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Have you looked at the Nitto Exo Grapplers? On my Super Duty they have worked real well so far, but only have about 10,000 miles on them. Just a little more aggressive than the Terra Grapplers.
Lost about 1 mpg from the factory Michelins.


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Good to hear about them. If they only lost a single MPG that's a testament to the engineering of their rolling resistance.

I had not considered them, I'll go have another look at their site thanks


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Jim,

I ran BFG's KM2's MT's for 60k miles on my Toyota.

I then bought some Toyo Open Country MT's of which are on
my truck now. Gas mileage went down and road noise went up.

I still like the Toyo tire as it does perform as expected.


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The Performance of my Toyo tires has been flawless! They now have 35,000 miles so they have gone beyond functional use on my truck. Since it's been mostly used off road on the ranch I was not concerned about driving with this level of wear. Funny thing is that with the limited slips axles front and rear and these completely worn out tires I was never stuck or worried about getting stuck! These monster tires are flawless offroad even totally worn out!

The fuel mileage is the issue for the next year. Those big 37" X 13.50 tires dropped my MPG by a huge percentage. They weigh 90 plus pounds each. Combined with a high rolling resistance of the aggressive tread design.

I have several trips coming this year across the USA and Canada pulling my 22 foot travel trailer. I'm looking for a 37" tire to keep my gear ratios proper, but need a far less aggressive tread to bump my MPG back up. I've also realized that this truck does not need super aggressive tires to drive wherever I need to go. As just experienced with the thread bare Toyo's I have now. All four tires turning with marginal traction greatly trumps one tire with great deep aggressive treads in the front turning and one in the back turning.

No tires or lift kits, can surpass limited slips ( or lockers) front and rear. interesting little story, I saw a suburu forester and a Jeep fooling around in a safeway parking lot that was being snow plowed. That forester was driving up and over the snow banks with the jeep doing the same. Then the suburu went over a flat deep spot that was 40 yards wide and 20-24" deep, he spun and twisted and struggled and popped out the other side. The jeep wrangler followed him and got buried..... stuck solid. The fella in the forester drove up next to him stopped, chatted a bit, and then drove through again! He began doing laps around the guy in the jeep while rooster tails of snow were shooting up from one front and one rear tire of the Jeep!

That was a great example of four wheel drive that actually uses all four wheels with power, VS the open diffs on a Wrangler. Even though the vehicles have such different designs for off road use. I'm sure that guy in the wrangler was baffled at how that puny underpowered small tire low ground clearance suburu could show him up in his mighty jeep wrangler.

So back to the topic. I need a 37" minimal aggressive tire for the next few years. I was getting 16MPG plus with the BFG AT's. They just got squirrely at 30,000. Probably a better tire for a 1/2 ton gas truck. The heavy diesel might be a bit too much?

The Nitto terra grappler, and the coopers maxx seem like the guys to beat now. The evo's don't come in 37" The Yokohama geolanders make a perfect tire, however I've never seen or known of this brand. I'm nervous to buy a tire I've never heard of. Both the Nitto's and the cooper are American made.


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That's one of the 1st things I did to my Wrangler was pull the open diffs and install detroit truetracs front and back. The traction difference is night and day and works beautifully with the BLD system already on the Jeep.



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Geolanders are a great tire. Their ATs are not an aggressive tread pattern at all, but they stick well. I've never run them on a heavy truck though.

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Do the Toyo's have 3 ply sidewalls like the BFG's?


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I can't really add much Jim, but I can say that locally, Toyo and Coopers have a solid rep. The BFG KOII's are considered the toughest off road tires out there now.
At least that's what I hear from my local tire dealer. I've known them and lots of their customers for several years and they have the rep of being straight shooters when it comes to tire advice.
Are you likely to encounter much in the way of icy roads where you'll be going ? I ask because alot of off road designs don't do well on icy roads. E

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Well, ice is where you accidentally find it.... ha ha!

Aside from the Geolander there are no Highway tires in 37 inch height that I know of.

The least aggressive tread at 37" are the BFG AT KO 2, the terra grappler 2, the Cooper Maxx, and the Yokohama geolander.

My BFG's which were the previous tire to these were fine in all conditions. Just went bad on me at about 30,000 miles. Lots of tread remaining, but wobble and steering drifting, just uncomfortable. I think they were just too lightly constructed for a diesel engine? No science or other opinions, just my feeling.


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Hi Jim,

Been a long time since we have talked. I read in your thread your desire for 37 inch tires. I look at this somewhat differently, as there are other considerations not included in the discussion that are important to long distance trailer towing.
If I did my calculations correctly you have an effective or nominal 3.55 equivalency for a final gear ratio with the 37 inch tires compared to stock. However the tire weight would make a loading or inertia comparison to a higher final axle ratio in terms of torque required to get things in motion. Not so?

You have a engine rpm target in mind and at a certain mph. If that rpm is on the low side of the torque band you may need to apply more fuel which increases exhaust gas and transmission temperatures beyond that which is desirable, especially when in mid-western mountain states. If you need to shift down one gear to change loading, and reduce those 2 temperatures, one might do better with tires of less diameter, better handling, braking, and aerodynamic qualities by reducing truck height.

One of the greatest contributors to fuel economy while towing is driving slower. Doing may put you below that desired rpm if you are geared tall. Pushing the speed up to get into the sweet spot on rpm may be counter productive due to air resistance. If I'm correct, your trailer model is a full 8ft+ wide and many trailers on the road are only 7.5 feet wide, for comparison.
It all adds up.

Another consideration about vehicle gearing and desired road speed is trailer tire specifications. Many trailers come equipped with tires that leave less than 1000 lbs capacity above dry trailer weight. Add H20 (sometimes down the road one ends up with it in all three tanks) plus food, drink and gear and the trailer can be loaded beyond tire ratings very easily. Combine that with temperatures and speed (beyond rating)and tires overheat and fail on the road.

While my discussion isn't answering the question of best tire to buy in that particular size, I believe it constructive to the driving theme of fuel economy and towing and some of the other related considerations of travel trailer efficiency on the road.

Happy Trails,

Marv











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I have 4:11 axle ratios with standard ratios being 3.73 if I recall correctly hence the choice for 37" tires. I pull this 22' trailer up every mountain pass and don't even know it's behind me usually just under 2000 RPM

The Cummins diesel works great at pulling trailers!


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Yah, I hear you on the power, and nothing against the Cummins. I believe it is the mark to beat among diesel pickup truck engines. I just thought the driving topic was fuel economy and towing. Hence the dialog.

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My Rpm with the 35" tires I had ( second set after truck was new) was 2200 rpm at 65mph

When I switched to the BFG AT 37" tires my RPM dropped to 1900rpm and my fuel economy stayed exactly the same. Seems that the additional weight and inertia was a wash for the drop in RPM. I had the Odometer and speedometer reprogrammed to the tire size in each case. It was confirmed with my GPS

Staying with the same diameter but going way up in width and weight with the toys MT's My MPG dropped big time! The drop in RPM could not overcome the massive size and rolling resistance of those huge Toyo MT's

So I need to head back to the lighter D rated tires like those I have mentioned. The least aggressive is typically the least rolling resistance however that is not always the case because of the rubber compounds and if they are snow rated. Snow rated tires usually have the highest rolling resistance because the compounds are softer.

Visually the geolander is the smoothest tread pattern, hence the lowest rolling resistance. Don't know much about Yokohama beyond this.

The coopers are 400 bucks a set cheaper then the Nitto's. However you can suck up 400 bucks in fuel pretty quick so that alone is not the decision maker. I do like the reviews and performance of the coopers. Although on the cummins diesel forum there seems to be a lot of folks that really like the Nitto Terra Grapplers too.

One other thought, the Nitto's are 36 ish in height not actually the 37 marked. The others are all 36.8 to 37" tall. Maybe the slightly shorter 36" tire makes the best sense?


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There is some interesting information in: "When I switched to the BFG AT 37" tires my RPM dropped to 1900rpm and my fuel economy stayed exactly the same."

If this reference is when hauling the Lance camper or when driving unloaded, it would tell you different things and would point one toward the best tire diameter for loaded towing.

Did your mileage increase from the factory tires to the first oversize? Factory tires probably 32 or so?

I bet the exhaust gas temp was lower when pulling more rpm. More air and same fuel. Cooler. Longer life? More reciprocating wear? Shorter life?

If your truck has a instant fuel consumption meter it would interesting to drive a given section of roadway in overdrive while pulling the loaded trailer and then again in the next lower gear and compare the readout, even at several mph readings. Could tell alot on gearing and especially helpful if you know the actual transmission gear ratios. A little number work and you'd have the correct tire diameter for your desires.

If I would buy a 37 inch tire (roadwork) it would be narrow in profile. That will also help.

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The narrower tire is definitely better those toyos are wide. They say 13.5" but visually they dwarf a 12.5" BFG

I won't go over 12.5 on this truck again. My truck had an automatic so controlling speed at a given gear ratio is harder.


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However it turns out, you should have a great time on the road. Drive safe.

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Oh one other thing. At the time of the change to the BFG's from the 35" tires I owned a Lance pickup camper. The BFG tires are D rated and max at 50PSI

They were wobbly and horrible to drive with that 1800-2000b camper on the truck. One of the reasons I had to move to the big Toyo's. They were one of the few 37" E rated tires. Huge improvement in handling that camper!

Now that the camper is sold, and replaced with the 22' 6000b trailer I have a 600b tongue weight. I can get by easily again with D rated tires. Much better ride and much lighter tires.


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You still need high pressure and stiff sidewalls. The trailer will push you around also, especially in crosswinds. Probably not so much as with the camper. We noticed that and upgraded to E tires too.

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It's interesting that 37" D rated tires have a higher capacity then 35" E rated tires.

I do like the idea of E rated truck tires. Also 35" tires open up countless options. Some 35" tires are actually 35" too. Where some 37" tires are well short of 37"..

The 35" Toyo AT2 my neighbor has have 50,000 miles and look really good like he could put another 30,000 on them.


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The Geolanders are a solid tire. Not too noisy, good grip, and they wear well. Couldn't say about mpg.


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