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In late May of "81 I was working on a 140' Feadship that was enroute to Washington D.C. from FT. Lauderdale on the night that the plane crashed on the deck of the Nimitz. We were 20 or so miles offshore of Myrtle Beach S.C. when the incident on the Nimitz happened off the coast of Jacksonville. We were cruising at 16-17 knots. The next afternoon the Nimitz crossed our bow at the mouth of the Chesapeak heading into Nofolk. Our captain figured out it had to be making at least 40-45 knots.

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Originally Posted by Pugs
For a modern nuke boat (the only ones left) think highway speeds. There's nothing on the ocean that can keep up including all the escort cruiser/destroyers.



While in Ike (CVN 69), cruising the Med in 1988, we answered bells and hauled bootie from near France to off the coast of Lybia. We left the rest of the battle group behind. A nuke boat can move!

Cruised in JFK (CV 67) in 1990/1991, and while not as fast, she was fast enough. JFK's keel was laid as a nuke, but outfitted conventional because the family didn't want the name associated with nuclear anything.

A carrier typically only needs to be able to get 15 to 20 knots of wind over the deck to launch because the catapults are strong enough to fling an aircraft with enough airspeed to fly. Usually 5 kts or so above stall.

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Originally Posted by Jayhawker
As a goal, an aircraft carrier should be able to do at least 40 knots because it needs that airspeed across its deck to launch planes. The USS Midway was capable of that in the late 70s although you'd think she was coming apart. I'm sure the nuke ships are capable of much more.


No way Midway could anywhere near 35, much less thirty, especially with the stabilizing bulges added in her senior years. As far as "wind", sure you can generate your own wind, but depending on aircraft launch weight, 25kts is a good rule of thumb.

Nimitz Class carriers have only TWO reactors. Enterprise has eight, she was the first nuke carrier and what they did there was install 8 SSN reactors and BTW she was the fastest of all our carriers, because of her hull SHAPE which really plays a big part in determining realistic attainable speeds. I can tell you that I saw 36 kts on NIMITZ.. j


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Originally Posted by Greyghost
Doubt it is much over 35 to 37 knots, but their is a formula that supposedly gives a fair estimate of maximum hull speed which I believe is 1.34 x the sq of water line distance between the bow and stern waves at speed. Or a close estimate just using the length at water line. Just guessing waterline at around 900' which would put close at 40 knots. Even with 4 screws, don't see it reaching much past that even if wanted. Damn sure they're not going to let it our run their support group.

Phil


THIS.

As to JFK, she was (is) not a CVN 68 class. She, along with America CV 66 were to have been nukes originally and Bart is correct McNamara changed that and that is why both were maintenance nightmares throughout their service lives. Ostensibly, think of them as what the North Carolina class of Battleships were to the Iowas; test beds..


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Originally Posted by kamo_gari
I suspect you won't ever get a number you could take to the bank, MM. Years ago I had a former Navy nuke sub driver as a student worker at NU Law, and while he'd share wee snippets and anecdotes, was tight-lipped, as he well should've been. One I recall well when I asked him about the rough speed and maneuverability of the boat went like this: 'they're a lot more agile, faster and will run deeper than you'd ever believe, probably, but that stuff is classified. I will say though that I used to love when we drilled on emergency blows. I could make that bitch sit up and bark for me!"

P.S. His uncle was lost on the USS Scorpion.
Damn.. I was on the USS Redfish when we heard about the Scorpion.. Lots of very quiet boys on the boat for a while after that..
Originally Posted by kamo_gari
Originally Posted by Rancho_Loco
Don't know about the carriers, but we used to fish the horseshoe off Long Beach, and it was just awesome to watch the Tico class cruisers creep past the breakwall and goose it. The turbines would wrap up and the stern would squat down, and they would just take off, right there.

I'd swear they would do it just to show off.

The smoothest application of power I've ever seen.


I bet it was impressive. Here's the maneuver the gent I wrote about was talking about in his submariner days; 'emergency blow' as he called it. The USS Greeneville.



USS Pickerel did a similar blow before that.. IIRC, the boat dropped back to near test depth before they got it back under control.. Bacon stripes were abundant..

Originally Posted by Greyghost
Doubt it is much over 35 to 37 knots, ...............

Phil
...and you'd be wrong..

Originally Posted by PVT
Originally Posted by Pugs
For a modern nuke boat (the only ones left) think highway speeds. There's nothing on the ocean that can keep up including all the escort cruiser/destroyers.



While in Ike (CVN 69), cruising the Med in 1988, we answered bells and hauled bootie from near France to off the coast of Lybia. We left the rest of the battle group behind. A nuke boat can move!

Oh, yes they can... smile

Even back in WWII the 'fast carrier groups' could steam at 35 knots under full power. My father was on one of 'em, under the overall command of Admiral "Bull" Halsey.



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Originally Posted by Pugs
For a modern nuke boat (the only ones left) think highway speeds. There's nothing on the ocean that can keep up including all the escort cruiser/destroyers.



That's the best answer, and the most appropriate, you'll get on this subject; along with a rather impressive (and accurate) hint.


Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Originally Posted by Jayhawker
As a goal, an aircraft carrier should be able to do at least 40 knots because it needs that airspeed across its deck to launch planes. The USS Midway was capable of that in the late 70s although you'd think she was coming apart. I'm sure the nuke ships are capable of much more.


No way Midway could anywhere near 35, much less thirty, especially with the stabilizing bulges added in her senior years. As far as "wind", sure you can generate your own wind, but depending on aircraft launch weight, 25kts is a good rule of thumb.

Nimitz Class carriers have only TWO reactors. Enterprise has eight, she was the first nuke carrier and what they did there was install 8 SSN reactors and BTW she was the fastest of all our carriers, because of her hull SHAPE which really plays a big part in determining realistic attainable speeds. I can tell you that I saw 36 kts on NIMITZ.. j
Truth.

It takes 10 knots of wind to make a whitecap and that is good flying weather on a carrier.

I launched 2 planes off the Kennedy while at anchor in Hurghada, Egypt. Any guesses as to which airframes?


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The only ones you could legally launch; Vikings smile


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Speed in excess of 30 knots

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I wouldn't be surprised if it could top 40, or maybe even 50, knots. Likely twist herself up into a knot before she ran out of power and 4 20+ foot diameter screws can move a LOT of water.

Not sure I'd hang my hat on the old hull speed formula being the limiting factor either. You can increase maximum hull speed with modified bow shapes.


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Rode around on them for years and don't honestly know the answer. We did do a high speed run off So Cal once where we attached max chains to the jets on the flight deck and they pulled the rods. I peeked outside and thought to myself "holy [bleep]". Had I been on water skis I'd have been skipping off the water. They are impressive!

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From what I found I saw speed in excess of 30 knots.


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I was on the the Teddy Ruxbin CVN-71 when we left Norfolk on Dec. 27th and prior to launch of the first Tomahawk in Jan 16th we were through the Suez and well into the Red Sea so those big girls can make time. I was also on board for Sea Trials after dry dock and the high speed turns and shake outs tell you there is some power under the hood.

I well respect Highway speeds as that is what I had heard also.



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No way 50. Forty maybe but I never saw it and the hull shape is an issue. That is why the Enterprise was so fast, but it had a trade off, less stability roll-wise. I "drove" both NIMITZ and JFK..

Last edited by jorgeI; 07/01/15.

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Originally Posted by Pugs
For a modern nuke boat (the only ones left) think highway speeds. There's nothing on the ocean that can keep up including all the escort cruiser/destroyers.



^ This.

I was on an escort DDE behind the Enterprise when the Norks grabbed the Pueblo. We could do 33 knots give or take a few depending on the seas. That works out to pretty close on 38 MPH. We left the gulf where we could see Haiphong Harbor's lights after 2200 hours and by 0600 when I rolled out it was cold outside and the Enterprise was nowhere in sight and could not be found on surface search radar which would pick that beast up near 100 miles out.

Figure 8 hours to open ~100 miles on us and she had at least 12 MPH on us. Since when I hit the rack we were in normal plane guard station and launch/land ops it was that much advantage at a minimum.

At that time Enterprise always traveled with us, the O'Bannon and the nuke cruiser and four fast attack nuke boats underneath her. The O'Bannon had 3-4 knots on us and the cruiser a couple on the O'Bannon. The only thing that could keep up with her was the fast attack nuke boats. When we cranked up to 33 knots the DDE pounded and shook to where you thought it was coming apart. Not a fun ride.

I have seen the Enterprise launch F4s in no wind conditions. Anyone who's seen an F4 come off the catapult in normal launch winds learns to hold their breath until the bird comes back up to the level of the carrier deck. Back then, they hit the water way too often. Enterprise could turn into the wind and spit A5s and those funny looking things with the hook thingy on top of tip of the nose (E6s?) off the deck like a swarm of bees and not bother with the cats when necessary.

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Originally Posted by mack5511
I was on the the Teddy Ruxbin CVN-71 when we left Norfolk on Dec. 27th and prior to launch of the first Tomahawk in Jan 16th we were through the Suez and well into the Red Sea so those big girls can make time. I was also on board for Sea Trials after dry dock and the high speed turns and shake outs tell you there is some power under the hood.

I well respect Highway speeds as that is what I had heard also.


I was on that same cruise in VAQ-141. After we lost our jet of Bermuda and on the transit they would pan the flight deck cameras aft and we were throwing a rooster tail that almost reached the flight deck. Triple tie-down chains on everything.

Also did shakedown on Lincoln with CVW-8. On the shakedown we had half an airwing and light loads of fuel/weapons we left the Pegasus class hydrofoils out of Key Weird standing.


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I was on a fast attack submarine for three years in the mid-90's. I have done sea trials workups where we tested the limits of the boat doing full and flank speed maneuvers, emergency blows, the whole bit. What I know is that some of those nuke carriers are damn fast. Fast enough that a MK-48 ADDCAPP torpedo on slow speed won't catch one, if the carrier is wound out. It has to be on high speed, and even then you better have a relatively close shot and good angle. Now I'm not going to say how fast a Mk 48 is, but I will say that the guys saying some of those carriers can run 45+ knots answering a flank bell are not wrong.

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Originally Posted by JTPinTX
I was on a fast attack submarine for three years in the mid-90's. I have done sea trials workups where we tested the limits of the boat doing full and flank speed maneuvers, emergency blows, the whole bit. What I know is that some of those nuke carriers are damn fast. Fast enough that a MK-48 ADDCAPP torpedo on slow speed won't catch one, if the carrier is wound out. It has to be on high speed, and even then you better have a relatively close shot and good angle. Now I'm not going to say how fast a Mk 48 is, but I will say that the guys saying some of those carriers can run 45+ knots answering a flank bell are not wrong.
Spot on..

The 48s were still in the testing stage when I was in - but I heard bits and pieces of what they could do.. VERY impressive piece of equipment.. smile


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Originally Posted by Pete E


Scott,

With your back ground and interest in subs, you might be interested in reading about Operation Barmaid
Its amaazing to think just how quiet our subs are..


I will look it up. I was the LPO of a submarine sound silencing teem. I spent 17 years repairing and working on subs but never rode one.


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