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Originally Posted by Remington6MM
I was just gong to mention the Meadow Massacre but you beat me to it A few weeks ago a couple of Missionaries stopped by here and when I asked them about the Massacre, they acted like they had never heard of such a thing. I told them to Google it!


Hell yeah you showed them boys that's for sure....


Originally Posted by Bricktop
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego.

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Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Pioneer Day marks the day in 1847 the Mormons arrived in what would become Salt Lake City. (They conveniently forget that there were Catholic missions here before that.) Anyway, the entire state is closed today, there are huge parades in which every Mormon ward, stakehouse, temple, chapel, and Boy Scout troop have floats. There are huge rodeos as well. This is also the July day when more fireworks are sold and lighted than even the Fourth.

I don't know of any other state that so officially honors a single religion. Is there?


its funny when people move to another area that has a unique culture and think it needs to change to fit them. Why not learn to enjoy it. I love community celebrations. You don't have to agree or adhere to the religion why not simply enjoy the festivities? I see lots of american flags and tons of patriotic activities. Sounds fun right? YEAH enjoy it.

traditions make us all feel part of something. they give us something to look forward to. Sadly america seems to make fun of these sorts of things and try to keep us all in our own corners mad at each other.

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Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Pioneer Day marks the day in 1847 the Mormons arrived in what would become Salt Lake City. (They conveniently forget that there were Catholic missions here before that.) Anyway, the entire state is closed today, there are huge parades in which every Mormon ward, stakehouse, temple, chapel, and Boy Scout troop have floats. There are huge rodeos as well. This is also the July day when more fireworks are sold and lighted than even the Fourth.

I don't know of any other state that so officially honors a single religion. Is there?


Rocky,

You've shared an interesting observation, that a lot of folks probably didn't know about.

My take is that it has become an historic celebration over time, rather than a religious one, although I am sure there is plenty of prayer and religion.

For many years, for most Utahans history and religion were bound together, and many worked hard to keep it that way grin

Now days, I understand that SLC is only 50% LDS, although I am sure it is much higher in most of the rest of the state.

When Coal was King, I am sure Price, in Carbon County, was less than 50%. Maybe Bingham Canyon as well.

Time changes things, but it is good to hang on to some of the old as well.

Have you read the book "Proper Edge of the Sky"?

Highly recommend for anyone remotely interested in Utah, southern Utah, or rural Utah.

For the rest of you, I deeply apologize if my post has slowed or stopped the sectarian strife, that was not my intent. blush

Sycamore



Originally Posted by jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
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Sycamore, thanks for that. I regret that my post brought out a few religious bigots and a few more who somehow think I hate Utah.

Nothing could be farther from the truth. I am happily settled here for the remainder of my days. I have no animosity towards Mormons whatever. I do recognize that when any group anywhere is a majority they will set rules to meet their own standards. That's true here, too. No sweat.

Utah is a great place to live. It's big, it's beautiful, it has four distinct geologic/climatic regions, it has more national and state parks than any other state, it has good hunting and fishing plus lots of golf, and it is overwhelmingly conservative with minimal gun laws.

I regret giving you haters a platform for your venom. Now STFU.


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Just learned about this today via the morning paper.

http://www.thespectrum.com/story/ne...s-celebrate-pioneers-pie-beers/30655393/

Pie and Beer sound good, but frustrating for an old diabetic like me.

Paul


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Thing about pioneers, that's no longer politically correct to celebrate. The "nativeamerican" activists are trying to revise that as well, to make white settlement of the west a bad thing to be ashamed of.


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Originally Posted by Mannlicher
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I don't know of any other state that so officially honors a single religion. Is there?



I think Michigan and Minnesota celebrate Ramadan. laugh


Doesn't Florida celebrate "Cinco de Mayo"?

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Is the holiday celebrating some religious doctrine, or the day the first settlers arrived in the valley?

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Rocky is a friend and a neighbor here in Ogden. As nearly as I can tell, he likes it here, contributes to the community, and fits right in.

He does have a keen sense of irony, and is curious about unusual things. He also has an unusually good knack for turning an insightful phrase.

It's completely within his character to honestly ask a question like, hey, does anyone else do this? In that, it's nothing more than his native inclination to ask and investigate.


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Originally Posted by RockyRaab


Utah is a great place to live. It's big, it's beautiful, it has four distinct geologic/climatic regions, it has more national and state parks than any other state, it has good hunting and fishing plus lots of golf, and it is overwhelmingly conservative with minimal gun laws.


You lost me at "golf". I think I'll stay a couple of hours north. Even if we have more Mormons than you do....... wink


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Not to inflame anyone or incite religious bigotry, but I grew up in northern Utah with a fully credentialed pioneer lineage. wink (Great-great grandfather was a Mormon Apostle with 8 wives. shocked ) Because that part of Utah (Cache Valley) is my home, the geography and that area are very much imprinted on me and I still call it home and enjoy visiting very much. It has much to commend it.

However, we left Utah 28 years ago; we just had to get out of there. AT the time my wife and I were both very active LDS (and she still is extremely active), but it was too much of a mono-culture for both of us then and still is today (at least for me). I found it boring and stifling. This is mostly true if you are LDS I think. If you are not LDS though, you can pretty much do what you want, you just have to deal with some annoying aspects of the LDS culture in the public square, but I don't think its near as stifling as when you are a member of the LDS faith and then living in a community where it seems like everyone else is a member of the same faith.

Every culture has its quirks. For example, I positively cannot stand San Francisco and most of Kalifornia (even though I live in the state). I think for non-Mormons living in Utah, you just learn to deal with the quirks of living in a place where a particular religion dominates the culture. You just learn to deal with some of the annoyances that go along with that.


Jordan

Last edited by RobJordan; 07/26/15.

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Thanks for sharing your perspective, Rob. As a non-Mormon immigrant living in SW Utah for two years now, you accurately described what we've seen and experienced.

If we didn't like it and weren't able to come to terms with the quirks, we wouldn't be here. There seems to be a prevailing willingness to accept the status quo and not question the way things are, especially where any form of institutional authority is concerned, and not just the church. People here accept all forms of bureaucracy, as well as poor customer service from businesses. Almost all newcomers comment on the generally poor customer service around here, despite a very competitive business environment. It doesn't make sense.

No disrespect intended toward the Scouts, which were a very positive influence on my young life, or the LDS, but living in Utah is like living 24/7/365 in a Boy Scout camp. People look to leaders and a set of rules to guide how they live.

Paul



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Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Pioneer Day marks the day in 1847 the Mormons arrived in what would become Salt Lake City. (They conveniently forget that there were Catholic missions here before that.)

Awhile back I perused a local free newspaper in Spanish, in which I am moderately literate. In a column about Pioneer Day they referred to the Mormons as illegal immigrants, which I assume meant that it was Mexican territory at the time. At least to the Mexicans. grin

Paul


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The son of a friend who went to BYU said that the one thing that bugged him the most was people continually asking him if he was "a member of the church". To which he would reply, "which church?", and get confused looks, as though there was only one church, LDS.

One of my daughter's friends is going to Westminster College which, based on his stories of drinking and debauchery, is about as far from the LDS ideal for behavior as a person could get and still physically be in SLC.

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I read somewhere that SLC has one of the largest homosexual populations in the country, per capita. Go figure. They're very militant in Utah.


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they referred to the Mormons as illegal immigrants,


That's hilarious, and probably very defensible.


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Originally Posted by Paul39
Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Pioneer Day marks the day in 1847 the Mormons arrived in what would become Salt Lake City. (They conveniently forget that there were Catholic missions here before that.)

Awhile back I perused a local free newspaper in Spanish, in which I am moderately literate. In a column about Pioneer Day they referred to the Mormons as illegal immigrants, which I assume meant that it was Mexican territory at the time. At least to the Mexicans. grin

Paul


Utah was claimed by Mexico, until the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, in 1848, following the Mexican-American War.

Sycamore


Originally Posted by jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
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Originally Posted by djs
Originally Posted by Mannlicher
Quote
I don't know of any other state that so officially honors a single religion. Is there?



I think Michigan and Minnesota celebrate Ramadan. laugh


Doesn't Florida celebrate "Cinco de Mayo"?


That would be Texas..


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I remember my first Pioneer Day while working in Utah. I came to work and the place was nearly empty. I was informed it was Pioneer Day, but at that time was clueless as to the significance. We didn't get the day off, but most everyone took leave and made a day of it. From there on, "when in Rome" applied when 7/24 rolled a round...


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