Home Forums Birds & Dogs Hunting Dogs New dog journey...

I'll probably keep this thread running posting updates and asking questions as I try my hand for the first time with a hunting dog. As I've posted previously, the wife agreed to a pudelpointer. The pups were born last week. 5 in the litter and all males. Yesterday they had their dew claws removed and tails docked. Not sure which one we'll be bringing home around Christmas, but one of these little guys will be coming to Indiana!

That's cool

Man I need to crawl out from under my rock more often, I never heard of them.

Goodluck, all dogs are great for the soul

Nice looking pups.

I'm still in the indecisive mode when to pull the trigger on a new pup. Keep us posted.

Man, they look like peas in a pod. Too cute. Some Good Times ahead, no doubt.

Be sure to add pics when the get him home.

I don't know who's more excited for pup to get here, my two boys or the wife!

I've started reading a couple of books on training dogs that were suggested to me on a previous thread I had started. Funny how in some aspects they contradict each other. One states to absolutely not use the wing on a string thing to play with pup. The other advocates for it pretty well.

Hmmmmmmmm... lemme guess. Writer #2 is one Richard Wolters??

Am I right??

Nope. Chuck Johnson.

OK Good.

Wolters makes a big deal out of that stunt in one of his books on training PDs. Several issues with it in my world.

I'm not thinking I'll use that tool much. Might a time or two just see the little guy point, but not much.

The boys are getting bigger!! I'm guessing it won't be too long and they be up and around more.

Beautiful pups!!! Very best of luck with them.. Nothing makes one happier than a puppy..

Nothing is sweeter than puppy breath.

They're a good breed and can be a lot of fun as a family dog.

The very nice weather over the weekend allowed Mom to take the boys outside for some fun!


I'm not sure which one is ours yet, but this guy, with the red collar (standing) is our favorite.


More of them...

Had a call on Sunday from the Breeder. He had a few questions for me on type of hunting, training experience, size of dog I preferred, etc. Said he's hoping to decide whom is getting which pup sometime this week. Here the whole crew was on Thanksgiving.



Yesterday, he got a hold of some quail to start getting the pups excited about them. Them being "birdy" doesn't seem to be too much of a problem!

Congrats on the PP pup, you'll love him! Keep the pics coming, sure brings back memories of when mine was a pup.



Something to look forward to if he gets bored. That bed was about 3 days old.

Great pics! At least it wasn't the couch... I'm excited for some added hi-jinx in the house. I think it's gonna be a hoot!

We're waiting...

Awesome pups and pics! Let the fun begin...
If you don't like dogs, well there's just something wrong with you! Puppy breath is the best. Keep the pics coming so we can enjoy too!

Sorry about that! He's growing and getting the hang, somewhat, of the house rules. He's not fighting the leash much at all and doing pretty darn good in the house. When he's excited he's a bit much for the kiddo's, but they love tossing things for him to bring back!




One week after being home. He is growing FAST!

WOW. Cute pooch!

Hope the 'basic training' continues to go well.

What's his name? Or, did I miss that?

Sorry, I forgot to add that part. Hank is his name. At least when I'm not muttering, dmn dog...

Took a couple days off over the boys' holiday break. Decided Hank needed to get out of surburbia for a bit, so him and my oldest headed down to our cabin in So. IN. Was hoping to get a few squirrels shot, but the weather and Rocky didn't cooperate, but we did have a good time and popped a lot of primers.

After 3 hours in the truck, both the boy and his dog were ready to stretch their legs!



A quick change of clothes and they went to check out the creek bottom across the field and to be out of dad's hair while he unpacked.


The next day while the boy was hanging with his cousin, I decided to take Hank for a long walk up through the woods. He quite enjoyed himself! Lots of new smells, sticks to carry, and deer poop to eat...








Unfortunately we didn't get any close encounters with game, but he did find out water was fun! The 1.5 hour walk, not really that far we just took our time, had him all tuckered. He did range farther than he has at home, but always kept me in sight. I purposefully did not call him to me, just made sure he saw me and headed where I wanted to go. He kept me in sight and I was glad to see he did not shy away from any situation and seemed to enjoy bowling through the tall grass and briars!

Like both my kids, "school" start this week...

Great looking PP, pointer! Sure going to be fun watching him mature. Keep the pics coming!

There sure are allot of new pups showing up around here.....

Sure beats the "Lost My Old Friend" threads that one dreads to open....

Thanks for taking us along although I'm more than a little jealous....I'd have a new pup every year if I could...

You are so right Field!!!!

Pointer

Every young boy (and his Dad) should have a good looking smart pooch like that to bond with. Sounds like you guys are off to a great start. Me thinks Hank won the doggie lottery!

Paul

Thanks guys. It's been a fast two weeks that's for sure. He's smart, I'll give him that. And much "softer" than the last dog I had. Something I have to watch when correcting him.

FWIW, the boys both have their own iPads and are allowed to make the background most anything they wish (that momma and I approve). I was tickled last night to find that both have changed them recently to be pics of themselves with Hank!

An update. The house messes are fewer and farther between, but not gone completely. Mostly if we don't see him at the door or if he gets too excited. All told, I'm pretty pleased with Hank's progress there.

This past week we started a couple new conditioning items. Starting to work on WHOA a bit. Mostly just going in and out of doors/kennel and while on walks. I have been periodically banging pots together, from a distance, when he eats. This week we moved up to a to cap gun! The boys think that is fun. The first couple of times he tucked his tail and looked at me, but now he just looks and then keeps on slopping food down. Yesterday, I tried it close to him while he was eating. No flinch! I plan to keep it up, but think we are well on to not, hopefully, being gun shy! Last new thing is some start to tracking. I drag a piece of hot dog across the driveway/garage floor with him not around and then bring him to the track. He smells the dog, but looks to me for it when I give him the command. He's used to getting food from us instead of following his nose. So far he's always found it, but I hope he gets better at using his nose/searching for it instead of looking to me for it. We'll keep after it, but any and all suggestions on starting tracking drills is greatly appreciated.

Though it was jumping the gun a bit, we've for awhile now been tossing toys for him to fetch. The last couple weeks he's turned the corner with this! He's always brought them back towards us, but wanted to play keep away or tug of war once he got back. Lately, he comes back closer and with a bit of petting and the GIVE command he's giving up the toy. Might take a couple of repeats, but he's giving up the toy pretty easily now. This was mostly done in the house as play and exercise, but we took the show outside this week. With more room to get away, the first time he tried to keep away, but a bit of ignoring him and in came when called. After that, he did great, bringing it to me and giving on command. Very pleased with this and will be getting some bumpers and bird scent to make it a bit more formal soon! One thing we need to work on is him coming straight to me instead of circling me with the toy to show off.

Though I have no real frame of reference, I think things are progressing quite well even though PPs are known as a bit of slow developers. He's fitting in great with the family and has everyone's heart at this point.

Like any athlete, a good stretch after a workout is needed!

Neat doggie. You'll get tons of advice from everyone. You didn't ask....but....keep up those trips to the woods as often as you can. Local or whatever you can do to get those smells and experiences imprinted on him. If the training hits a wall because you're uncertain how to progress.....just get him out. Other dogs. Other kids. And as many smells as possible. He will figure things out. And even without much training other than OB...he should produce game for you, even at this age.

Bests

Thanks JJ! That's the plan. Trying my best to get him as much varied a experience as possible. He's a quite a good dog and a fast learner.

Good times. Enjoy!

You're doing all of it just right IMO. Keep it up, and he'll amaze even you.

Not much new, but he's getting leggy and longer haired! Good looking dog if I do say so...

So, Hank and I got a bit of "work" in this weekend. Bought him a couple of bumpers so he's using something other than a toy when we are "working". Thanks for the suggestion of fitting one with some wings. First time toss he wasn't quite sure what to do with that. He ended up picking it up by the non- wing covered part! He doesn't seem to mind now.

So yesterday, we got a few free hours so I took him and my 5yo over to a fish and game area for a walk around and to toss some bumpers. Going by myself would have probably been better from a training standpoint, but I couldn't say no and I'm tickled I didn't!

For the most part it was a new place for Hank and I wanted him to get into the grass, weeds, brush, etc and just have fun. Every so often I tossed a bumper for him. I did not have the newly purchased check cord on him and he did find and bring nearly all of them back to me...or at least close to me. We are far from retrieving to hand, but I did have to go after him a time or two to get the bumper from him. I think using the check cord on some short throws and getting more diligent with obedience work we can get over that low hurdle. Here's a not so good cell phone video of him retrieving a toss down off the pond's levee.
Hanks Video

A couple of times I tossed the bumper out of his sight or line of sight. He would go looking for it and it was cool to see him turn into the wind to try to scent it (used quail sent). Couple of times it took some coaxing to get him to head in the correct direction, but he did find them! I could tell when he was smelling something by his body language and intensity. I wouldn't call it "birdy" just yet as I'm not sure it was birds or poop or rabbits he was excited to smell. But, I can't wait until I know and can call it that!

All in all it was a good day outside with a 5yo boy and a 5mo old pup. We brought home a 1/2 box of empty shotgun hulls that my son found. I think he liked finding those more than Easter eggs! Hope to have many more in the near future.

Since this is supposed to be a running post about my dog training here's my next week's to do list.
1. Keep tossing bumpers with wings
2. Keep reinforcing commands is pretty much knows (Come, Give, Kennel)
3. More work on getting Stay, Whoa, and start on Heel.
4. Work on my tone of voice and body language. I can be bit too much when correcting him.

Now for some pics from the day!
Super K and Hank at the start of the "hike" as K called it.

Super K figuring out how to navigate a wet spot.

Hank doing what dogs do...




Hank's carrying a stick and so will I! Gotta build those muscles for his last two wrestling tournaments.

Hank after his Mom required bath once we got home. Baths make him fluffy!!

Hard to beat a thread with pictures of puppies and kids!

John

Looks like your doing a fine job with Hank. He'll teach you alot before he's done!

He's doing that quite often!

Handsome boy!

The weather was nice last night, so after an early, quick dinner the boys, Hank, and I headed out for some 'field' time for the pup. Granted, he had been kenneled most of the day, but once we hit the field...VVVRRRROOOOOOOOOOOMMMM! He's starting to get his legs under him! Not sure if he was doing anything but burning off energy and crashing through the NWSG. A bit later, I was all but positive I heard a bobwhite calling. So we worked our way over to that fence row. Not positive, but I thought I saw a few flush and when Hank got to there he was extremely interested in something... I need to get some birds planted for him so I can see if he realizes what they are.

A bit later on Hank used to nose to help find a mostly not stinky deer skeleton! The boys thought it was cool and the youngest couldn't wait to get home put the "dinosaur" back together! However, they did let dad carry the stinking mess out.


The main purpose of this trip was to get Hank around some water. While on the walk he had no problem splashing through shallow water and retrieved bumpers into water to his belly. Once we made it back to the truck we took him down to the boat ramp to see what he thought of bigger water. Course, the boys couldn't let him have all the fun!


He entered the water up to belly high on his own. We tossed a few sticks for him that he'd go get, but none far enough where he'd have to swim. Once I let the boys get totally soaked, I figured I'd give him longer tosses as the oldest could swim after the bumper if Hank didn't. Hank didn't mind getting it at all!!

Click to see the video's
Hank Video #1

Hank Video #2


All it all it was a fun, short evening. I am more than happy with Hank's progression. Now to find more time and some birds for him...

Great thread pointer, don't know how I missed this one.

Well it's official, Hank IS a pointer!! This past Saturday, I skipped my 8yo's morning baseball game (which I hate to do) and attending a local NAVHDA chapter training day. For Hank and I this was to be an introduction to live birds! The chapter members all met and we split into 2 groups, one at the pond working on duck searches and the group I was with headed to the field to work on pointer, holding steady and retrieving. Having not attending one of these before I did what I could to help, but mostly just observed and kept Hank out of the way while birds were planted, pointed, shot, and retrieved for the first round.

I was a bit interested to see how Hank did around gunfire. He's not shown any skittishness around loud noises or the cap gun at home, but... The previous Friday, my neighbor set off a mortar style firework while he was outside and it scared the bejeebus out of him. Later that week, he was even skittish about the thunder that came with the storm that hit home. At the first shot he did flinch and tucked his tail, but didn't run nor whimper. I petted him up and he seemed fine with all the rest of the shots. I and another guy were up for the second round as we were both working with young dogs.

We dizzied and set the 3 pigeons for Hank. I kept the check cord on him but wanted to give him some time to gains some independence/confidence. Once we walked him towards the first bird, he was faster than I and caught it on the ground. We reset the bird and showed him where it was and then flushed it. He chased it in flight for a bit and then it lit in the tree. The second bird was much better... I worked the check cord better catching him just as he found the bird. We flushed it and I followed him as he chased it again. This time in lit in the short grass and just as I was getting ready to reel him in on the cord; BANG! First point! He locked up and after a few tail waggles, even that went still. A chapter member got this pic just as one of the others was picking the bird up to show Hank and to make it fly.


The third bird took Hank a bit more looking than I would have liked, but once he found it he locked up on it as well!


This one flew much better and I let Hank go as the bird flew low and fast with him in hot pursuit! Every time he took off after a bird, one of the members would fire a starter pistol. With a bird in sight, he didn't even flinch! He chased this bird about 100yds and it decided to set down. Moments later Hank pounced on it! I quick Come Hank, and he was bring the bird right back to me letting me take it from him with one, soft Give command! Though I was told that you don't want them to catch the birds, this one was unavoidable. I was pretty darn proud of the little guy, even though they were sight points, and very proud how well he retrieved the live bird.

Homework after they day: 1. Work more obedience and be more diligent on WHOA, 2. tracking drills as he needs to start using that sniffer more, and 3. since I have 3 dead pigeons we're going to start doing some retrieving drills with them in some tall grass so he has to use his nose.

Not sure anyone from the Chapter will read or see this, but I want to thank them again for all the help on Saturday! It was well worth the drive and time spent.

This past Saturday, Hank and I attended another local NAVHDA training day. I greatly appreciate these as I'm new enough at this dog training thing to not know what I don't know and the other members are a great help. One thing Saturday taught me is that I need to temper my expectations a bit, same as when I'm working with my kids on something. Since he pointed last month, I had it in my head that he'd lock up instantly at the first whiff of bird. That was not the case...

Anywho, since the last training day we've spent some time working on tracking in the yard with dead pigeons. He would work the track well, IMO, and always found the bird or treat at the end. On Saturday, it was apparent he was using his nose more and did a great job at finding all the birds (3 pigeons and 2 quail) that I planted for him. His snuffler does work! He had a couple of flash points and one that he held somewhat after I stopped him with the check cord. But, it is definitely something we have to get better at before his NA test in August. It was suggested I get access to some bird lauchers.

Now for what he did very well. Each time in the field after birds, another member was firing off a starting pistol. I was a bit worried that he may be abit gunshy after a firework experience a few weeks back, but he didn't even flinch this time. So, I think we are good on that and I plan on buying some 20ga 'poppers' for next months training. His prey drive is very strong!! I think that is one of the reasons he's not pointing well yet. He smells the bird and just wants catch it. He did momentarily catch one pigeon as I was too slow on the check cord and almost got a quail. That said, once the bird flushes he hits the after burners and is after them! One of the pigeons flew a bit over a 100yds into an adjoining woods and disappeared with Hank hot as his tail. I called him back and nothing. I called again and here he comes bounding through the grass with the pigeon in his mouth!! So, at least I know he knows how to find birds, now I just need to teach him to stop when he gets close. Any and all suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Many more members showed up this month than last and therefore the field work took much longer than last. As such we didn't get to spend as much time on the water as I'd have hoped. I tossed the bumper for him a half dozen times or so and he showed now hesitation in going after the water and brought them all back to me. I think we are solid on that part for the test!

Speaking of the test, here's a quick run down of what he needs to do and where I think he stands.

1. Search the field and point a bird. He's good at searching and will work up to 75yds from me as I move through the field. As stated above, he finds birds, but we must get better at getting them pointed.
2. Not be gun shy. So far he doesn't flinch with the starter gun and I hope that continues when I move closer and to louder shots.
3. Track a live bird. He's using his nose and figuring out what birds smell like. He needs more exposure to this.
4. Go into the water with little/no hesitation. He's only been in water twice and so far he seems well adapted to it.

Again, I didn't get my expectations met, but we are progressing. I also recognize that any/all of his shortcomings are on me due to lack of exposure. I did find out about a conservation club not 10mins from the house that has a dog training area. Hope to put that to use over the next few months. Any and all advice or suggestions is great appreciated!!

ne thing I am trying is to do shorter sessions more frequently. I'm hoping it helps. Last night I had about 15mins before we had to leave for a baseball game, so I laid out a few short tracks in the yard. Previously I had been using dead pigeons for this and leaving the pigeons at the end of the track. This time I coated his canvas bumper with some quail scent and used it as the drag with a treat at the end. First two were pretty easy as they were only about 10yds each and straight. The third one was longer and I put a J hook on the end. He's starting to learn what's going on so he was running at Mach 1 when I brought him outside. But, taking him past #1 he blew through it, but on his way back picked up the trail and found the treat. Using his collar I led him to the start of #2 and he followed it like he was on rails. For #3 I just kind of led him to the general direction of the start (FIND THE BIRD) and he picked it up right off. He did overrun the J hook, but came back, found it and ran it out. I was pretty darn stoked! I did like using the pigeons, but they're only good for a couple of days and then they get squishy enough that he chews them on the retrieve a bit too much.

Not sure if the next thing I did was "good", but I did it. After letting him retrieve the bumper a few times I'd get him excited with it and trying to get it from me. I kept him from grabbing it and then I'd stop moving it and give him a WHOA. After about 2 times of this he started to sit when I said WHOA. I think it's because I make him sit often before tossing the bumper. When he'd sit I stood him up and rubbed his belly while holding the bumper in front of his nose, but not letting him have it. Then I would toss it for him to retrieve. After a few times he did stop and stand when I said whoa. We'll see if that helps him in pointing better. Thoughts on doing that?

Thanks again for all the advice and suggestions. They are greatly appreciated.

My neighbor lady has pigeons.

I do my best to thin out and cull her flocks for the benefit of all my neighbors.

Maybe you could send Hank out my way.

Looks like great fun for both father and son.

Keep us posted.

Jeff

Okay, the Central Indiana NAVHDA had another training day on Saturday so I have an update. We've been working a bit on WHOA at home. Nothing to technical or proper, just trying to get him to slow/stop when it hears the command. A large reason for this is that he's not pointing all that well yet and I (more accurately I was told) think it's due to him catching birds on the ground during training. I put my order in for 5 pigeons for the day and contacted a couple of members whom agreed to bring some bird launchers to keep him from hopefully catching the birds.

The first bird was loaded and ready. As soon as Hank caught the scent and turned toward the launcher we hit the launch and the bird took off! We kept that up for 3 more birds and you could see him starting to get it. When he'd hit the scent cone he started slowing/getting more cautious until the bird took off. I spent a good part of the rest of the day helping either plant or shooting birds for others. BTW, be sure to check to make sure you've taken your turkey choke out. Makes it harder to hit birds on the wing and does a number on them when you do hit them...

Most everyone in the group I was with was about done with the field work and ready to move on to some water work, so I planted the last pigeon I had in the launcher and put Hank on the check cord. I let him burn off some energy and then gently encouraged him downwind of the bird. He caught the scent, slowed and started creeping towards the bird. I gave a soft tug on the check cord, whispered WHOA and bang, he locked up on point about 10' from the bird! Not even a tail wag! We let him hold it about 10sec and launched the bird. He gave it a good chase, but it didn't land. I was tickled! Thanks to one of the members I now have an application for a Conservation Club about 10mins from the house that has a 20ish acre dog training area and homing pigeons. Hopefully I can get everything processed and keep Hank progressing on his pointing.

After that, we moved over to the water. While others were working on duck searches, Hank and I just played with bumpers in the water. He shows no hesitation in going for a swim and to date has always brought the bumper back.

So, we are going to continue to work on WHOA and tracking drills at home. If I can get the keys to the club, do our best to get him on some live birds. They don't have remote launchers, but they do have some manual tip up baskets. If I can get one of my kiddo's or my wife to go with me that should work. I'd really love to get a remote launcher or 2, at $300 a pop I'm just not sure I can swing that right now... He will doing his Natural Ability Test in late August with a pre-test practice day the week before. I am fully confident he'll max out his score on the water portion. He's not flinching at all to the sound of starter pistols or gunfire, so we should be good there. I feel like he's doing well with the tracking at home, but tracking a dragged bumper is different than a live rooster. And pointing... He's doing a great job of finding birds, but I really hope to get him to pointing a bit better prior to the test. In the end, his score is really irrelevant, but as anyone who's done this type of stuff we all want to see our dogs do well.

All in all, we had a very good dog weekend!

Our PP is at Quinebaug Kennel for two weeks of training.

Dog is a wild child according to the trainer.

She has amazing prey drive.

Obedience training is the key, prey drive is there!

Had a pretty eventful weekend. First off, I got my key and membership card to a local Conservation/Gun Club that has a number of acres used for dog training and their own stock of homing pigeons! So, being able to expose Hank to birds is now going to be a LOT easier and even cheaper. They have launchers as well, but the auto ones are on the fritz...

Secondly, the NAVHDA group had a pre-test training day on Saturday which I attended. The test is next weekend and the guy that will be running it took me and Hank through the process. We started in an upland field where they'll be doing the upland field work. I purchased 3 chukar that folks placed for us as we went through a "hunt". I let him run a bit to get some exuberance out of him, then put him on the check cord as I didn't want him catching any birds. Good news, he found every bird pretty easily. Bad news is that I still had to WHOA him up with the check cord. Once stopped he held point pretty well, to the point that the cord has slack in it. But he's not really doing that initial stop on his own. So, I'm not to hopefully to score too well on that portion of the test.

Though it's not part of the test, we shot the last bird over him. I got him stopped with the check cord and he held steady until the bird was flushed then I checked him until it hit the ground. No flinch at the gun and he retrieved the bird to hand. I was pretty stoked he did all that and very well. Now, if he'd just point...

Next on the the pheasant track. I kept him out of sight of the field until given the signal. He started off okay, then over ran it/got distracted and circled over behind us. Once I got him back on the track, he followed it pretty darn well about 5yds downwind of the actual track, which I was told is really not a problem. He broke cover (going from mown into the thick stuff) on the track which would end that session. Overall I he did good. I let him go a bit before I called him back as the test marshall was given me some advice. When I did recall him he came bounding out of the cover, with a now very dead, rooster in his mouth! He can find and apparently dispatch birds! I then took him over to the pond where he did great. No hesitancy what so ever and even though it's not needed, retrieves every bumper tossed into the water for him.

All in all, I'm very happy with Hank. He's become a very nice addition to the household and I'm certain I'll eventually get his kinks ironed out. I also realize that even if we don't come home Sunday with a Prize 1, life will still be pretty darn good.

Jennifer Broome is the real deal. She is an awesome person and a great trainer. She made my boy a great gun dog and took him farther than I ever could alone.
If you can catch the Rick Smith seminar she has occasionally , go. Well worth
The time.

That's a good looking dog, your Hank!

Last night was a good night. Storms and tornado warnings caused by sons flag football practice to be cancelled, so when TMOB got home I loaded Hank in the truck and went out for some training. The goal tonight was to get him to start stopping (if that sounds correct) when he smells birds. To start with, I let him run a bit to burn off some enthusiasm. Then as it was headed towards me I held a pigeon by the feet and let it flap to get his attention. First time or two he lunged to grab them, but a soft WHOA had him on point. I did this a couple of times then put one in the launcher and him on the check cord. Manual launchers make this less than ideal and a bit complicated, but it's what I have available. I led him downwind of the launcher until he hit scent and when he got close enough I could grab the laucher cord I stopped him with the check cord and no verbal command. We did this about 1/2 dozen times and each time it took less and less pressure on the check cord to get him to point. Once on point he'd hold it while I came up to him and even in front of him! Here he is locked up and as you can see there's no pressure on the check cord. He'd stay like that until I launched the bird and then I'd let him chase it while I got the next one ready. I'll work on steady after I feel better about the point.


Next step I loaded the launcher and turned Hank loose with no check cord, but with me holding the launcher cord. I'd wait for him to hit the scent and react to it, but if he didn't stop pretty darn quick like, I'd launch the bird. Only did this a couple of times as it was kind of a cluster trying to juggle all of that stuff... For our last 'run', I moved the launcher to an area we hadn't been be for and put him back on the check cord. I let him move out in front of me for the full length of the check cord. We started to get closer to where the bird was planted and BAM, he locked up just as I was thinking I needed to get ready to stop him! The previous times he was quite close to the bird when I'd stop him, but this time he was a good 50' away! This caused a small problem as I had to get in front of him to get to the launcher cord. I dallied up some check cord and moved in front of him and he stayed put until I got to the cord and launched the bird.

All in all I was very happy with last nights session. We'll do it again on Friday. The cool part about the homers is that he probably doubled the number of birds he pointed in one night! Not as good as wild birds, I know, but it's the best at my disposal.

Our PP spent a total of 4 weeks at Quinebaug Kennels with trainers Jordan and Phil and we spent another 2 day at a Rick Smith Seminar held at Quinebaug.

My son and I had additional train the trainer time after each session which has been invaluable.

The pup is 10 months old and ready to start the season. This morning we are going to a local gun club to do some field training with her. It should be fun!!

Good luck! It's an amazing feeling watching that switch go on. I just need to get Hank some more exposure to birds to make that switch work more often...

Been too long since an update... We took a bit of a break for a few weeks as our schedule didn't leave much time for field training, but we did spend time working at home on obedience and leash items. Some things fell in place and I was able to score an automatic bird launcher! Wish I would have broke down and bought one of these things MONTHS ago. Makes working with him on his point much easier and my youngest loves to go with me and be the button pusher! The points are getting stauncher and he's now pointing farther away more often. I think he's starting to tie to the smell and his job together. He still spends most of his time on the check cord as he was ranging a bit farther than I wanted and he still charges in on the bird occasionally instead of pointing. The combo of the auto launcher and homers has been great. But, this weekend we thought we tried a variation of that...

After work on Friday the boys and I took a bit of a drive and came home with 5 pigeons and 1 cortunyx quail. Saturday after basketball, Hank and I headed out to the conservation club, but this time we didn't let the birds go! He pointed well and really got into it after he got to bring the first one back to me!!


A mouth full of feathers made him a happy boy! He retrieved all the birds and only failed to bring one back to hand. He dropped it at my feet. At this point we had been working fast and furious as I had to get back home for some evening plans and I think the 75º+ temps were getting to him. So, we worked on range and headed to the creek for a a cool off...




We're gonna keep after the homers as much as possible and I hope I can find some more birds to buy soon. We leave on 11/15 for a trip to see if I can find some wild birds to put in front of him...

Looking good! Hope you're successful on the wild birds, everyone will have a good time regardless.

Thanks! There will be 2 dogs on that hunt under 13mos, so I'm sure it'll be frustrating at times, but we'll definitely have fun.

Frustration is part of the game, as me how I know... BTW, I'm loving Hanks fixtures, he's looking like a proper PP now!

His coat thinned out a bit and got shorter over the summer. I'm interested to see how or if it grows out this winter. He's a bit softer coated than I expected. Burrs/seeds can be a bit of a headache, but a combing usually fixes that.

It may or may not grow back. My Kai's beard was pretty prominent her first year, then shed after the winter. Hasn't come back the way it was. Other than looks, it's not a bad thing, between the burrs and dripping water all over the floor after getting a drink.

That last part is so true. Hank's water stays outside and there's always a towel by the door to keep momma happy!

For a bit now, I’ve joked that Hank is a hunting “breed” and not a hunting “dog” as he had yet really hunted. Well, that changed the week before Thanksgiving! We left on Tuesday morning and made a late night stop in Aberdeen, SD and heading on to our destination the next morning in North Dakota. There we met BOY, his father, BIL, and their 3 dogs.
Not a whole lot of great story telling, nor any pictures or lies about rock solid points that would be on the cover of Pointing Dog Journal. But, Hank got into a lot of birds. He learned how to cross fences and that if one’s not paying attention they can bite! It didn’t take him long to start working cover and staying, for the most part, close enough to me to be of help. Though I did have to do quite a bit of recall with him as he likes to chase flushed birds and a lot of the birds apparently had track shoes on! All in all the two of us had blast and learned a bunch! I did learn that I shoot my 20ga 870 better than my Mossberg 12ga and that 20ga 3” #5s do a great job on roosters. Now I just need to keep him on birds!
Still need to work on getting his point stronger. Running birds didn’t help, but at least he didn’t catch any! He can definitely find birds and was not too timid to get in the woolies after them. He did dang good on retrieves when he could mark them. Not quite as good if he didn’t or than ran a bit. Mostly I was pretty happy with his retrieving. But, the last bird he retrieved he did NOT want to give it up. It was alive when he got to me with it. It was not by the time I got it out of his mouth… Definitely need to work more on tracking!
Time for pictures!
Hank with his first wild rooster!




Hank and I with a pair we rooted out of a big field!


Hank doing his thing! I did put a protective vest on him the last day or two as his chest/belly was getting pretty wore out.






[img]http://i29.photobucket.com/alb...%20Dakota/DSCN1693_zpshypyfrys.jpg[/img]

Like I said, we got into birds!

Very, very nice. If he don't want to give that bird up, blow in his ear. He will let go quick.

Thanks for that tip!!!

I've found you grab the area where the rear leg attaches to the body and pinch it. Hasbeen

Great looking lineup! The dogs and birds at least. Looks like you fellas had a great trip, congrats!

Thanks! It was definitely an "ugly" dog crew...



I realize that I'm probably going to jinx Hank and I's progress, but last night was awesome! We didn't have much time at the conservation club as it gets dark so early due to the stupid time change, but we did get some work in. I took both boys with me and sent them and Hank on a walk to burn off some exuberance of all 3 while I laid out a drag trail with a dead pheasant. When Hank got back, I put him on the start and with a "dead bird" command he took off like a hound dog with his nose to the ground. Barely overran it came back found it and brought it back!

Next up we worked on points with the launcher and homing pigeons. He locked up great on all 5 birds and at much greater distances than normal and without me having to stop him with the check cord!! The last one I got mixed up on which clump of grass I hid the launcher and was getting a bit disappointed that he had overran it, but he locked up and sure enough he was right and I was not!

As I was putting stuff away I had my oldest lay out a track with the dead rooster. I told him to go about 100 steps and to leave it. I turn around to find him 70yds away doing zig zags through the grass! So much for following instructions... I got Hank and lined him out on the track and just waited. He followed it down of the hill and then I lost sight of him. Just as I started to see where he went, here it came charging up the hill with the rooster! I know these are small things, but it was probably the best night of training we've ever had.

Not sure if the conditions were just better than in the past or if the experience with the wild birds flipped a switch (I so hope this is the case!) but it was a fun night. I celebrated with a beer and he got a few extra treats once we got home.

Until Saturday, about all Hank's been up to is a day or so a week pointing pigeons in launchers. He's gotten to the point where he points them and just doesn't barge in and try to grab them. This Saturday, my schedule and the weather cooperated so him and I headed to a local preserve. I had 5 quail put out and marked. He found all 5 and had 3 good points. The other two he pointed but broke too early. Not sure if he's backpedaling or if the bird moving in front of him was just too enticing... Either way we were able to bring 4 of the 5 home. One flushed low and inline with him so I wasn't able to get a shot off. We tried our best, but couldn't turn it up later. All in all I was pretty happy with his finding and pointing of birds. Now the retrieving part...

He found all of them and started bringing them to me, like he's always done in the past. However, this time he started spitting them out before he got to me. Not sure why he decided to start doing that. He got to where he wouldn't even pick them back up! So, I gave him the sit command, placed the bird in his mouth made him hold it for a bit before giving him the Give command and taking the bird from him. Any suggestions/critiques of if this was the proper thing to do would be greatly appreciated!

I have a few pigeons in the freezer so I thawed one out and did some short retrieving drills in the yard on Sunday after a few bumper tosses. A few times with the pigeon and some treats as rewards and he started bringing it back to me and holding it until I gave the Give command. I'll keep up on this if you folks think this is a good fix.

Now to ask a question. When he does pick up a bird, he's crunching them a bit more than I'd like. Suggestions on how to start working on fixing that? He does also chew his bumpers a bit when retrieving them. The crunching didn't seem to be a big problem with pheasants, but with quail it was too much. Looking forward to hearing some suggestions.

Next Saturday we're going to be back at the same place but for a couple of roosters instead. Now that the days are getting longer I should have a bit more time to get him to the conservation club and we're going to start the process of working on being steady to flush. They have a training table/board setup there that was built for this, so we'll be starting that.

All in all it was a pretty good/fun day!

Headed back to the preserve this past weekend. Found and pointed both birds well enough. Retrieved both mostly to hand. He did drop the hen a bit too early, but held on to the rooster until I took it from him. The hen did get chewed up more than I'd like. So, I do plan on doing the force fetch training, but will wait to start until March. Family schedule is crazy until then. Over all I'm happy with his progression. Just need more exposure to more birds...


I have some Christmas money burning a hole in my pocket. Have considered getting an e-collar. How necessary do you guys find them? In your opinion would you consider them nearly essential for training/hunting?

He is male. You will find when he is wanting to do what he wants to do, and not what you want to do, is when the collar will help.

Work on the retrieving and delivering to hand with all of his toys, all the time. "Tenderizing" should go away.

My first wirehair got worse as he aged about tenderizing roosters. We killed lots of them and I believe he was fed up with getting spurred and wacked by wings.

Thanks for the advice. I do make a point to make him retrieve to hand anytime we are "playing". Maybe I'm not "playing" fetch with him enough. More often and more consistent is probably a good thing for the both of us. Thanks for the reminder.

Any recommendations on make/model of collars? Range needed for a pointing breed?

Some dogs have a propensity for a little hard mouth. He may have been whacked by a wing or had a bird peck him. I think the more he retrieves the less the problem will occur. Don't use a shock collar for this problem, you might end up with a dog who won't pick up a bird. I used to use a collar on my GSP's but I found that they do more harm than good. I finally sold mine. Better off with a whistle.

I am using the Dogtra and mostly have to use the pager function. I have delivered a few shocks after the pager use and a smart dog makes the connection. Labs on the other hand...

As mentioned above, only use the collar for negative actions, don't try to reinforce positives like holding the bird.

Big runners like the GSP would probably benefit for reinforcing "come" with the shock collar. Close hunters would get by with a check cord until perfect. Most people are too soft with the training, they quit when the dog is "pretty good" and not 100%. I am more guilty of that now as I age.

My Golden turned one recently, went to NE to celebrate. Our first hunt, two day trip to NE in Nov. Collar on but not really needed.


Of course she went into season in Jan so no trips out of town to hunt. Recent trip to the game farm, she flushed half the planted birds. Wanted to get her nose into more birds before end of the season.


My daughter cut school to join me and really made the day. I cut the hunt shorter as to spare her from one of "those" hunts with dad...

Thanks for the advice fellas! I'm thinking I'll probably end up with a collar. I'm betting he takes to it quick. We use an invisible fence at home, so he's familiar with vibration/tone/shock.

I'll keep working with him on the fetch and hold. Though I really wish I had more birds around to put him on, I do get a kick out of watching him do his thing and the training.

s'crewd- Great pics! Looks like that dog is getting it figured out. Congrats.

Hank and I hunted two more pheasants on the preserve this past Saturday. It became much more of a "rodeo" than intended... First bird, he pointed and it flushed. I was slow getting the gun up as I was trying to take a picture of the point. Ended up missing it and it made it across a wetland. We'll get back to that bird.

Second bird, he points, but breaks a bit too early flushing the bird. I go to shoot, but get a click instead of a bang. I hadn't ejected my last spent shell. I mark the bird and we start that way. It landed in a CRP tree planting, which is much different cover than the mix of milo and warm season grasses they plant the birds in. AT this point, the bird has it's track shoes on... It took a while, but we finally get in pinned, flushed, and shot. He brought it mostly back to me and it was more than a touch tenderized... That said, Hank kept in search mode and didn't seem to waver on the task. I think the wind was just strong enough for him to keep getting whiff's of the bird that he never quit working the cover. I was pretty pleased with that part as mostly on these types of deals it's a very short search for birds.

Back to the first bird. We make it over to near where I had marked the first bird. Hank did great navigating the frozen wetland. I did too for the most part, until I found a few spots not quite frozen enough for my weight... It took him a bit to work out the scent, but eventually we got it worked out and the bird pointed, shot, and retrieved. This one was less 'tenderized'!

All in all, it turned out to a a productive training day. He had to work some scent trails out and to pin down a runner. I'd call it progress!

The kids schedule has been making it tough for Hank and I to get in much bird work. On Tuesday, we headed out to the conservation club. He's always so full of energy to start with I've taken to getting him a run/walk in prior to putting any birds out. I've been using this time to work on recall and range. He generally does okay with both, but does tend to range farther than I'd like. If I felt more confident/comfortable with his pointing I don't think the range he wants to be at would be a problem, but we're not quite on the same page yet. After our walk, I put out a pigeon in a launcher and took him on a circuitous route downwind. Though he's not consistent with it, but he picked up the scent about 50 yards from the bird and quartered into the wind and locked up on point. He held it for a good couple of minutes as I made it a point to take my time getting up to him and flushing the bird. It was a good day.

Yesterday I took him back out to the club for more of the same. However, two other members were there and I scrapped my plans and worked with them. Though a bit earlier than normal, there are quite a few woodcock in this part of IN right now. We had 3 dogs out, all under 2yrs of age. In 90 minutes we put 13 woodcock in the air! Hank didn't really lock up and appeared to have no idea of how to back the other dogs points, but he hunted hard and got the scent of a new bird in his nose. I hope to get him back out there soon to see if he can figure out the woodcock on his own. Great experience, but I won't lie and say I was "happy" with how he did. As well as he's been pointing pigeons I was hoping he'd do a bit better. Maybe next time...

Saturday Hank and I did a "fun hunt trial" as hosted by the Indianapolis chapter of the Ruffed Grouse Society. Long story short, you and the dog are judged on your ability to find, point, shoot, and retrieve 2 pheasants in a 20min run. I'm not real sure on all the criteria, but they were not required to be steady to flush, but did need to be staunch to point. They only had to retrieve to within 6' of the handler. Basically, I looked at it as a fun day to meet some folks, get Hank a run in, and see some dogs work.

It was very windy on Saturday, so it seemed to be hit or miss on how well the dogs were finding the birds. This was making me a bit nervous as older, more experienced dogs were not finding their 2 birds in the allotted time. When it was our turn, we headed down the field, perpendicular to the wind. Shortly thereafter, Hank starts getting birdy and bang. Point! He made a short lunge and repointed. The bird was moving on him, but he held the second time. I flushed it and dropped it with one shot. He retrieved it to hand! We worked the rest of the field down and back the other way. He got birdy a few times, but never went on point. Mind you there had been 7 runs prior to this, so there had been a lot of birds planted, shot, and running around before we hit the field. Hank got about 80 yards out on the last loop through the field, started getting birdy and hit a point. I could tell he wasn't super sure as his tail was still wagging. As I closed the distance he locked up. I moved in to flush the bird and nothing. He repositioned slightly once I got between him and where he was pointing. Then I saw the hen scurrying through the grass. He held and she flushed. I tipped her with the first shot and again with the second. She lit in a tree at the woodline about 75yds away, then fell. Hank ran into the trees, found her and was on his way back with he flushed another bird! He dropped the bird he had and gave that hen chase. I was able to get him stopped, he came back to the dropped bird and brought it to me. Not quite to hand as once he got to me he spit it out at my feet. It was over 70º at this time and he was panting pretty hard, but I was still a bit discouraged he didn't hang on to it for another 10 seconds.

We didn't come home with any hardware as a few of the things he did were not great for scoring (staunchness and dropping the bird), but I was tickled pink! He found the birds, pointed them (for the most part), I actually hit them, and he brought them to me. He did great quartering the field and covered the ground and cover very well. We're far from done, but it was a good show of how far he (we?) have come. Once home I celebrated with a beer or 3 and the boys made sure Hank got plenty of treats. It was a good day!

Hank is going to be introduced to an E/training collar soon, so I have a question. How much range is needed for training purposes? There is a model I am very interested in with a range of 1/2 mile, but they state that on flat ground they've had it work a bit farther. Reason I'm interested in this make/model is that I still use a launcher for birds and this one works with that launcher. Meaning one remote can work both the collar and the launcher.

So, you guys that have used E collars for pointing dogs, is 800yds or 1/2 mile enough range?

I trained with whistle and collar. The problem I encountered was when I hunted with other hunters and they used whistles or on publics areas and hunters in the general vicinity used whistles. Too confusing for the dog and I tried to find a whistle with a unique sound. I noticed pressured birds, especially pheasants and chukars, seemed to use dog whistle as a warning system and exit the area when they hear it. I like to hunt as quiet as possible and even limit voice commands.

I use a collar with beep function for mostly dog safety reasons

I just let the dog hunt and maybe make a few corrections a day or when I need her to heel when trying to enter an area walk a distance and not spook pressured birds.

I train my train and expect my dogs to hunt with me and not hunt for themselves. I expect the dog to know here I am and look back and hunt together.

A pet peeve of mine is hunting with professionally dogs who take off after released from truck and run ahead and keep busting birds. A lot of times I am watching guys' dogs busting birds a 100 or 200 yds ahead and they are not even paying attention to their dogs. Arrrhhhg!

I think 1/2 mile is ok with your breed if not a big ranging dog

I use 1 mile when I had gsp's and pointers

I recently went to a GPS collar

ribka- Thanks for the advice/info. I've been given advice elsewhere on the GPS collar, but they are just more than I want to/can spend right now. I doubt Hank has ever been more than 1/2 mile from me when hunting, except for once. He took off after a jackrabbit in ND.

I'll probably still try to use a whistle as well for a backup and to help with recall for my wife. Hank doesn't like to come to her as readily as he does for me.

Something I didn't mention in the previous post about the fun hunt trial, is that Hank did not munch on the retrieved birds. I have been playing more fetching games with bumpers, which may have helped. I was just happy he didn't munch the darn things. Will be shooting some pigeons over him this weekend, so we'll see if that good news continues.

Got in a bit of water work yesterday in anticipation of see how he does with live ducks in a couple of weeks. He LOVES the water and seems to almost prefer retrieving out of it than on land... Any who, I don't know who enjoyed the lesson more, the dog or my helpers!

good stuff,,,,I'm beginnging a similar journey with a new drahthaar,,,,,she's 13 weeks old and we are learning,,,,,,,I've been a dog man for 40+ years but always hounds and one lab,,,,,but now a new friend,,,,,

thanks for sharing your journey

Good luck with the DD!! The ones I've been around are GREAT hunting dogs. Looks like I got bit by the photobucket monster. Thread is quite lame now without the pics...

Enjoyed reading about the journey with your new dog. My wife convinced me to get a male GWP pup this Feb. Our 3 yr old GWP female took to him immediately. Now they play together and hunt the property. Looking forward to the quail opener this Oct. Lots of training to do in the meantime.
Snake avoidance training next saturday.

I would encourage you to get a tracking collar. I realize they are pricey but should you loose a dog, as I did before those collars were available, the agony of trying to find the dog makes the collar worth far more than any money you have to spend. Dealing with a lost dog for a few days will turn you inside out. This is something no one needs to endure any longer. Sure your dog won't wander off but all it takes is once! Heck he could fall into a mine shaft (as a friend's did in Montana) or some other strange situation. How would you find him?

It can be an invaluable tool as you will know if the dog is on point when out of sight and you won't encourage him to return via buzzer or whistle. In heavy cover you will know what the dog is doing and if he has suddenly come across a deer and is chasing it.

AZ- Thanks for the kudos and good luck with the new pup! I'd love to get Hank to AZ to see if he could figure out quail there without getting ever sticker and spine in the country inside him. I've hunted Gambels on foot without a dog and Mearns with a guide. Quite the experiences, both of them!

Dang I sure wish your pics would show up! Stupid photobucket!! Pudelpointer is on our short list

Last weekend was another training day. Had ordered a couple of ducks to get him some experience with them. First one we taped the wings up and let go on dry land. He flinched, but then caught on that what we wanted. Got 2 retrieves out of that bird... Next one just had the flight feathers plucked and set loose on the water. Took him a bit to catch up to him, but boy did he seem to like it!! Got 3 live retrieves from that bird...

Here's Hank bringing back his first water retrieved duck.
Untitled

hank seems to be coming along great!

Thanks! I'm happy with his progress considering the limited time I have to work with him due mostly to kids activities. Lately we've been working on "steady" to flush with the bumpers in the yard. He's kinda getting it, but then will get too excited and take off before I can give the "fetch" command.

This past weekend, I joined a guy from the local conservation club in Michigan's UP for Hank and I's first attempt at ruffed grouse. The country and birds are much different than the planted birds we hunt at home or the CRP/shelterbelts we hunted pheasants in North Dakota last year. This is the cover we were seeking out and where we were finding birds.
Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr

Wary birds and cover like that means that you can get a lot of birds ups and not a lot of shot opportunities and many times not even a glimpse of the flush, just the sound. The guy I went with has two Braque Fracais and we usually ran Hank with the female. She's older and has a pretty good grasp of how to hunt this cover and these birds. This was good for me as I could see how she was reacting and then could guage how Hank would react when covering the same ground. He would usually get birdy where she did and you could tell he was picking up something in the same places, which was good news for me. The first day, Hank got his first point in...of a dead bird! lol Guy shot and we didn't see the bird go down, we worked forward and all of the sudden Hank turned inside out and POINT! The bird was dead, but it was a treat to see that light bulb come on. Later that same day, after bumping a few prematurely, he finally struck a point on a woodcock. They were out of season, but it was fun to see him pick up on another species.

The final morning, we hunted Hank by himself to see how he'd do. When alone, he didn't range out quite as far, but he did hunt and work the cover well. In about an hour and half he put up three grouse, two that he pointed; the last was which was a blast to watch. These ruffeds run more than I had ever seen the ones in UT and ID do. Hank started getting birdy and lined out a bit on a track. POINT! I moved in and he moved up. Nothing. We kept working it and about 20yards later he pointed again! Once more of that same routine and he finally got the bird pinned. He locked up as well as he does (he's far from a stylish point) and the bird got up. I had a bit of shot opportunity, but didn't connect. Regardless it was great to see him doing it seemingly well and on his own.

In summary, we didn't bag a lot of birds, but we moved quite a bit birds. The weather was unseasonably hot which resulted in many more mosquito's than anticipated. Hank does not like to hunt too long at 80º. It was a new experience for both of us and a good time. I'd like to get back there or to similar country and try it later in the year with the leaves off and possibly some snow on the ground. Some things we need to work on; steadiness to point. He broke point a bit more than he should. Once to the point of flushing then proceeding to catch a fat, lazy woodcock. He's still crowding birds a bit too much, but I'm not sure how I can help him figure that out. I think wild birds, if given enough exposure to them, will teach him that. And lastly, some basic obedience. His recall was great! Even coming to the tone of the ecollar. Heel was good enough to not get him in trouble in the field. Being better at heel and stay would have gotten him into less trouble at the cabin. I was pretty darn tickled how he did. He's far from finished or even a good hunting dog, but he's getting better, he's mine, and we had fun!

Hank's 1st and 2nd ruffed grouse!
DSCN2148 by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr
DSCN2156 by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr

Other shots from the trip
Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr
Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr
Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr
[img]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4363/37344273925_81af5cbb60_b.jpg[/img]Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr

Upon seeing this one, my boys were like "Hank's wrestling! He's putting in the half-Nelson!"... :rolleyes:
[img]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4419/37153216876_3c58fe8a85_b.jpg[/img]Untitled by Tyler Staggs, on Flickr

Looks like he is turning into a great dog. In the cover you were in, I'd never touch a feather on a grouse.

It's tough shooting that's for sure. Not sure if great is the proper adjective, but we have fun and every once in a while get something killed.

Though I don't get to do it as often as I'd like, but it makes me smile watching how happy a dog is doing what they were bred/trained to do. It's easy to tell by watching them that they are doing what they were meant to do.