#702963 - 01/09/06 12:10 PM
Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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hubel458
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Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 181
Loc: Brinton,Mich.
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Back visiting here- Rob from Ar and and myself
have been testing our 12GA FH. First the cases
are built on bmg brass we put rims on , that match
12ga. Next chambers will take our 3.85 iinch case
as well as shorter shotshells. We both have rifled barrels,
and these are mainly high speed slug guns. Rob's
is built on big Borchardt falling block action and can be loaded to 55-60,000 psi. Mine is on a 12ga Savage 210
bolt action, and is loaded to 35,000 psi. We both have heavy barrels.Rob got a 750 gr banded brass slug to
3000 fps, and a 7/8 oz saboted bullet to 4300 fps.I got a 730 gr hardened lead Dixie bullet out at 2700 fps and
a 3/4 oz saboted bullet out at 3900.Ed.
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Ed Hubel
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#702964 - 01/09/06 03:39 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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AC_of_AR
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Registered: 12/27/05
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Hubel458,
That is very interesting. Besides the obvious pleasures of building the beast and the internal / external ballistics experiments, is there any other practical purpose for these behemoths?
Out of curiousity how heavy is your Savage, and what is the recoil of a 730 gr pill @ 2700 fps like in it? It would seem to be that in order to tame that recoil the rifle would need to be a bit heavy for "normal" hunting techinques.
AC
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#702965 - 01/09/06 04:05 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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hubel458
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Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 181
Loc: Brinton,Mich.
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AC--Mine is 25 lbs-Have 5lbs lead and epoxy in the butt.
Recoil is brisk but not bruizing. As for uses, a good DG
stopping gun with 700-1000 gr slugs. With sabots good
for deer, especially in shotgun only areas.Mine could be lightened to 15 lbs for sabot shooting. For carry, I
use the African, over the shoulder, barrel forward, and slightly down, carry position.Ed.
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Ed Hubel
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#702966 - 01/09/06 06:41 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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safariman
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Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 4666
Loc: Walla Walla Washington USA / Z...
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WOW! Those are some impressive ballistics! Are you using a strain guage to measure pressures? I would like to see photos of these montrosities. What ya'll got there is TRULY BIG BORE stuff! Fun post.
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When you are but 50 feet from an animal that can stomp you into mud puddle, or shred you into fajitas, rest assured that he will have your undivided attention! Words of a former safari booking agent, now a happy Africa loving rifle looney!
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#702968 - 01/10/06 03:51 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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AC_of_AR
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Hubel458,
Not sure I would want to tote a 25 pounder all day, even with it in an African/MG carry position. I know I can do 17 pounds, but 25 seems a tad too much.
Not knowing what powders or COL are exactly for your loads, and using a 26" barrel my internal ballistics program predicted a peak chamber pressure of ~ 43 ksi for your 730gr load and ~ 38 ksi for your 3/4 oz load. I was using Rel 22 for powder. Regardless, still very impressive ballistics with mild pressure.
The hotter loads you mentioned someone else getting ran 58 ksi and 59 ksi respectively.
AC
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#702969 - 01/10/06 06:06 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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hubel458
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Posts: 181
Loc: Brinton,Mich.
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Ac--My barrel is 31 in. I'm using real slow DB Ball
powders, up to 320grains on 730 gr lead calculated
out at 35k. Used a medium speed DB ball on sabot and
calculated same peak pressure.Rob's loads are lower
also as he used ball. His action will take any pressure
that the brass could hold, even high test loads.I haven't
had to resize the bottom of the 4 cases I have used for
many shots each for our testing.One has been fired 30 times.Ed.
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Ed Hubel
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#702970 - 01/10/06 08:18 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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fish30ought6
Campfire 'Bwana
Registered: 06/26/02
Posts: 10252
Loc: On the Warrior River
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mercy, miss percy. can't get the pic.
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abiding in Him,
><>fish30ought6<><
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#702971 - 01/10/06 07:58 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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safariman
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picture is a no show here too. Can you try again? how about pics of the guns?
_________________________
When you are but 50 feet from an animal that can stomp you into mud puddle, or shred you into fajitas, rest assured that he will have your undivided attention! Words of a former safari booking agent, now a happy Africa loving rifle looney!
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#702973 - 01/11/06 05:23 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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Redneck
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Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 8551
Loc: TAXHELLWI. USA
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Quote:
mercy, miss percy. can't get the pic.
LOL.. So, I'm not the ONLY one with pix-posting-problems.. LMAO...
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Target moving date to Belle Fourche, South Dakota: May 1st, 2010, then I'm OUTTA TAX HELL WISCONSIN! NRA Endowment member Ex - USN(SS) (USS Razorback) '66-'69. 
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#702974 - 01/11/06 05:42 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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fish30ought6
Campfire 'Bwana
Registered: 06/26/02
Posts: 10252
Loc: On the Warrior River
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now that is a stump-puller. thanks for the pic. i think i saw the savage on another site some time back while the falling block was still on the drawing board ...
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abiding in Him,
><>fish30ought6<><
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#702975 - 01/11/06 06:33 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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hubel458
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Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 181
Loc: Brinton,Mich.
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fish- yes his is a beautiful rifle. He
has got the real traditional big game look in
that gun. He also shot a few long 2000gr bore rider
banded solid brass bullets, at 1500 fps. Couldn't
go higher as recoil got too much.
_________________________
Ed Hubel
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#702977 - 01/11/06 07:56 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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fish30ought6
Campfire 'Bwana
Registered: 06/26/02
Posts: 10252
Loc: On the Warrior River
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uh, no kidding ...
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abiding in Him,
><>fish30ought6<><
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#702978 - 01/11/06 06:08 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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safariman
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Fun post and commentary etc. Thanks.
_________________________
When you are but 50 feet from an animal that can stomp you into mud puddle, or shred you into fajitas, rest assured that he will have your undivided attention! Words of a former safari booking agent, now a happy Africa loving rifle looney!
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#702979 - 01/13/06 05:59 AM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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BJ72
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Registered: 03/13/04
Posts: 73
Loc: Kasson, MN
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Been gone for a few days, so I missed this post. Holy Monkey! Did some cruching to put these into perspective for myself and I thought I'd share:
730gr @ 2700fps 11,820 ft-lbs Taylor Knock-out 206
750gr @ 3000fps 14,992 ft-lbs Taylor Knock-out 235
Didn't know how many grains of powder to figure so I plugged in 275 and recoil varies from 135 ft-lbs to 195 ft-lbs, even in a 25# gun. Those are some hairy chested shooting irons.
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If at first you don't succeed, keep on suckin' 'til you do succeed. ~Curly Howard
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#702980 - 01/13/06 05:55 PM
Re: Been testing the 12GA From Hell--
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hubel458
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Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 181
Loc: Brinton,Mich.
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BJ72--On the lead 730 gr loads, 320 gr of
AA Magpro ball powder in my
25 lb gun--
320 gr of W_748 behind the banded Bridger solid
750 gr in Rob's gun which is 30 lbs.
The guns have good balance and big thick pads,
so not that bad. Watched AR poster 'tailgunner'
shoot mine Sunday and muzzle only went up 6 inches.
And he not a big guy. We have some who will bore out chambers on Encores and NEFs with heavy barrels, to use our long case, and there the recoil will get interesting.Ed.
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Ed Hubel
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