#2491953 - 10/11/08 07:41 AM
The Speed Hammer Blues
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MickinColo
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Registered: 05/05/05
Posts: 595
Loc: Colorado
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I’ve been using speed hammers in three of my No 1s for a while now, 7mm Mauser, 220 swift, and a 204. I haven’t ever had a problem with them.
Last spring I installed 400-grain speed hammers in my hunting rifles, 7mm Remington 1 B, and my 25-06 1 B. One thing I notice right from the get/go was light firing pin dents. In fact I started having miss fires in the 25-06 so I changed the hammer spring back to the factory spring. The miss fires stopped but the primer dents were still on the light side. I didn’t have any problems with the 7mm all summer until last Saturday, opening day of the Colorado antelope season.
Opening day started as any other opening day, parked the truck by the section fence and walked a half-mile in the dark to one of my favorite ambush spots and then laid down in the sage brush and wait for shooting light. Right at shooting light a 17” buck walked within 100 yards of me to the east. I lined up on him, thumbed the safety off, and pulled the trigger, “CLICK”. He didn’t run away. He couldn’t figure out what I was or what that noise was but when I opened the action and the case went “Ka-ching” against the safety, he was out of there. Unfortunately for the buck his exit strategy took him right into the waiting arms of my hunting partner, ¾ of a mile away. Needless to say, I wasn’t happy.
I missed shots on 3 more bucks the same way. I finally took a “meat buck” on Tuesday with my wife’s Encore 243 with the bantam buttstock on it, what a pain in the ass the little stock was to hunt with.
Moral of the story; if it doesn’t look right and it doesn’t feel right, done go hunting with it. It may be fine at the shooting range but not in the field were it really counts.
After I finish cutting up the last of the meat today, those 2 rifles get their factory hammers put back in them. I can’t say that I’ve seen any real improvement in accuracy so those speed hammers are out of there.
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#2492102 - 10/11/08 09:07 AM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: MickinColo]
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Paul39
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Registered: 05/04/02
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Moral of the story; if it doesn’t look right and it doesn’t feel right, done go hunting with it. It may be fine at the shooting range but not in the field were it really counts.
After I finish cutting up the last of the meat today, those 2 rifles get their factory hammers put back in them. I can’t say that I’ve seen any real improvement in accuracy so those speed hammers are out of there.
BINGO!
Mick, I'm sorry you had the problem.
I'm no authority on single shots, and know nothing about Rugers, but I am involved in competitive shooting with single shots, mostly Sharps and Winchesters. I know that speed hammers are used by a few folks, but many shooters do very well without them. A few competitors are always looking for an edge, whether it makes any real difference or not.
IMHO, speed hammers, particularly on hunting rifles, are a solution looking for a problem. Similar to features on modern bolt action target rifles that offer no practical improvement for a hunting rifle, and might even be a detriment. Certain extra close tolerances come to mind, like tight chambers.
Hope everything works out for you.
Paul
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#2492409 - 10/11/08 12:11 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: MickinColo]
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redz06
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Primers vary to resistance in firing pin hit, some brands/types are harder than others. The light hammer/firing pin is kinda a specialized thing, somewhat environment sensitive. I personally really doubt the advantage to such, but do know folks sell them.
My learning about such was with a customized Colt Python. The double action was so slick and smooth, but was sensitive to primer selections. So guess primer ignition is a balance between hammer power/weight and the hardness of the cup. Probably lots more than that to it, but that is beyond me.
The military has used a primer that is very tolerant of the firing pin; guess pretty hard stuff.
Always something new to learn in this business.
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#2492504 - 10/11/08 12:51 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: redz06]
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MickinColo
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Registered: 05/05/05
Posts: 595
Loc: Colorado
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What’s interesting about this week is I took my Swift and 204 with me to shoot prairie dogs. Both of them have speed hammers also. I fired 160+ rounds through the Swift this week and around 600 rounds through both of them this summer and about the same last summer with no miss fires or light strikes. So go figure. Different guns different personalities.
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#2492698 - 10/11/08 02:53 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: MickinColo]
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crossfireoops
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Registered: 01/06/05
Posts: 6864
Loc: Southeastern AZ
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Mick, .....I'm not all that conversant with # 1 s, ....have worked on but a few,......Kinda' fall more over into Paul 39's niche,....Buffalo Guns.
And Yup, we hot rod and tune those, too.
when lightening the "Blow", E.G. hammer strike force,....one has to look at the NOSE PROFILE,.....
I'll repeat that,it's that important,.....
.....the NOSE PROFILE of the actual firing pin,
Wrath of God, Heavy hits requiring blunt and rfully radiused noses,
Lighter strikes leaning more towards a radiused conical profile,.....
And primer cup "Hardness / ductility" is all over the place, per previous perspicascious posts.
What'll run dead reliable with one primer goes sour on another.
.......than, ...there's them that run large pistol primers in rifle cases (BPCR),....driving their Smiths completely around the bend.
Again,....think firing pin NOSE PROFILE
Work safe,
GTC
_________________________
Without courage there cannot be truth; and without truth there can be no other virtue. Sir Walter Scott
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#2492938 - 10/11/08 04:42 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: crossfireoops]
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MickinColo
Campfire Regular
Registered: 05/05/05
Posts: 595
Loc: Colorado
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Mick, .....I'm not all that conversant with # 1 s, ....have worked on but a few,......Kinda' fall more over into Paul 39's niche,....Buffalo Guns.
And Yup, we hot rod and tune those, too.
when lightening the "Blow", E.G. hammer strike force,....one has to look at the NOSE PROFILE,.....
I'll repeat that,it's that important,.....
.....the NOSE PROFILE of the actual firing pin,
Wrath of God, Heavy hits requiring blunt and rfully radiused noses,
Lighter strikes leaning more towards a radiused conical profile,.....
And primer cup "Hardness / ductility" is all over the place, per previous perspicascious posts.
What'll run dead reliable with one primer goes sour on another.
.......than, ...there's them that run large pistol primers in rifle cases (BPCR),....driving their Smiths completely around the bend.
Again,....think firing pin NOSE PROFILE
Work safe,
GTC
I appreciate your, Paul39’s, and Redz06’s input on the matter. Knowledgeable input is what I like about this forum. Thanks.
The speed hammers were just an add-on after thought to the trigger replacements I did on these rifles.
The first 3 rifles (7mm Mauser RSI, 220 Swift V, and 204 Ruger B) I installed Mould speed hammers on 2 years ago are all working fine. The 7mm Mauser, the Swift, and the 25-06 all use the same primer. The 25-06 was the first rifle with the new speed hammers to have a problem. I don’t think the new springs that came with the hammers are up to snuff.
The fact is I was an old (older) fool. After realizing I was having light firing-pin strikes, I should have put the factory hammer and spring back in and tuned the rifle before the hunting season. Oh well!
I have meat in the freezer, everyone got their animals, no one got hurt, and everyone including me had fun.
I’m just a smarter older fool now (I hope).
Edited by MickinColo (10/12/08 02:52 PM)
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#2493081 - 10/11/08 05:29 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: MickinColo]
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redz06
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Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 30
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Mick,
I would not feel like the lone arranger there at all. We all have had some oddities over the years; I have certainly had my share of them. Guess if one does not have those little things happen, then we do not get to shoot much or get out much...........:-)
Glad to hear that good meat is in the freezer, and the hunt was good for the senses.
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#2513228 - 10/20/08 02:52 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: redz06]
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Claude_Gatewood
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Registered: 05/30/05
Posts: 599
Loc: Medina, Ohio
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I'm not much for the speed hammers.
Follow thru like archery or skeet/trap/clays..same thing.
I got horrid groups from my first #1.
Sold it, forgot about it, bought another one..
Did the hanger mod, bedded this, that, went back to the hanger modification. Then the speed hammer.
Got an untuneable gun- making me nuts- some days good, some not.
Some old fart pointed out I was using the web of my hand to torque the gun as I squeezed the trigger- He put a pencil there and I could feel it as I squeezed. A few rounds with the pencil in the way-DANG, groups shrunk then and there. I still kick myself for selling the 25-06. Always thought it was the gun..
just my .02- I know it was about light pin strikes, but like so many, had to add something 
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#2513322 - 10/20/08 03:45 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: Claude_Gatewood]
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MickinColo
Campfire Regular
Registered: 05/05/05
Posts: 595
Loc: Colorado
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I'm not much for the speed hammers. Follow thru like archery or skeet/trap/clays..same thing. I got horrid groups from my first #1. Sold it, forgot about it, bought another one.. Did the hanger mod, bedded this, that, went back to the hanger modification. Then the speed hammer. Got an untuneable gun- making me nuts- some days good, some not. Some old fart pointed out I was using the web of my hand to torque the gun as I squeezed the trigger- He put a pencil there and I could feel it as I squeezed. A few rounds with the pencil in the way-DANG, groups shrunk then and there. I still kick myself for selling the 25-06. Always thought it was the gun.. just my .02- I know it was about light pin strikes, but like so many, had to add something
Thanks for the input, good information like others have posted. I put the factory hammers and springs back in the 25-06 and 7mm Mag and life is good again. I still have 3 rifles with speed hammers and they work find so I’ll leave them the way they are. 
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#2514658 - 10/21/08 07:31 AM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: Claude_Gatewood]
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mcknight77
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Registered: 04/14/07
Posts: 299
Loc: Anchorage, AK
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I'm not much for the speed hammers. Follow thru like archery or skeet/trap/clays..same thing. I got horrid groups from my first #1. Sold it, forgot about it, bought another one.. Did the hanger mod, bedded this, that, went back to the hanger modification. Then the speed hammer. Got an untuneable gun- making me nuts- some days good, some not. Some old fart pointed out I was using the web of my hand to torque the gun as I squeezed the trigger- He put a pencil there and I could feel it as I squeezed. A few rounds with the pencil in the way-DANG, groups shrunk then and there. I still kick myself for selling the 25-06. Always thought it was the gun.. just my .02- I know it was about light pin strikes, but like so many, had to add something
No.1s are not a bolt rifle. Pay attention to Claude's words. The bench technique is different. It's impossible to tell someone who's getting bad groups that it may be them, not the rifle. They just won't listen. Must be mechanical.
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#2525376 - 10/25/08 09:11 AM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: mcknight77]
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MickinColo
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Registered: 05/05/05
Posts: 595
Loc: Colorado
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The 7mm Mag and the 25-06 went to the range yesterday with their factory hammers and springs reinstalled. Life is normal again.
I also took the Swift and 204 with me (400 and 330 grain speed hammers installed). Their firing pin blows were the same as the 7mm and the 25. The 7 Mauser also has a normal firing pin blow. So I have a 60% success rate with speed hammers. All evidence is pointing to weak springs on the last 2 hammers I bought.
I’m going to call Moulds and see what they say and maybe get some replacement springs. I won’t put speed hammers back in my big game rifles again, but I do have my eye on a couple of new (new to me anyway) No 1 Vs.
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#2536144 - 10/29/08 05:44 PM
Re: The Speed Hammer Blues
[Re: MickinColo]
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BrentD
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Well, since everyone else is bashing speed hammers, I would say that if you have a problem with one, it is probably something that needs fixing, but not necessarily replacement. A heavy grease that is temperature sensitive may be the cause of your problems if it tends to be that you hunt at colder temps than you shoot at the range. It could be broken, or it could be you did not fully seat your hunting ammo primers. Or it could be something else.
But if it did work at the range reliably, and then suddenly not in the field, I think you have a problem that may be masked by replacing the factory parts - for a while. And then it may bite you back.
Speed hammers are not miracles. But they shouldn't be a detriment if you have it installed and working properly.
Brent
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