#2487830 - 10/09/08 10:19 AM
.250-3000
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Golfswithwolves
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Registered: 11/10/05
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Does anybody have experience with the 117 grain bullet in this caliber? I was re-reading Koller's book "Shots at Whitetail" and see that he thought the 100 grain bullet was good but that he thought the 117 grainer was even better. My Savage 99 shoots 100 gr. Sierras very well with what I measure as a 1 in 9" twist (and has worked well on deer); I've not yet tried the heavier bullet. Would it be worthwhile to try to find some of the 117 grainers? Thanks if anybody has an opinion.
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#2487852 - 10/09/08 10:31 AM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Golfswithwolves]
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Bushwacker
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Registered: 08/15/03
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Loc: Colorado
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I did not have good luck in my three rifles with the 117's. They preferred the 100 Grain Sierra Pro-hunters much better and I couldn't get decent enough velocity out of the 117's. I save the 117's for the 257 Roberts where I can get good velocity to allow the bullet to open up at longer ranges. If you are shooting it in one if the newer Remingtons you can push the pressure with stouter loads and see what you get, but I won't hot rod my 99's or the Savage 1920 which is what mine are chambered in. Ryan
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#2487873 - 10/09/08 10:39 AM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Golfswithwolves]
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Lightfoot
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I take it your rifle is one of the newer ones above the 1 million serial number. The old guns were 1-14 twist, the newer ones would be 1-10. I know of at least 1 of the newer models that shoots 117s just fine. I never felt I needed the extra 17 grains but they oughta work fine.
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#2488442 - 10/09/08 03:59 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Lightfoot]
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Lee24
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It is not just the rate of twist, but the lower velocity that also is insufficient to impart enough angular momentum to quickly stabilize the bullet and keep them all on nearly the same path. If 100-gr shoot good in your rifle, use 100s.
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#2488506 - 10/09/08 04:26 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Lee24]
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toltecgriz
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Whitetails haven't changed much since Kohler's day, but bullets have. Finding a 100 grain (or less) that will outperform the old 117s is no problem.
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#2488510 - 10/09/08 04:27 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Lee24]
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78CJ
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It is not just the rate of twist, but the lower velocity that also is insufficient to impart enough angular momentum to quickly stabilize the bullet and keep them all on nearly the same path. If 100-gr shoot good in your rifle, use 100s.
????????
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#2488538 - 10/09/08 04:36 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: 78CJ]
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atkinson
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Registered: 03/04/01
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Loc: Filer, Idaho, USA
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My family and self have used the Remington Coreloklt factory ammo on both deer and elk and were very satisfied..We also used the old 100 gr. Silvertips and Corelokts. that was back in the late 40s and early 50s. I also used the 117 gr. Corelokt in the 257 Robts. which is about the same in factory ammo...My dad shot over 50 elk with the Savage 99 in 250-3000 and I don't recall him shooting one twice except for the coup de grace now and then.
In handloading I have found the 117 gr. bullet to take up quite a bit of powder space but could get an easy 2650 FPS and that is plenty of velocity to kill big animals if you stick it in the right spot. I found IMR-4320 to be an excellent powder as well as H414 in the 250. I limit my range on elk to about 200 yards and have had my best luck with RN bullets in the Mod. 99 as it has a rather short magazine space.
You get a lot of if ands and buts because the twist is different in the early rifles than the newer rifles and the 117 will "probably" shoot better in the later rifles but not Necessarily as I have seen many of the old guns shoot the 117 gr. Cordlokts plenty good for hunting. Remember a 3" group is fine for hunting and you will never know the difference contrary to popular belief.
Edited by atkinson (10/09/08 04:40 PM)
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#2488929 - 10/09/08 07:18 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: 78CJ]
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like2shoot
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Registered: 05/23/04
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Loc: Tidewater, VA.
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angular momentum
n.
1. The vector product of the position vector (from a reference point) and the linear momentum of a particle.
2. The vector sum of the angular momentums of each infinitesimal component particle of an extended body.
angular momentum
–noun Physics.
the product of the moment of inertia of a body about an axis and its angular velocity with respect to the same axis.
Also called moment of momentum.
Edited by like2shoot (10/09/08 07:20 PM)
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#2489127 - 10/09/08 08:32 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: like2shoot]
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65BR
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Interesting! You mean Twist combined with MV = RPM's needed to properly spin a given projectile?
Lee does make a good point. Like2shoot gave me a flashback of physics.
If I were or rather WHEN I have a 250-3000, it will be loaded w/those cool looking BLUE tipped bullets, just because they look good! As a side note, they are touted as good deer killers too!
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#2490671 - 10/10/08 03:47 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Yukoner]
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Lee24
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Yukoner,
The old Peters 117-gr RN ammunition works great in MY .250-3000, but GolfWithWolves is having no luck with 117 grainers in HIS rifle. Since 100-gr is accurate for him, those of us who use both are just assuring him that the smaller bullets are quite lethal.
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#2495456 - 10/12/08 05:21 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: 78CJ]
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dennisinaz
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Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 2857
Loc: AZ
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It is not just the rate of twist, but the lower velocity that also is insufficient to impart enough angular momentum to quickly stabilize the bullet and keep them all on nearly the same path. If 100-gr shoot good in your rifle, use 100s. ????????
He's full of it! Velocity has only a very minor role in stabilization. A 1:10 twist WILL stabilize a 117 grain roundnose and the 117 Sierra. I have shot both in my 250 (large ring mauser). I have had the best luck with 100 grain partitions on elk even though every time I post a pic of an elk and a story about using the 100 Noslers someone always points out that I should have used 115 grain partitions! In any event, I have NEVER recovered a 100 grain partition from an animal shot with a 250 Savage and this includes a half dozen elk. I haven't recovered a 117 Sierra either!
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#2495507 - 10/12/08 05:43 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: dennisinaz]
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65BR
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Sounds similar to stories on game shot with mild 6.5mms, moderate speeds, good SD w/shot placement = dead game results. Nice info.
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#2496752 - 10/13/08 08:53 AM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: 65BR]
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Lee24
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dennisinaz,
If you read my post, you will see that I never said anything about a 1:10 not stabilizing any weight .257.
If you don't understand the relationship of weight, bearing surface, rifling rate of twist, and muzzle exit speed to angular momentum, which is what stabilizes the bullet's flight around its flight path, then just say so.
If you just have an urge to insult me, don't bother to post, especially when you don't understand ballistics very well.
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#2498095 - 10/13/08 07:32 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Lee24]
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dennisinaz
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Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 2857
Loc: AZ
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You are one of those who STILL thinks that if you just push the bullet faster it will stabilize, this is not the case. Velocity has a very small effect on stabilization when compared to the twist rate. This has been proven time and time again yet there are those, you are apparently one, who still think you can add more powder and it will eventually stabilize. WinGyro modeling has recently shown that many ballisticians have been, and I'll quote: "can be too optimistic regarding the effect that muzzle velocity has on stability." I can provide references if you still want to be old school. In fact,there is a free Win32 executable WinGyro available from John Knight in England.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
The man on the top of the mountain didn't fall there.
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#2499525 - 10/14/08 12:31 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: dennisinaz]
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Golfswithwolves
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Thanks all for the interesting comments!
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#2500712 - 10/14/08 09:34 PM
Re: .250-3000
[Re: Golfswithwolves]
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Calhoun
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Registered: 08/06/05
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Loc: Eastern Nebraska
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Had so-so luck with 100 grain bullets in my old 99's, very good luck with 87gr bullets. Had some 117gr RN hit the paper sideways at 100 yards, so I think I'll stick with the 87gr Speer Hot Cor's on my old 99's.
Now, for newer rifles I'm definitely looking forward to putting some 100gr/115gr partitions through my Savage 11F once I get the A&B barrel onto it.
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