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Ranger, What you describe isn't because the people are any better up there, it's because there's fewer of them. There's drugs, crime, low-life dirtballs, and theives in your town, even in your school. I'm not sure that isolation from other people is how you get a higher quality of life, but I understand the advantages and disadvantages.

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Yeah, there are no drugs in Montana. There is no alcoholism, no child abuse, no domestic violence. Hell, there's no poverty, no adultery, no divorce, no crime. The men are all handsome, the women pretty and kids above average.

Have you ever actually stepped foot in Maryland? It's about a 45-minute drive from my house to Baltimore... the place where "city livin'" occurs. We live in what locals call "the horse country" of Maryland, rolling green hills and fertile valleys. My neighbors are nice folks who are helpful to a fault. I don't lock my truck and have never had anything stolen. My wife, children and I have never been the victim of any crime. My wife did lose a credit card once... but, hey, in Montana if you drop your wallet on the street, someone will surely drop it by your house with a freshly-baked pie.

Here, two of my daughters have been able to attend special art magnet schools. My wife has been able to access medical help she needed at the world-class Johns Hopkins hospital. My family has kept a rural lifestyle while being able to enjoy all of the benefits of a major city. The girls have visited the World Trade Center (before and after), seen Broadway plays, stood in the Statue of Liberty and a host of other things. They have seen a universe I could only imagine or read about in books growing up in Libby.

I would like to think my wife and I would have raised three fine girls anyplace we lived. I also would like to think we would have been intelligent enough to take advantage of the good things and avoid the bad ones. Finally, I think we would have been wise enough to teach our children to appreciate home and other places in fair and equal measure... not to be pig-headed provincials adamantly and ignorantly opposed to unfamiliar lands.


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You're going to see around 80 million baby boomers retire in the next two years. The majority of them are worthless. They inherited money from their depression era relatives and they've sold out every company that they could,so their own kids are being screwed by them. In return they're moving to the west in search of their "dream" or "vision".

The first thing they do is build some 5000 sq cottage in a subdivision,then you need new roads and infrastructure to support these douche bags. All of which costs money and the county is left to generate this money by increasing taxes and fee's(building permits). All of which effects the residents of the area far more then the transplant douche bag coming in.

At one time you had a popular concept of building three homes and acting as you're own general on them. In return the sales of the first two paid for your final one. This fueled alot of these transplant [bleep] and everybody is still paying for it. And with increased costs of fee's,materials and land,the concept of three is largely undoable.

Humans are the biggest [bleep] cancer this world has ever seen.

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I would agree that your kids have experienced many things that they would likely never have had the opportunity to had they lived in rural MT. They've also missed out on many things because they don't live in rural MT, to me those things are more important.

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I agree 100% - there are compromises in any situation, I choose fewer people to deal with fewer idiots. Guess I'm not much of a social butterfly, but you can't not like having no worries.

IC B2

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You're going to see around 80 million baby boomers retire in the next two years. The majority of them are worthless. They inherited money from their depression era relatives


That might be the single stupidest thing I've read on the internet all week...

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"They've also missed out on many things because they don't live in rural MT, to me those things are more important. "


Name one. This should be a neat trick since you do not know me or my children.


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Brad, I don't recommend it, but if you go and look into the majority of Sledder's post you'll find his ignorance has yet to find its limits.

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I'm waiting for that one too... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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Brad, I don't recommend it, but if you go and look into the majority of Sledder's post you'll find his ignorance has yet to find its limits.


Troy, I'm gonna take your word on that one... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

IC B3

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Brad, You obviously haven't seen this?
http://www.glumbert.com/media/spiders

From the looks of the weather outside.. definately lion tracks and skiing. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Although I may have to shovel some sidewalks so I can afford a Big Sky lift ticket. If I still lived in NE MT, I'd be thinking about pummelling some coyotes. But hey, we got those here near Bozeman too.

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Yeah, it's easy to hate someone who legally buys and builds upon a piece of property in your area and blame them for increased tax rates. It's much harder to learn some basic economics and to make an intelligent argument about the impacts of residential housing growth.


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Campfire 'Bwana
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Kurt, where in the heck do you dig this stuff up (grin).

Yup, finally looking like what passes for winter outside... just got new three pins for my skis this week. Will screw em on and give the old tele's a turn... course Bozeman sucks and I might get accosted by a gay, baby-boom former attoreny from San Francisco who likes semi-hairless Norwegian males who kill elk and destroy MT by building overpriced houses.

Wait, there's no elk in SW Mt... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

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Don't you mean SC Mt..?

This place just plain sucks!

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Brad aren't you supposed to be blowing the doberman?

I'm sure you like the boom brad,aren't you a loan officer or janitor in a bank. Plus you work at a dairy queen also.

The greatest generation managed to parent the most worthless generation(baby boomers)

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Sledder, as Troy said, your ignorance has yet to find its limit... apparnetly you're trying tho! And, as my old man says, "don't shoot a man who's hanging himself"...

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Kurt, where in the heck do you dig this stuff up (grin).

Yup, finally looking like what passes for winter outside... just got new three pins for my skis this week. Will screw em on and give the old tele's a turn... course Bozeman sucks and I might get accosted by a gay, baby-boom former attoreny from San Francisco who likes semi-hairless Norwegian males who kill elk and destroy MT by building overpriced houses.

Wait, there's no elk in SW Mt... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />


As a guy who makes a living in the building industry AND has a real estate license (it's on ice for now), I still bemoan "riding the wave". Because future generations will pay for it in further loss of of rural western values. In many ways it's that money that is driving the loss of those values. Those who move here with it, and those of us who grew up here and chase it.

I could fill more bandwidth on the subject than Campfire is probably allowed....so I'll stop....

Now about "semi-hairless Norwegian males who kill elk..." can I watch?

Casey


Casey

Not being married to any particular political party sure makes it a lot easier to look at the world more objectively...
Having said that, MAGA.
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Casey, had a nice post but the computer goblin ate it... suffice to say, if money "is driving the loss of those values" then they were never actually values in the first place but rather an extension of the West's "Myth Of Self."

I make my living as a builder and loan officer...like you I'm "riding the wave". Truth is, however, decent people are decent no matter their place of birth and as has been pointed out Montana has its share of home-grown a-holes (apparently like sledder). I've met NYC resident's I'd rather share a campfire with than the likes of a guy like sledder.

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Lewistown is in the middle of the state.

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Casey, had a nice post but the computer goblin ate it... suffice to say, if money "is driving the loss of those values" then they were never actually values in the first place but rather an extension of the West's "Myth Of Self."[quote]

Most myths about the west and rural westerners was not created in the west, but instead by those outside who occasionally visited. Of course, we rural westerners enjoy it. But it was the thinly scattered population, and a form of independence, thanks in large part to thinly scattered and finacially limited government that couldn't do much about it. There was, in many parts of the rural west, a semi-controlled anarchy--with lots of tolerance for those who were "different", but a series of small communities that created a "network" but yet allowed the individuals and communites to be independent.

And, so many of the folks who move to the rural west are financially independent (not uber-wealthy, but well off enough). One of my biggest complaints are these folks can't "turn off" their focus on money. It's all they know. That's how they became financially independent in the first place.

The "High Country News" a pro enviromental, liberal newspaper, but that tends to champion the cause of the middle class in the west often provides some of the best insight. A wife of a ranching family wrote an excellent essay years ago, describing living here as "a deep and abiding understanding of the land". Making a living yes, but focusing on, or making a lot of money, No. It becomes easy to lose track--the west is not merely a playground--it's a "sense of place".

[quote]I make my living as a builder and loan officer...like you I'm "riding the wave". Truth is, however, decent people are decent no matter their place of birth and as has been pointed out Montana has its share of home-grown a-holes (apparently like sledder). I've met NYC resident's I'd rather share a campfire with than the likes of a guy like sledder.


Yes.
There are those who "take to" the rural values and seem to have an instinctive understanding of the rural values, and there are those (including natives who really don't appreciate where they live--but are too stupid to find their way out) that really never catch on--but instead live exactly the same way they did in the suburbs, but do it in a 5000 sq ft house on 35 acres in the foothills--driving the wheels off the Suburban going to and from the golf course.

Of all the subjects, even the best writers seem to have difficulty articulating that "sense of place". I'm not any better at it.

One of the most frustrating things to me are the urban conservatives who mistakenly believe their political values are the same as my rural values--they ain't.

Casey


Casey

Not being married to any particular political party sure makes it a lot easier to look at the world more objectively...
Having said that, MAGA.
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