for a country that has very strict regulations to control the future of the hunting industry, VS a country that has almost no regulations on taking trophies out.
Imagine a guy showing up at customs with a burlap sack inside a cardboard box filled with salted hides. Then they check and find out one has hoof and mouth contamination. What's gonna happen to every crate coming from that country? Remember the Mad-cow in Canada? They would not let me bring in 400pounds of Elk meat from a certified butcher in Alberta. All meat imports were stopped from Canada. Imagine if that had been a country in Africa. You can bet all incoming shipments will be tied up for years to come.
RSA is doing everything possible to eliminate that possibility from coming up. Unfortunately this safety process is not fast, free, or even cheap. It does however insure the future of contamination free raw exports from their country!
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#2284603 - 06/30/08 12:41 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: JJHACK]
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safariman
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Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 4487
Loc: Walla Walla Washington USA / Z...
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JJ;
Welcome back! We (or at least I....) missed you around here. Looking forward to a report on this years adventures. MARK
_________________________
When you are but 50 feet from an animal that can stomp you into mud puddle, or shred you into fajitas, rest assured that he will have your undivided attention! Words of a former safari booking agent, now a happy Africa loving rifle looney!
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#2284612 - 06/30/08 12:50 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: safariman]
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Labman95
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Registered: 06/21/01
Posts: 139
Loc: Wayne, PA USA
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Good to hear from you Jim. Come on now - we're all waiting to hear how things went this year in RSA.
Tom Z
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#2284633 - 06/30/08 01:07 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: Labman95]
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JJHACK
Campfire Guide
Registered: 01/30/01
Posts: 4252
Loc: Touchet Wa. & Ellisras South ...
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I don't want to re-direct the content of this thread so I'll start a new one.
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#2284690 - 06/30/08 01:43 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: JJHACK]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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JJ,
Thank you for taking the time to reply.
It appears I may be presenting myself as overly critical of the SA costs. Rather, with my limited experience and lack of specific knowledge relative to this particular last-minute hunt,
I am merely looking for some reassurance from those such as yourself.
I'm not sure of your dealings in Namibia, but found my (and friends) shipments from there have arrived in perfect shape in record time. On the other hand, I'm familiar with several shipments arriving from SA that were useless due to infestation. Again, not trying to offer any generalizations about either country, as I'm sure things vary more between outfitters/shippers/taxidermists than they do between the two countries.
Anyway, you have certainly justified the billed price for me and I plan to proceed with the payment, etc.
I do recall the ban on importation of wild game meat from Canada, it caused us to cancel a moose hunt.
Look forward to reading your hunt report from this season.
Regards,
Chuck
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#2285713 - 07/01/08 04:36 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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tbear
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 1621
Loc: Reston, Va.
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I agree with every one that the taxidermy work in South Africa is not "generally" as good as that done in America. I have always paid a dip & ship fee( including air shipment), hired a import agent & had the work done in the US. I'm getting on in years & in the future most of my mounts(over 50) will end up being donated or trashed. I am a fair judge of taxidermy & I carefully examined the work done on his mounts. I would rate about a 9 with 10 being the best in the US. I am using ocean shipment & receiving my self at the Port of Baltimore. I expect that this will result in a substantial lower over all cost. I'm in no hurry & my trophy room is full so I will have to move some existing mounts for the new stuff.
_________________________
I eat Spam & I can focus a scope
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#2286169 - 07/01/08 10:27 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: tbear]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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tbear,
Sounds like you found a good shop in SA and a great plan to get them home w/ the best deal for you. Ocean shipment is not an option for me (direct anyway) and I get a break on costs from my taxidermy friend so this works best for me. Hopefully others reading these posts can learn about all the possible options to look at.
I actually do mostly skull mounts as I have no room for 5 heads much less 50 but I shot a really big So. Impala and a nice Blk Wildebeest this time so I'd like to have shoulder mounts done.
Thanks again!
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#2286890 - 07/01/08 05:45 PM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: elkjaeger]
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tbear
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 1621
Loc: Reston, Va.
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I thought Montana had a lot of beach front property for sale around Missoula.
_________________________
I eat Spam & I can focus a scope
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#2287834 - 07/02/08 09:01 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: tbear]
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hatari
Campfire Regular
Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 1381
Loc: Atlanta
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I've had taxidermy done both here and in RSA. It has generally alsways been a waiting game in either venue, and no real savings having it done in RSA. They charge US fees to US hunters.
FWIW, I now have it done here, and am mounting fewer trophies these days.
_________________________
"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid." Han Solo
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#2287861 - 07/02/08 09:16 AM
Re: Dip & Pack Costs?
[Re: tbear]
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elkjaeger
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Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 210
Loc: Montana
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Naw, that Missoula stuff's all gone now, but if you're willing to settle for something around the North Dakota border.......
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