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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,119 |
My RAR-Predator in 204 is amazingly accurate for a mostly factory specs rifle. MOA or better with Hornady 40 grain VMax factory ammo from day one.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 47,948
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 47,948 |
Perhaps they felt sorry for Winchester? Fu ck those Portuguese bastids... Why?? You should of formed a group and bought them back in 2005 when they shut the plant down lol oh Lawrence you crack me up... QC really sucked on the post 2000 USRAC model 70's. You of all people should know that....  . Pass the Ruger m77 MKII or Hawkey please. I'm surprised an army guy like you would condone buying chit that's made out of the country like the new model 70's. Unless you are half Portuguese... What are you not telling us John???
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,340
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,340 |
I've never owned a M77 in any flavor but I've handled many, shot a few and mounted scopes on quite a few. If the right deal presented itself I would get one and slap a Timney in it. IMO they are better made than any Savage I've seen lately, the American, 700 SPS and Tikka. Not that say a Tikka isn't just as accurate but I do believe M77's are better made.
Don't roll those bloodshot eyes at me.
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,364
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2010
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Perhaps they felt sorry for Winchester? Fu ck those Portuguese bastids... Why?? You should of formed a group and bought them back in 2005 when they shut the plant down lol oh Lawrence you crack me up... QC really sucked on the post 2000 USRAC model 70's. You of all people should know that.... . Pass the Ruger m77 MKII or Hawkey please. I'm surprised an army guy like you would condone buying chit that's made out of the country like the new model 70's. Unless you are half Portuguese... What are you not telling us John??? Country of origin isn't the problem. Bought too much stuff that was blessed by Uncle Sam (ITAR), that was utterly worthless. Money squandered. Spare us your Xenophobia - the good old days of Pre 64's are gone The Hawkeye and M70 Classic are latter day imitations that have been re-designed for more frugal mass manufacture. Problem is that they are not beeing purchased en-mass, because there are cheaper mass produceable designs with slimmer cost per unit and consequently higher volume of sales with better margins. They all get the job done - ask Bambi - Rant Off
History May Not Repeat, But it Rhymes.
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
It seems obvious that Ruger put some good thought into certain aspects of the RAR. I don't recall where I first read about the way the idea for the rifle was conceived, but I picture it happening around a campfire....with a few adult beverages. I can easily picture the magazine being an "after-a-few" concept. It's just so "short cut" in design, not to mention difficult to load. Good magazines (like the 10/22's) are a thing to behold. Poor magazines just ruin otherwise good guns.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 973
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2014
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The RAR is about 12 steps below a Hawkeye in terms of reliability and quality based on my experience. I have had one of each and the magazine on the American is the reason I will not own another most likely. What a cheap POS.
Eat moose, burn spruce
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,891
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2009
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The Hawkeye All Weather didn't fail. Ruger's marketing and design departments failed the Hawkeye.
The design guys should have figured that the customers wanting a hard core hunting rifle would have preferred a better synthetic rather than the craptasticly ugly laminated stock. With a heavy duty, synthetic stock that looked better than the factory synthetic that looked fresh from the Fischer Price mold line, Ruger could have sold the Hawkeyes to a different audience.
Which brings me to the marketing guys. The Ruger M77/Mk II/Hawkeye seemed to have originally been sold to the public as a reasonably priced, tough rifle for Joe Everyman. At some point, the rifle got priced out of poor Joe's budget, only to be replaced by cheap plastic crapola (aka the RAR). So instead of rebranding the Hawkeye as a hard use rifle, Ruger has set up the Hawkeye line as an outlet for the old fogies who still like controlled round feed, blued metal, quaint old chamberings, and wood stocks.
The discontinuation of the Hawkeye All Weather is very unfortunate for those who want the most bullet-proof rifle design out there, as the combination of open trigger, controlled round feed, stainless construction, and built-in scope bases was just about as tough as a guy could ask for. Yet the SS Hawkeye is no more, outside the used gun rack and for a short time the catalog of CDNN.
Get one while you can, for I see nothing as hardy on the market.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
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RAR is a backyard hunting rifle, I'll take a 77 anywhere.
The magazines in the RAR are truly the weak point.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
![[Linked Image]](http://www.hunt101.com/data/550/medium/IMG_008917.JPG) I would place money on a bet that Ruger would sell a bunch of those old Skel-stock stainless rifles if they decided to build a run in some of the common standard calibers. Heck, they'd make money just selling those stocks if they'ed squirt out a run of them from time to time. I'd buy 3 or 4 just so my boys would each have one solid, go-anywhere "forever" rifle.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,635
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,635 |
Selling two 77 MKII this spring out of the four I still own.. Could never warm up to them.. Only keeping the .358 Frontier becuz it fits in my 250 kawi's handle bars so well. Need to send a the early model 7.62X39 to Ruger repair for excessive headspace then will be selling it also.. Glad all you folks like them and thanks to this thread I won't by shy asking a pretty penny for the ones I sell.. 
It's a great life if you don't weaken..
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
The Hawkeye All Weather didn't fail. Ruger's marketing and design departments failed the Hawkeye.
The design guys should have figured that the customers wanting a hard core hunting rifle would have preferred a better synthetic rather than the craptasticly ugly laminated stock. With a heavy duty, synthetic stock that looked better than the factory synthetic that looked fresh from the Fischer Price mold line, Ruger could have sold the Hawkeyes to a different audience.
Which brings me to the marketing guys. The Ruger M77/Mk II/Hawkeye seemed to have originally been sold to the public as a reasonably priced, tough rifle for Joe Everyman. At some point, the rifle got priced out of poor Joe's budget, only to be replaced by cheap plastic crapola (aka the RAR). So instead of rebranding the Hawkeye as a hard use rifle, Ruger has set up the Hawkeye line as an outlet for the old fogies who still like controlled round feed, blued metal, quaint old chamberings, and wood stocks.
The discontinuation of the Hawkeye All Weather is very unfortunate for those who want the most bullet-proof rifle design out there, as the combination of open trigger, controlled round feed, stainless construction, and built-in scope bases was just about as tough as a guy could ask for. Yet the SS Hawkeye is no more, outside the used gun rack and for a short time the catalog of CDNN.
Get one while you can, for I see nothing as hardy on the market.
Fascinating to watch the race to the bottom isn't it? 
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,530
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2008
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I would place money on a bet that Ruger would sell a bunch of those old Skel-stock stainless rifles if they decided to build a run in some of the common standard calibers. Heck, they'd make money just selling those stocks if they'ed squirt out a run of them from time to time. I'd buy 3 or 4 just so my boys would each have one solid, go-anywhere "forever" rifle. I bought a boat paddle 300WM in 98 for around $365 out the door. That stock is way ahead of what Ruger is doing now. The trigger is garbage but I can still manage to shoot it just fine
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
I would place money on a bet that Ruger would sell a bunch of those old Skel-stock stainless rifles if they decided to build a run in some of the common standard calibers. Heck, they'd make money just selling those stocks if they'ed squirt out a run of them from time to time. I'd buy 3 or 4 just so my boys would each have one solid, go-anywhere "forever" rifle. I bought a boat paddle 300WM in 98 for around $365 out the door. That stock is way ahead of what Ruger is doing now. The trigger is garbage but I can still manage to shoot it just fine The rifle in that pic, a 223, ended up going along on a trip we took up the Yukon River late one winter. It became part of the emergency kit that rode the sled pulled by a snowmchine for 500 miles - along the coastal ice of the Bering Sea and the frozen Yukon. Upon returning home, there was a death in the family and the emergency package: rifle, come-a-long, magnesium snow shoes, rope- all ended up staying bound inside that tarp until returned. Then we moved and the sled got loaded up, the bundle staying intact. By the time that bundle was removed and opened, more than 2 months had passed. Of course snow had found its way into the bundle over that 500 mile trip so everything was wet. But aside from a bit of rust on the screws on the scope, and a couple of pins in the working beneath the stock, nothing was the worse for wear. I wiped the moisture off, oiled it up again, and it was good to go.
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,119
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,119 |
Selling two 77 MKII this spring out of the four I still own.. Could never warm up to them.. Only keeping the .358 Frontier becuz it fits in my 250 kawi's handle bars so well. Need to send a the early model 7.62X39 to Ruger repair for excessive headspace then will be selling it also.. Glad all you folks like them and thanks to this thread I won't by shy asking a pretty penny for the ones I sell.. Has your 77 MK2 in 7.62x39 always had headspace issues? I can't imagine how you could generate enough pressure, enough times, to set the locking lugs back on a 77 MK2 with that small a combustion chamber.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,085
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,085 |
If anything specific, I'd say competition from Tikka. The T3 Lite stainless is lighter, easier handling, smoother bolt in the store, smoother/prettier finish on the metal and much nicer fit and finish on the stock. I thought Tikka was discontinuing the T3 ??
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,085
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,085 |
I would place money on a bet that Ruger would sell a bunch of those old Skel-stock stainless rifles if they decided to build a run in some of the common standard calibers. Heck, they'd make money just selling those stocks if they'ed squirt out a run of them from time to time. I'd buy 3 or 4 just so my boys would each have one solid, go-anywhere "forever" rifle. I bought a boat paddle 300WM in 98 for around $365 out the door. That stock is way ahead of what Ruger is doing now. The trigger is garbage but I can still manage to shoot it just fine You guys are going to make a Polar bear mad if you keep doing that.
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 13,649
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 13,649 |
The Hawkeye All Weather didn't fail. Ruger's marketing and design departments failed the Hawkeye.
The design guys should have figured that the customers wanting a hard core hunting rifle would have preferred a better synthetic rather than the craptasticly ugly laminated stock. With a heavy duty, synthetic stock that looked better than the factory synthetic that looked fresh from the Fischer Price mold line, Ruger could have sold the Hawkeyes to a different audience.
Which brings me to the marketing guys. The Ruger M77/Mk II/Hawkeye seemed to have originally been sold to the public as a reasonably priced, tough rifle for Joe Everyman. At some point, the rifle got priced out of poor Joe's budget, only to be replaced by cheap plastic crapola (aka the RAR). So instead of rebranding the Hawkeye as a hard use rifle, Ruger has set up the Hawkeye line as an outlet for the old fogies who still like controlled round feed, blued metal, quaint old chamberings, and wood stocks.
The discontinuation of the Hawkeye All Weather is very unfortunate for those who want the most bullet-proof rifle design out there, as the combination of open trigger, controlled round feed, stainless construction, and built-in scope bases was just about as tough as a guy could ask for. Yet the SS Hawkeye is no more, outside the used gun rack and for a short time the catalog of CDNN.
Get one while you can, for I see nothing as hardy on the market.
My father was not a "gun guy" by any stretch of the imagination. However, for a college graduation present he wanted to get me a rifle I could hunt anything with, anywhere. I unboxed a Ruger MKII SS/Lam in 338 Win Mag on his bed of the Ben Hur motel after commencement. I think he got it pretty close to right. Only thing I don't really care for is the weight as it is heavy. That said, it's never not worked.
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,697 |
Where are all these cheap close out All Weathers located at??I am not finding them.
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
― Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man's Fear
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052 |
One of the basic truths of hunting rifle sales is that the U.S. is more than half the world market, and 90% of American hunters primarily hunt varmints and whitetails--and the whitetails mostly from stands. Most aren't rifle loonies, so don't care about controlled-round feed, integral magazines, fine metal finish, or "better" stocks, whether walnut or synthetic. Instead they want a rifle that will go bang accurately for the lowest price.
Which is why RAR's out-sell Hawkeyes.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,518
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,518 |
Give me thirty minutes with a Ruger and it'll make you forget the Tikka trigger.
#1, I'm not anti Ruger. #2, I can only speak for MY Tikka, There's not any better trigger than on my T3 Lite SS No offense. Jerry No offense taken. The point I was indirectly making is that with the open design of the Ruger trigger, (as compared to the current trend toward enclosed boxes) a few minutes work with a good Arkansas stone makes it nice and light and as crisp as a shooter could want. As is obvious, I am a M77 fan. I currently own two of the Hawkeye All-Weather models. (223 and 308) and am told that I need a 243 for when I get old; I'm 72. It will probably also be a M77, either Mark II or Hawkeye in All-Weather form, if I can find one. There is something very desirable to me about an all-steel, well designed rifle, USA made, that will last several lifetimes.
If we live long enough, we all have regrets. But the ones that nag at us the most are the ones in which we know we had a choice.
Doug
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