#2479350 - 10/05/08 05:19 PM
lost black bear
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Royce
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 12/28/03
Posts: 1623
Loc: zip code 59604
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This is not a very flattering story to tell about myself, but it's true.
Last Monday, a friend and I back packed into the mountains on an archery hunt for elk. Gary, on my right spotted a very large black bear paralleling us in the brush about 25 yards to our right, oblivious to our presence as he appeared to be following something.
Gary stopped, and I walked slightly behind the bear, trying to get to a tree I had picked out to use for a rest and in a place where the bear would be in less brush.
When I got to the tree, I rested on it, drew my 357 and spoke to the bear to stop him. He was broadside at 28 yards (lasered later) and shot a 158 grain Cast Core bullet for his chest. I had a steady rest and expected to kill him quickly.
At the shot, he whirled and ran. Something I hadn't known was that by going 50 yards or so, he was over a knoll and going down a very steep bank, in thick brush. The bank was steep and long enough so that he could have gone at least 300 yards just by rolling. The brush was thick enough so that I could have been within 20 feet of him and not seen him. I looked for him extensively that evening, and came back and looked more the next morning and never found him.
I didn't see any reaction at the shot, but I have fired fatal shots into other bears with no reaction to the shot.
This was a long freeking ways from being my proudest moment.
Fred
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#2479390 - 10/05/08 05:36 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Royce]
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Steelhead
Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 24772
Loc: SE AK
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If it helps you any, the only critter I ever lost was a black bear that ended up down a hillside in the thickest 2nd growth SE Alaska can throw at you.
_________________________
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#2479404 - 10/05/08 05:41 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Steelhead]
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Royce
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 12/28/03
Posts: 1623
Loc: zip code 59604
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Thanks
Since I am always running my mouth on here about ethics, thought it would be less than honest not to tell the truth on myself.
Fred
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#2479453 - 10/05/08 06:05 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Royce]
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muledeer
Campfire Tracker
Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 5227
Loc: Ketchikan, AK, USA
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Hunting can be a messy and imperfect business sometimes. It's unfortunate, but sometimes the end does not come out the way we want it to. The real test of your ethics was not whether you anchored the bear at the shot, but the amount of effort you put into recovering it.
I'd say you passed the test, though you didn't find the bear.
Dennis
_________________________
"The more you run over a dead cat, the flatter it gets."
"If you're asking me something technical, you may be looking for My Other Brother Darrell."
"It ain't foot-pounds that kills stuff -- it's broken body parts."
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#2480437 - 10/06/08 07:29 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: muledeer]
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krp
Member
Registered: 01/04/05
Posts: 63
Loc: Mesa Az
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I've seen black bears take up to 8 pistol rounds before they gave up the ghost, they can be very gritty. Nothing wrong with your ethics.
Kent
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#2480479 - 10/06/08 07:42 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: krp]
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rost495
Campfire Outfitter
Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 9864
Loc: La Grange, TX
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The only way to prevent the above is to never shoot. We know that ain't an option.
Sorry to hear about it, and i've btdt, not on a bear, but I know it can cause restless nights for a long time. Heck I know the deer I shot lived, but am still pissed about it to this day.
The others have said it, you passed the test.
Jeff
_________________________
Get as close as you can, but use your skills as required
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#2480529 - 10/06/08 08:09 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: rost495]
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Klikitarik
Campfire Guide
Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 2732
Loc: Alaska
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Did you consider using "Raven-Air" to get the aerial advantage in searching? Crows, ravens, and other scavengers can be very helpful, sometimes, for finding things - living or dead. The only question is whether they will be timely enough. In your case, perhaps a dog might be even better - even one that isn't a typical hunting dog.
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#2480551 - 10/06/08 08:23 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Klikitarik]
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Royce
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 12/28/03
Posts: 1623
Loc: zip code 59604
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Klikitarik
Yes, I used tried using "Raven Air" as an aid, but there was no activity.
And thanks to everyone for not breaking out the brickbats on me.
I believe that is the the last time I will ever try to shoot a bear with a 357 except under emergency conditions.
Fred
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#2480986 - 10/06/08 11:49 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Royce]
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tbear
Campfire Ranger
Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 1781
Loc: Reston, Va.
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Sorry for your misfortune. It appears to far away, but if legal a tracking dog "might" have recovered. Most likely, the bear may have traveled quite a distance before bedding down & dieing. Many on hunting sites take a "holier than thou" attitude, & never miss, or lose a wounded animal. Most that hunt a lot have had this occur. All we can do is minimize & learn from these occurrences.
_________________________
I eat Spam & I can focus a scope
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#2481146 - 10/06/08 01:00 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Royce]
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BC30cal
Campfire Regular
Registered: 05/30/07
Posts: 841
Loc: South Central BC
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Mr. Royce;
I’d like to send kudos sir, for your candor in talking about a hunt even though it went sideways.
I’ve been in on a few bears, not as many as some here to be sure, but enough to know they can be a wooly bugger to find. Add steep and deep country into the mix and it can be challenging for sure.
To my way of thinking, when you looked hard and then looked again in the morning, it shows character, so no rocks will be tossed your way from this side of the medicine line.
I wish that didn’t happen to us as hunters, but like the Ian Tyson song says, “wishin’ don’t make it so.”
Please let me say I hope all the best for you in the rest of your season.
Regards,
Dwayne
_________________________
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
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#2482804 - 10/07/08 06:21 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: BC30cal]
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JJHACK
Campfire Guide
Registered: 01/30/01
Posts: 4273
Loc: Touchet Wa. & Ellisras South ...
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WHen I guided with hounds I took a lot of cops from the midwest with their carry guns. After many years of seeing lots of handguns shooting bears I wrote an article published in several magazines about minimums needed for handguns with blackbears. Realize I've seen hundreds of bears shot by this point in my career. The 357magnum was not one of the preferred guns at that point. The minimum to crumple a black bear and stop him from getting lost was a 41 magnum or a 10MM semi-auto. This with quickly expanding bullets, NEVER hardcast bullets on black bears. I have nothing to add to your loss other then to say thanks for posting this, as it is another independant result that proves the point about the 357 magnum being to small to hunt big game with and getting 100% successful results.
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#2483092 - 10/07/08 08:36 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: JJHACK]
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Jeff_O
Campfire Outfitter
Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 7547
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
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Royce, thanks for telling the truth. I think you are correct about not using a .357 for that particular task anymore.
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More wag. Less bark.
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#2483991 - 10/07/08 05:21 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Jeff_O]
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Brad
Campfire 'Bwana
Registered: 10/31/00
Posts: 10955
Loc: Bozeman, MT USA
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I think the 357 is perfectly fine... it's about shot placement and the actual projectile used.
But then I consider a handgun a POS for anything except stopping a human being intent on harm.
Even then I'd rather have a shotgun...
_________________________
"In all perfectly beautiful objects there is found the opposition of one part to another and a reciprocal balance"- John Ruskin
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#2484034 - 10/07/08 05:40 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Jeff_O]
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dulin
New Member
Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 9
Loc: Magnolia, De
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I agree with jjthack, a 357 mag is to small for big game and i also feel its propably to small even for a side carry in bear country. Bears are very tough animals and their vitals are incast by their thick shoulder bones. I just got back from a week long bear hunt in canada. We took two bears. the first bear was 150lbs. When the guide got it back to the camp to quater the meat, we found out that the front shoulder had been graced by a bullet and a chuck of bone was hanging in between the shoulder and the meat. That bear had a broken leg and the hunter did not even notice it when it walked in. Two days later, I shot a 290lb bear, I watched it for about 5 min. Once we got back to the camp the guided pointed out that my bear had been caught in a snar at one time and had broken its' foot to get out of the snar. Two toes where flip all the way back and one toe was complete gone. This bear was walking on a stub. The point is that bears are extremely strong animals and it takes a well placed bullet and the right type of fire arm. But, I am gald you took the time to look for the bear.
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#2484050 - 10/07/08 05:47 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: dulin]
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Steelhead
Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 24772
Loc: SE AK
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Figured this thread would turn funny.
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#2484055 - 10/07/08 05:50 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Brad]
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Maine_Rifle
Member
Registered: 09/11/07
Posts: 52
Loc: Maine
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Royce , I shot my first bear this year ... 30-06 ... 220 grain corelokt .... 15yards .
Broke the near shoulder , both lungs and shattered the top of the heart .
Barely broke stride and made it 30 yards into a cedar swamp I had a hard time walking into .
One critter that can take a hit and keep going .
Thanks for the honesty in print , most people don't like to deal with the reality of loosing game . Basically it the same old story " if you never "do" anything ... you never make any mistakes .... the doers live with the consequences . "
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#2485336 - 10/08/08 08:32 AM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Maine_Rifle]
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Redhawk1
Member
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 155
Loc: Delaware
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I have killed a few black bear all with hard cast bullets. I have never had a bear go further than 25 yards. Also, I would not use a 375 mag as a bear handgun, unless that was all I had at the time.
41 Mag and up for me with black bear. I like big holes.
_________________________
If you're going to make a hole, make it a big one.
Life member of the NRA
Endowment Member of the NRA
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#2485872 - 10/08/08 02:03 PM
Re: lost black bear
[Re: Redhawk1]
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talentrec
New Member
Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 3
Loc: Minnesota
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Three years ago I pounded the biggest black bear I've ever seen with a 450 Marlin on Price of Wales Island. The shot was was less than 50 yards and I hit him right behind the shoulder. He ran up the side of a very steep and very thick slope at the shot. We waited about 20 minutes and took up the trail. After about a half an hour of searching, we found him about 70 yards from where I first shot him. When we got up on him, he was laying on his side and still breathing occasionally. You could hear the sucking sound of the air going in his side.
Instead of just waiting another minute or two for him to die, I handed my rifle to my brother, walked up to about 10 feet from him and shot him in the neck with a .44 Special loaded with 240 gr. Keith Bullets (Buffalo Bore). At the shot, it was like someone hit him with a cattle prod. I had to dive out of the way as took off up the side of the mountain. We thought we heard him go down a few seconds later.
Two days later we were still searching. There no blood trail and the brush was so thick you could only see a couple of feet into it in most places.
Two hours before I shot mine, my brother shot one that had a 21 inch skull. This one looked to be at least 100 pounds bigger. But we'll never know as we never did find him.
Pete
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