#2289712 - 07/03/08 07:55 AM
Nation of Airheads?
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peepsight3006
Campfire Guide
Registered: 10/10/06
Posts: 2854
Loc: Utah
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Give me your 2 cents worth! We all know that a large percentage junior high and high school students can't seem to master the multiplication tables, order of operations, percents and other simple, basic, math concepts. We rank in the BOTTOM third of developed nations on tests of these concepts and our kids can't even pass the tests to graduate without a tutor and a couple of wasted summers to get them to the MINIMUM skill levels.
We all have our axe to grind, but what are your thoughts about why this is, and how would you fix it?
Wayne
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#2289717 - 07/03/08 07:56 AM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: peepsight3006]
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BMT
Campfire Outfitter
Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 9559
Loc: Long Tom, Oregon
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School vouchers . . . .
BMT
_________________________
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II
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#2289719 - 07/03/08 07:56 AM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: BMT]
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BMT
Campfire Outfitter
Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 9559
Loc: Long Tom, Oregon
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Oh, and my tag line would help:
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II
How many of these kids just need real parents.
BMT
_________________________
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II
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#2289731 - 07/03/08 08:02 AM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: peepsight3006]
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LeonHitchcox
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Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 454
Loc: Pikeville, TN
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I am a teacher (34 yrs.) and I have seen a downward spiral in student performance over the past 20 years. Lots of factors- video games instead of studying, emphasis on pop culture at the expense of the basics, students who will only exert themselves if the see a short term benefit. The breakdown of the family. When I started teaching, most of the students had 2 parent homes. Now I see mothers with no husband, but 2 or 3 kids, all with different last names. The schools are now being hit with an influx of drug babies who have learning disorders. ADD and ADHD are regularly diagnosed ( I personally think that ADD and ADHD are excuses to medicate rather than actual med problems). I could go on.
Leon
Edited by LeonHitchcox (07/03/08 08:03 AM)
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#2290389 - 07/03/08 02:23 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: LeonHitchcox]
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PJGunner
Campfire Regular
Registered: 06/14/05
Posts: 1075
Loc: Tucson AZ
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"ADD and ADHD are regularly diagnosed ( I personally think that ADD and ADHD are excuses to medicate rather than actual med problems). I could go on."
When I was in school, (mid 1940s) I was just considered an overactive kid. So overactive that I got kicked out of several schools. One grammer, one Jr. High, (We didn't call the the PC name middle school) and high school twice. In this day and age, they'd have me so doped up you'd have thought I was a zombie.
Naw, I wasn't all that bad really. Just a wild and crazy kid full of life. These days, that's intolerable.
Paul B.
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#2290397 - 07/03/08 02:30 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: PJGunner]
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Bristoe
Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 10/12/05
Posts: 15065
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It's because of pencils being imported from China.
Back in the day, American students did their work with a gen-u-ine Dixon Ticonderoga #2, made from the finest Balsam Fir trees on earth,... or possibly a Cedar Mirado Black Warrior for dress occasions.
It's just another cost of globalization.
_________________________
Among the worst aspects of the collapse of traditional conservatism is that my children will grow up in a world in which vulgar and belligerent nationalism will be presented to them as the alternative to leftism.
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#2290404 - 07/03/08 02:34 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: Bristoe]
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T LEE
Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/20/01
Posts: 24603
Loc: Punta Gorda, FL
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Kids of my and earlier generations were taught HOW to LEARN as well as the basic "3 R's". Lots fewer distractions and real full time parents too.
_________________________
It's not about surviving the storm,
it's about learnin' to dance in the rain.
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#2290405 - 07/03/08 02:34 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: LeonHitchcox]
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Ivan
Campfire Regular
Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 812
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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I am a teacher (34 yrs.) and I have seen a downward spiral in student performance over the past 20 years. Lots of factors- video games instead of studying, emphasis on pop culture at the expense of the basics, students who will only exert themselves if the see a short term benefit. The breakdown of the family. When I started teaching, most of the students had 2 parent homes. Now I see mothers with no husband, but 2 or 3 kids, all with different last names. The schools are now being hit with an influx of drug babies who have learning disorders. ADD and ADHD are regularly diagnosed ( I personally think that ADD and ADHD are excuses to medicate rather than actual med problems). I could go on.
Leon
Yup. Where has the parenting gone?
Can't blame it on society, but I do believe there are cultural factors (again goes back to parenting). There's no shortage of Asian and Indian kids who have no problem performing and over achieving.
_________________________
"Of all the rest of mankind, make him thy friend who distinguishes himself by his virtue." - Pythagoras
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#2290406 - 07/03/08 02:35 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: Bristoe]
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Ivan
Campfire Regular
Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 812
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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It's because of pencils being imported from China.
Back in the day, American students did their work with a gen-u-ine Dixon Ticonderoga #2, made from the finest Balsam Fir trees on earth,... or possibly a Cedar Mirado Black Warrior for dress occasions.
It's just another cost of globalization.
LOL!
_________________________
"Of all the rest of mankind, make him thy friend who distinguishes himself by his virtue." - Pythagoras
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#2290444 - 07/03/08 03:00 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: Ivan]
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Henry McCann
Campfire Regular
Registered: 11/14/01
Posts: 643
Loc: Montana
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Just what Leon said...I was in the schools for a few years and my wife is still a music teacher 5th thru 12th. Lots of drugs, teen pregnancy, abuse, Fetal Alcohol kids in the rez school we were at.
Now in a rural farming community, many kids with 2 parents, the kids aren't expected to work in school. A very strong sense of entitlement; cell phone at 10, nice car at 16, lots of spending money, and no expectations, except play sports. Parents in the faces of coaches and teachers, if there is any trouble, because their kid is never at fault.
If parents were actively involved in the academics of their kids, and had high expectations and consequences, 99% of the problems and lack of achievement would disappear.
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#2290515 - 07/03/08 03:45 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: LeonHitchcox]
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Birdwatcher
Campfire Tracker
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 6639
Loc: San Antonio TX
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I personally think that ADD and ADHD are excuses to medicate rather than actual med problems
+1
I have a stereotypical "ADD kid" parent in mind: An overweight mom who talks a lot and who considers little Johnny's exuberant and mischevious little boy behavior to be a medical condition.
I'm sure that there are some kids who need it, but for the most part I have come to despise ritalin.
As for the rest of it, the same educational trends seem to be happening all over.
I will say this, I graduated from an American high school in the '70's after attending British public schools where we took Latin and they beat us regularly with leather straps. American high schools were a breeze by comparison.
Neither were kids genuises back then, but back then it was far more economically feasible to be a dropout than it is today.
Birdwatcher
_________________________
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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#2290545 - 07/03/08 04:03 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: Henry McCann]
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grouseman
Campfire Regular
Registered: 08/29/02
Posts: 1204
Loc: Manitoba
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Dumb it down, bigger classes, no standardised testing, no failing allowed, focus on 'self esteem' rather than actual knowledge. Lots.
I blame the communists.
_________________________
It takes a village to raise an idiot.
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#2290552 - 07/03/08 04:05 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: Birdwatcher]
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Rock Chuck
Campfire Guide
Registered: 01/05/06
Posts: 4713
Loc: Filer, ID
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My brother in law teaches at a Christian school in north Idaho. They teach the classics, including Latin. They avoid the PC crap taught in public schools. One year, several years ago, Idaho had 8 national merit scholarship winners. 6 of them came from this school.
_________________________
Keep guns out of the wrong hands...a criminal in prison doesn't have a gun
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#2290560 - 07/03/08 04:12 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: peepsight3006]
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5sdad
Campfire Guide
Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 3690
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Lots of good thoughts expressed. I lean very heavily to what Henry McCann had to say. There is too much acceptance of "not getting it" in education. Schools need to set a course of study, teachers need to present the material, and students need to learn the material. The way it stands now, when a student does not do what is necessary to learn the material great uproar takes place and all sorts of reasons (excuses for the student) are conjured up. Plain and simple, the student needs to take responsibility for learning. Life needs to be good for the student when it happens and perhaps a bit less good when it doesn't.
_________________________
Not a real member - just an ordinary guy who appreciates being able to hang around and say something once in awhile.
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#2290571 - 07/03/08 04:24 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: 5sdad]
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ConradNY
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 1808
Loc: Endicott, NY, USA
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ADD and ADHD are real. The meds for kids does not make them "drugged" it just lets them function better.
Things responsible for decline in performance:
1) Teachers using unproven techniques to teach children. Such as bilingual education.
2) Huge number of unmarried and divorced parents.
3) Not taking responsiblity for own failures. Its societies fault, racisim, etc.
4) Teachers treating children like babies. They cant walk along a busy street etc.
5) Acceptance of gang culture in society.
_________________________
Peace through Superior Firepower.
If you want peace then prepare for war.
If you want war then pursue peace and disarm.
If you want to lose a war then put a Democrat in charge.
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#2290593 - 07/03/08 04:43 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: peepsight3006]
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DesertSandman
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 05/17/03
Posts: 1856
Loc: The West
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I received this a few months back - I'd like to see a current high school Senior pass this 8th Grade test circa 1895;
What it took to get an 8th grade education in 1895...
Remember when grandparents and great-grandparents stated that they 'only' had an 8th grade education? Well, check this out. Could any of us have passed the 8th grade in 1895?
This is the eighth-grade final exam from 1895 in Salina , Kansas , USA . It was taken from the original document on file at the Smokey Valley Genealogical Society and Library in Salina , and reprinted by the Salina Journal.
8th Grade Final Exam: Salina , KS -1895
Grammar (Time, one hour)
1. Give nine rules for the use of capital letters.
2. Name the parts of speech and define those that have no modifications.
3. Define verse, stanza and paragraph
4. What are the principal parts of a verb? Give principal parts of 'lie,''play,' and 'run.'
5. Define case; illustrate each case.
6 What is punctuation? Give rules for principal marks of punctuation.
7 - 10. Write a composition of about 150 words and show therein that you understand the practical use of the rules of grammar.
Arithmetic (Time,1 hour 15 minutes)
1. Name and define the Fundamental Rules of Arithmetic.
2. A wagon box is 2 ft. deep, 10 feet long, and 3 ft. wide. How many bushels of wheat will it hold?
3. If a load of wheat weighs 3,942 lbs., what is it worth at 50cts/bushel, deducting 1,050 lbs. for tare?
4. District No 33 has a valuation of $35,000. What is the necessary levy to carry on a school seven months at $50 per month, and have $104 for incidentals?
5. Find the cost of 6,720 lbs. coal at $6.00 per ton.
6. Find the interest of $512.60 for 8 months and 18 days at 7 percent.
7. What is the cost of 40 boards 12 inches wide and 16 ft. long at $20 per metre?
8. Find bank discount on $300 for 90 days (no grace) at 10 percent.
9. What is the cost of a square farm at $15 per acre, the distance of which is 640 rods?
10. Write a Bank Check, a Promissory Note, and a Receipt
U.S. History (Time, 45 minutes)
1. Give the epochs into which U.S. History is divided
2. Give an account of the discovery of America by Columbus .
3. Relate the causes and results of the Revolutionary War.
4. Show the territorial growth of the United States
5. Tell what you can of the history of Kansas .
6. Describe three of the most prominent battles of the Rebellion.
7. Who were the following: Morse, Whitney, Fulton , Bell , Lincoln , Penn, and Howe?
8. Name events connected with the following dates: 1607, 1620, 1800, 1849, 1865.
Orthography (Time, one hour) [Do we even know what this is??]
1. What is meant by the following: alphabet, phonetic, orthography, etymology, syllabication
2. What are elementary sounds? How classified?
3. What are the following, and give examples of each: trigraph, subvocals, diphthong, cognate letters, linguals
4. Give four substitutes for caret 'U.' (HUH?)
5 Give two rules for spelling words with final 'e.' Name two exceptions under each rule.
6. Give two uses of silent letters in spelling. Illustrate each.
7. Define the following prefixes and use in connection with a word: bi, dis, mis, pre, semi, post, non, inter, mono, sup.
8. Mark diacritically and divide into syllables the following, and name the sign that indicates the sound: card, ball, mercy, sir, odd, cell, rise, blood, f are, last.
9. Use the following correctly in sentences: cite, site, sight, fane, fain, feign, vane , vain, vein, raze, raise, rays.
10. Write 10 words frequently mispronounced and indicate pronunciation by use of diacritical marks and by syllabication.
Geography (Time, one hour)
1 What is climate? Upon what does climate depend?
2. How do you account for the extremes of climate in Kansas ?
3. Of what use are rivers? Of what use is the ocean?
4. Describe the mountains of North America
5. Name and describe the following: Monrovia , Odessa , Denver , Manitoba , Hecla , Yukon , St. Helena, Juan Fernandez, Aspinwall and Orinoco ..
6. Name and locate the principal trade centers of the U.S.
7. Name all the republics of Europe and give the capital of each.
8. Why is the Atlantic Coast colder than the Pacific in the same latitude?
9. Describe the process by which the water of the ocean returns to the sources of rivers. 10. Describe the movements of the earth. Give the incl ination of the earth.
Notice that the exam took FIVE HOURS to complete.
Gives the saying 'he only had an 8th grade education' a whole new meaning, doesn't it?!
Also shows you how poor our parenting has become regarding support of teachers, and how our politically correct and mollycoddling education system has teachers hands tied. Imagine what would happen today if a school passed out a test this difficult. All the students would whine and yell "at ain't fare" and pull their guns and run the teachers out of the building........ then their parents would organize a protest and file a lawsuit. The school board would fire the principal, and hire a new one who doesn't believe in giving grades because it's bad for the self esteem of the students that don't make high scores.
And no...I don't have the answers to the 1895 grade test.
_________________________
 Keep the Wind in your Face, Sun at your Back, & Silhouette in Shadows Know guns, know peace, know safety No guns, no peace, no safety
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#2290619 - 07/03/08 05:07 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: peepsight3006]
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dmazur
Campfire Regular
Registered: 09/10/07
Posts: 415
Loc: Pacific NW
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What a question!
My parents chose a place to live based on 1)quality of schools and 2)reasonable commute distance to work. I never appreciated how hard this must have been until many years later. For awhile, my dad had a 60 mile commute (1-way) because the job moved to an area that had bad public schools. Mom and the kids stayed where the schools were good and dad put up with the drive.
My sister appears to be continuing this tradition. She and her husband deliberately chose a house based on the school system. My nephews seem to be doing fine in school. One is into building robots. (I got him a Mattel robot chassis a few years ago and I think he's outgrown that.) The other is involved in music. Both read everything they can get their hands on, with support from their parents.
The only thing she's doing wrong, IMO, is ignoring hunting and fishing. My parents ignored this, too. (I picked it up from a friend's dad...) So, she has a couple of smart kids, but they are just not interested in anything that isn't technical or urban. Maybe they'll have an epiphany when they are adults. 
So, even though they both work, they've managed to instill the importance of an education and keep the kids pointed at something other than drugs and video games. I don't know how much negative "peer pressure" was involved. Maybe by choosing a good school system, they managed to duck a lot of that.
Best answer I can come up with? Spend time with your kids. Encourage learning. Discourage bad behavior. It apparently doesn't happen if you trust the school system, TV and video games to raise your kids for you.
_________________________
.30-06 Springfield: 100 yrs + and still going strong
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#2290786 - 07/03/08 06:42 PM
Re: Nation of Airheads?
[Re: dmazur]
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Archerhunter
Campfire Regular
Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 907
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"1) Teachers using unproven techniques to teach children. Such as bilingual education.
2) Huge number of unmarried and divorced parents.
3) Not taking responsiblity for own failures. Its societies fault, racisim, etc.
4) Teachers treating children like babies. They cant walk along a busy street etc.
5) Acceptance of gang culture in society."
+1
"ADD and ADHD are real. The meds for kids does not make them "drugged" it just lets them function better."
-1
_________________________
God Bless America! Despite what's about to happen.... . 
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