Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting Which domestic dog breed can hold its own against Wolves?

There is only one breed that could kill a wolf, often used in Roman times by them to kill lions in the arena and that is the Bull Mastiff.

Might be picking lint, but for what it is worth, the Bull Mastiff breed, as I recall, is a fairly recent breed resulting in crossing bulldogs with mastiffs (60/40 or 40/60?).

They were developed to help catch poachers from taking game from the lands of the noble classes (dukes, earls, lords, etc).

The Neopolitan mastiff is supposed to be more of a direct descendent from the ancient Romon Molosus (sp) that was used in the arenas against wild animals, Christians, etc.

I certainly think the list of dogs that can kill a wolf is short.

But certainly not limited to one breed.

Since this post is never going to die. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Methinks individual dogs of several breeds (or even curs) might be able to kill a single wolf (provided it is the right wolf).

But a big alpha wolf in his prime, might be more than a match for any single dog (regardless of breed).

Does anyone have any historical accounts of wolf vs. dog fights? I know one poster referenced a book that had some info on wolf/dog fights, but if he has the book, I for one, would like to hear about some of the accounts.

his is about the caucasion:

Volkodavs are capable of killing the wolf, a leopard, a bear. AS TO THE WOLF- IT IS ABSOLUTELY TRUE, and with the others named, they fly into a rage... Yes, some experts mention duels of these dogs with young leopards and the same young bears, but authors are inclined to count real combat between the dogs and leopards and bears as legends. The bear is capable of killing with one blow of his paw a dog of any breed. Representatives of large cats easily cope with dogs with teeth which are the instrument of murder, and with equally dangerous claws. And last circumstance is especially important: dogs are absolutely not prepared to counter the techniques of conducting combat by cats - The impacts by the hind legs are capable of instantly opening the belly.

http://www.dogforce.com/facts_fiction.htm

I read the stories in the link. Interesting, but very biased by a breeder and big time fan of the breed.

It would be nice to read an actual account of a fight.

This is some excerpts from "The Dog Pit" published in 1888 and written by a man with 30 years experience in dog fighting in the US and considered to be an expert in the field. It should be noted that he uses "bulldog" and "bull terrier" interchangably to refer to a dog that has been bred from full-blooded english bulldogs and english hounds and are used for fighting, rat killing, and bear badgering, and raccoon baiting.

The drawings of these dog (in the book) resemble today's pit bulls and american bulldogs.

In describing the breed he states:

"It has always been acknowledged that the bulldog is the most ugly and unrelenting of the canine breed. He will attack any animal, no matter that it be lion or tiger. It is strange yet a fact that the brain of a bulldog is smaller than that of any other animal."

What I find interesting is that the pitbull fans will gladly believe and quote the valor of the animal, but generally will not abscribe to the part about the it having the smallest brain of any animal. The book make for an interesting read though.

PS If anyone wants this book, e-mail me and I will send it to free first-come first-served. (It's about the size of the Colorado fishing regs).

Bull Mastiffs are nothing more than a cross between an English Bulldog, (which has a hard time getting out of it's own way) and a Mastiff. And the Mastiffs of today are plagued by health problems.

You folks need to find out what a real game bred Pitbull is. I've never seen a Bull Mastiff yet that I thought would stand a chance against one... here's a nice 70 pounder.

Dog fighting has been going on for 100's of years. If the wolf is so bas azz, the wolf would have been used for fighting.
There are plenty of dogs that will kill a wolf on a one on one fight. No dog will survive being outnumbered by wolves

Using that logic, grizzly bears would also have been used for dog fighting by now as well.

Please, do you really think that a 70lb pit could kill a 400 pound lion? Wake up!

Bullgator,

I don't think any dog, (singular) can kill a full grown lion, Mountain or otherwise. If you had read my previous posts you would have read that I never said I thought they could. I also said I lost an excellent Walker hound to a full grown Mountain lion. I do think that Pitbull who's picture is posted above would kill a Bull Mastiff in short order. Unless the Bull Mastiff could run faster than the Pitbull!

Bull Mastiffs may look impressive, but they aren't much of a performance animal. Their bred for looks, not for work.

I don't think any Bull Mastiff would last 20 minutes with that dog who's picture I posted. I think a Bull Mastiff would start to cry for Mama in about 7 or 8 minutes. Any statements regarding how "tough" a Bull Mastiff is just demonstrates a lack of understanding of what a Game bred Pitbull dog is. A Bull Mastiff may be "tough" against a collie, but he isn't bred to fight, contrary to what you may have read. He was a dog that was "created" to look the part. I believe they were recognized by the major kennel clubs in the early 20's. The foundation stock for the creation of the Bull Mastiff was 60% Mastiff, and 40% Old English Bulldog.

Pitbulls haven't been bred to "look" the part, Game bred Pitbulls are bred strictly based upon performance. It's not any different than a Labrador that's a working dog, compared to a Labrador that's a show dog.

Two different animals. A perfect example of what happens when dogs are bred for looks is the Irish Setter.

There was a time when real Mastiffs were bred as working dogs, and if I'm not mistaken it was those dogs that were used in the Roman games. They were also used by the Roman army to attack and kill humans. But the Mastiff of today is a very different animal than those Mastiffs of long ago.

This has and is fascinating stuff. What I am going to say is said from the point of I THINK because I sure as hell don't know for sure.

I think I would agree with JB that a good fighting pitt bull would kill a wolf one on one. Mind I said a fighting dog.

The reason I say this, now remember I don't know doodly about wolves but what I read in the papers and see on film, because of the difference in fighting styles.

I know some about pitts using them as catch dogs on wild hogs.

A wolf seems to fight but the fights are short. The other wolf either gives up quick or tries to run away. Maybe a few minutes tops no more than two or three minutes.

A pitt WILL NOT QUIT FIGHTING once he starts. You damn near have to beat him sensless to make him quit or drag him off.

I THINK in a pitt/wolf fight the wolf would either try to submit or try to run after those two or three minutes of fighing. The pitt would do neither just keep fighting.

Now my ego sure ain't involved here so if I am dead wrong it won't hurt my feelings to be told so.

BCR

we have raised GAME cocks for many years.... Babcock knows of what he speaks, it isnt any different with dogs... a 12# "barnyard" rooster or a 20# wild Turkey might pound on my little 5# rooster for a few minutes but after about 10 minutes or 2 hrs , it doesnt really matter, ol "Barny" or the WT with be squallin for his momma with his head stuck in the corner.. thats why they are called GAME cocks... its how they live... 721

I bet that my wolf can beat up your chickens! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Aw heck, I wouldn't mind so much if he just beat up on 'em ... his killing them would irk me though! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Let me tie a 4in long knife on each leg and I bet it would surprise you!! He would look about like a Mt Lion had a hold of him... you have no idea... 721

I once saw a video clip of Game Cocks going at it and it was something to behold, I admit!

The modern incarnation of the Bull mastiff was as a Gamekeepers dog meant to catch poachers. These dogs were not meant to bite and hold as a GSD or even a Pitbull does, but to "pin" the poacher to the ground be dint of sheer body weight and power...

Col David Hanock, a British authority on these dogs has been trying to reserrect the working qualities of the breed, but last I heard was still not happy with the results he was getting..

Below is a link to an article by Col Hancock on the subject which gives an overview of the breed:

http://www.geocities.com/bmf_Canada/history.html

Col Hancock has also written a very good book on the subject called "Mastiffs: The Big Game Hunters, Their History, Development & Future"

An extract from the book can be see in the link below:

http://www.shaku1.com/libro.html

How is a Grizzly bear count as a dog?? WTF?

Seems like we need a new thread "Which domestic rooster can hold its own against a pheasant?"