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Joined: Sep 2001
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2001
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There are so many different situational considerations. Threat levels, climate, physical dis/abilitites, etc, etc.
Just having a gun and some basic skills in using it, is a great place to be, compared to not having a gun.
I've been carrying a Glock 17 now for over 20 years. Seems a pretty good balance of everything, but a Glock 19-size would be easy to like too. But that's for me, I don't try to make 'my choice' into everybody elses choice too.
I tried a 2.25" SP101 for a while, way back in the 90's. I always felt I should carry extra ammo. After a short while I went right back to the Glock 17.
It's easy to choose the full size Glock day to day, because it's my smallest pistol. Well, I have a 4" Security Six, I don't really consider it for carry, but it would be a fine outdoors sidearm.
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000 |
i was messing with a 2.75inch ruger 41mag redhawk yesterday.
firing 180grain, and 228grain keith style bullets.
forgot the box i have on my desk right now, 265 grain hollow points. I don't have those loaded to the top of the charts, but they are over 1000fps. ought to be an interesting combination. Might have only six rounds, but probably would stop just about anything.
THE BIRTH PLACE OF GERONIMO
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,386
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,386 |
I carry a Glock 43 with two extra mags for EDC. Total pacakage - 19 rounds.
For ANY circumstance where the car and my AR is not in "running distance," I carry a Glock 19 with two extra mags.
If 50 rounds (one in the pipe, a 15 round mag in the chamber, two 17 round Glock 17 mags in reserve) don't gain me breathing room (and mama is armed), then God and Darwin are teaming up on me.
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General
John Stark.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,755
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2014
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How exactly do you decide when you're going to be in a dangerous situation? Exactly. There was a hadji shooting at the local mall this weekend, in about one of the "lowest risk" places in the country.
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Joined: Dec 2003
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2003
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right now I am slumming a glock 42 with a +2 for a total of 8+1 in the lowly 380. Sometimes i have an extra 6 round mag in the car but i dont carry it on me typically. Carrying is new for me, im still getting acquainted with just the sidearm itself
Last edited by SAKO75; 09/26/16.
"Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered."
― George Orwell, 1984
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,584
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,584 |
The video offers a balanced view from a generic, statistical standpoint. The problem arises when something happens outside the parameters of the generic, statistically probable encounter. Someone packing a 10 ounce pocket .380 with rudimentary sights to thwart a street robbery faces a different challenge if stuck in the Batman or Trainwreck movie theaters, the San Bernadino situation, the Seattle deal from a couple of days ago, or today’s situation in Houston with the deranged lawyer. Least common denominator equipment for an “ordinary” event is really going to be suboptimal when the danger and stress levels reach the extreme. Technology has improved to the point where just a slightly bigger gun than a least common denominator gun can bring a lot more versatility to the fight without unduly sacrificing convenience.
"Don't believe everything you see on the Internet" - Abraham Lincoln
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Joined: Mar 2008
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
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Last edited by SargeMO; 09/26/16.
Direct Impingement is the Fart Joke of military rifle operating systems. ⓒ
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452 |
The video offers a balanced view from a generic, statistical standpoint. The problem arises when something happens outside the parameters of the generic, statistically probable encounter. Someone packing a 10 ounce pocket .380 with rudimentary sights to thwart a street robbery faces a different challenge if stuck in the Batman or Trainwreck movie theaters, the San Bernadino situation, the Seattle deal from a couple of days ago, or today’s situation in Houston with the deranged lawyer. Least common denominator equipment for an “ordinary” event is really going to be suboptimal when the danger and stress levels reach the extreme. Technology has improved to the point where just a slightly bigger gun than a least common denominator gun can bring a lot more versatility to the fight without unduly sacrificing convenience. The guy in the video carries full sized, double stack, nine millimeters. He also said in the video that most people can carry a bigger gun than they think. Seemed like he was trying to encourage carrying the most substantial handgun a person can figure out how to comfortably carry and conceal, and to try to carry a bigger gun if you're currently carrying a mouse gun, or even a compact/single stack 9mm or J-Frame .38.
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452 |
Did you notice they were twenty-twos? Pretty cool, though.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300 |
balanced is G19, unbalanced is Sig mpx in shoulder holster. 
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Joined: Mar 2008
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
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Did you notice they were twenty-twos? Pretty cool, though. No I didn't but that old boy handles them pretty well, all the same.
Direct Impingement is the Fart Joke of military rifle operating systems. ⓒ
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659 |
The guy in the video carries full sized, double stack, nine millimeters. He also said in the video that most people can carry a bigger gun than they think. Seemed like he was trying to encourage carrying the most substantial handgun a person can figure out how to comfortably carry and conceal, and to try to carry a bigger gun if you're currently carrying a mouse gun, or even a compact/single stack 9mm or J-Frame .38. I've never heard anyone who had been in a gun fight EVER complain that he had too much gun. I've read countless times where someone carried something small, got into a gunfight and after that always carried something larger. One advantage of a full sized pistol beyond caliber or capacity is the fact that 9 out 10 people will shoot the full sized pistol better than a compact or sub-compact. So the moment you pull your gun your confidence level is already higher. I've been carrying a full sized auto since I can remember, and it doesn't bother me at all...but that's me. It's not for everyone, and I don't feel a "self calling" to belittle everyone else into doing so.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2007
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I wonder how many of the guys who switch to the larger gun eventually drift back to something they will always carry. I used to think I'd be like Scott F and just carry a 1911 all the time. Then I started actually carrying. For those that can and do carry a full size all the time, I'm right behind you when the lead starts flying. LOL
Stupidity is expensive
If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,121
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,121 |
I hope it goes without saying that the rule of thumb should be to carry the most effective handgun that you can and will carry ALL THE TIME.
All the time means 10+ hrs a day and 70 hrs a week, minimum.
By those standards, very few non-LEO folks carry anything, much less a service sized pistol.
What you carry after work and on the weekends is a pretty benign contingency and that "better" gun that's only carried a few hours a week is effectively nothing more than a rabbit's foot.
The uninitiated are always easily impressed.
NRA Endowment Member
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659 |
The person who changed my mind on carrying pocket guns was Peter Kokalis...which is funny, because I always thought he was an A-hole.
Back in the '80's I was at the Great Western Gun Show (IIRC) and there was a big machinegun shoot going on and Kokalis was there being an arrogant jerk. He came by our booth (I worked for a class 3 mfr & importer) and everyone got to talking. Somehow he asked what I carried and at the time I had a PPK. He balked, and I got my feathers ruffled because I didn't like the guy to begin with. But since I was a young upstart with next to no experience, and he had actually been around the world doing dangerous stuff, I decided (for once) to shut my trap and listen to what the man had to say.
He then asked why it was so hard to just carry a real gun, after all, isn't that what you'd want to have if the SHTF? He then introduced me to the Sparks Summer Special, even pulled it off his person complete with 1911 and swapped his gun for mine for an hour to try it out; damn decent of him.
That was the day when I realized that gun leather choice makes a WORLD of difference. After that I ordered up a Summer Special and tucked my Hi Power inside. Then it was a matter of just getting used to carrying a full sized pistol and it really didn't take long at all. Now it's just second nature; doesn't bother me at all.
Still think Kokalis is a jerk a lot of the time, but he was extremely nice to me that day, and I'll always owe him that lesson.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452 |
The guy in the video carries full sized, double stack, nine millimeters. He also said in the video that most people can carry a bigger gun than they think. Seemed like he was trying to encourage carrying the most substantial handgun a person can figure out how to comfortably carry and conceal, and to try to carry a bigger gun if you're currently carrying a mouse gun, or even a compact/single stack 9mm or J-Frame .38. I've never heard anyone who had been in a gun fight EVER complain that he had too much gun. I've read countless times where someone carried something small, got into a gunfight and after that always carried something larger. One advantage of a full sized pistol beyond caliber or capacity is the fact that 9 out 10 people will shoot the full sized pistol better than a compact or sub-compact. So the moment you pull your gun your confidence level is already higher. I've been carrying a full sized auto since I can remember, and it doesn't bother me at all...but that's me. It's not for everyone, and I don't feel a "self calling" to belittle everyone else into doing so. Same here on full sized. Years of carrying Government Models and K-Frame Revolvers, only recently, about a year ago, switching to a Glock 17. I don't find it a problem, either. I only switch to something smaller (like a single stack, compact 9mm) when either I'm mowing the lawn (or doing other yard work), or when not printing is a particularly high priority (like going to the dentist ... you don't want to explain your gun to a dentist, should he or she suddenly discover it, while being examined or worked on).
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,843
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,843 |
You should carry the one that you have 1) practiced with, 2) can shoot accurately, 3) can and will carry, and 4) has the highest capacity possible barring the first three conditions. Some folks arrange those 4 items in different priorities.
I've carried full-size 1911's, officers & micro 1911's, Glock 43/Shield, J-frames, etc.
I've settled on a Glock 19 in a Supertuck because I can wear it all day at work, church, out messing around, in shorts and t-shirt, what-ever. I shoot it well and it has good ammo capacity, especially with a spare mag or two.
But, most importantly, I can/do carry it all of the time in any situation I generally find myself in attire-wise or situation-wise. I don't just have it on for an hour or two, this gun is on or within reach 24hrs a day.
I also realize that even though it is practical for me, that doesn't mean it is for everyone else. Hence, my list above.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same." - Ronald Reagan
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,518
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,518 |
The person who changed my mind on carrying pocket guns was Peter Kokalis...which is funny, because I always thought he was an A-hole.
Back in the '80's I was at the Great Western Gun Show (IIRC) and there was a big machinegun shoot going on and Kokalis was there being an arrogant jerk. He came by our booth (I worked for a class 3 mfr & importer) and everyone got to talking. Somehow he asked what I carried and at the time I had a PPK. He balked, and I got my feathers ruffled because I didn't like the guy to begin with. But since I was a young upstart with next to no experience, and he had actually been around the world doing dangerous stuff, I decided (for once) to shut my trap and listen to what the man had to say.
He then asked why it was so hard to just carry a real gun, after all, isn't that what you'd want to have if the SHTF? He then introduced me to the Sparks Summer Special, even pulled it off his person complete with 1911 and swapped his gun for mine for an hour to try it out; damn decent of him.
That was the day when I realized that gun leather choice makes a WORLD of difference. After that I ordered up a Summer Special and tucked my Hi Power inside. Then it was a matter of just getting used to carrying a full sized pistol and it really didn't take long at all. Now it's just second nature; doesn't bother me at all.
Still think Kokalis is a jerk a lot of the time, but he was extremely nice to me that day, and I'll always owe him that lesson. A good holster makes a world of difference. It takes me a while to get used to and one once I do, I am reluctant to change. There's another factor and that is making the decision to carry a substantial sidearm and making whatever adjustments are necessary to accomplish that.
Direct Impingement is the Fart Joke of military rifle operating systems. ⓒ
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,659 |
A good holster makes a world of difference. It takes me a while to get used to and one once I do, I am reluctant to change.
There's another factor and that is making the decision to carry a substantial sidearm and making whatever adjustments are necessary to accomplish that. I'm the same way...I carried in an Askins Avenger when I carried OWB and while it was a high quality holster and comfortable, it wasn't a great concealment holster. The Summer Special was the first truly concealable holster for a full sized pistol that was also relatively comfortable. I wore that holster until I got my first Sparks VM II almost 15 years ago. Now I carry mostly in a HBE Com III which is very VM II-ish, with thinner leather and no metal band at the mouth of the holster, so rather streamlined for CC, but the basic design is much the same. I took the Crossbreed style for a good test drive and found it carries about the same, but just has more leather against my skin, so I continue to carry the HBE & VM II. I'm always interested in a better idea, but I haven't found anything better than the HBE Com III.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,452 |
A good holster makes a world of difference. It takes me a while to get used to and one once I do, I am reluctant to change.
There's another factor and that is making the decision to carry a substantial sidearm and making whatever adjustments are necessary to accomplish that. I'm the same way...I carried in an Askins Avenger when I carried OWB and while it was a high quality holster and comfortable, it wasn't a great concealment holster. The Summer Special was the first truly concealable holster for a full sized pistol that was also relatively comfortable. I wore that holster until I got my first Sparks VM II almost 15 years ago. Now I carry mostly in a HBE Com III which is very VM II-ish, with thinner leather and no metal band at the mouth of the holster, so rather streamlined for CC, but the basic design is much the same. I took the Crossbreed style for a good test drive and found it carries about the same, but just has more leather against my skin, so I continue to carry the HBE & VM II. I'm always interested in a better idea, but I haven't found anything better than the HBE Com III. I've gone from VM II devotion to EPS C-Force. One holster will carry just about anything just right. I bought one for a Sig P220, and use it for a Glock 20,21,17,19,43,42,30, CZ-75, 1911, H&K USP-45, Ruger LC9S Pro, on and on and on.
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