24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
F
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
F
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
So, a barely literate redneck buys a couple Rapid Z 600's a few years ago. Happy redneck, scopes good, ballistic calculator website easy and instinctive, accurate results, good hits on clangers out to 600. Swapped some guns and scopes, loads, went back to the ballistic calculator...whoa, it's NEW and IMPROVED. Fritz got bored and improved it...now you better be up to speed on metric conversion, you better know your bullet's drag model and a lot of other stuff like V1 and V2?? This was a good system originally, used the simple solution of adjusting the power ring to change hashmark values to approximate your bullet path. Close enough and cheaper than ordering up a new CDS dial every time a variable was introduced. Now? Not so much. Wondering if there are any other ballistic illiterates are having fits with this calculator? Boy, my old Burris and Sightrons are lookin' better by the minute.


Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
BP-B2

Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 563
W
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
W
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 563
Why not just use the subtensions in the Zeiss manual and more intuitive calculator like JBM?

Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
F
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
F
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
Well yeah, but part of the sales pitch is the simplicity of using the Zeiss calculator and the power ring to adjust rapidly for a change in load parameters. ie: I got 220 gr roundnoses in my left pocket for which I turn the power ring to 6.5x for example, and 165 boat tails in my right pocket for which I move the power ring to 8x (just an example) I guess I'm just ranting about "new and improved, because how often do we really need this feature? But, yes you're right, the scope is still useable with old fashioned calculations.


Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
E
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
E
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
Originally Posted by flintlocke
Well yeah, but part of the sales pitch is the simplicity of using the Zeiss calculator and the power ring to adjust rapidly for a change in load parameters. ie: I got 220 gr roundnoses in my left pocket for which I turn the power ring to 6.5x for example, and 165 boat tails in my right pocket for which I move the power ring to 8x (just an example) I guess I'm just ranting about "new and improved, because how often do we really need this feature? But, yes you're right, the scope is still useable with old fashioned calculations.


SFP drop reticles are pretty amazing, but its really amazing that you have the same poi=poa for windage with two different loads


If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 14,030
O
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
O
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 14,030
Istrelok is an app that has about every reticle from every scope manufacturer in it.


There are 2 rules to success:

1. Never tell everything that you know.
IC-A B3

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
Campfire Oracle
Offline
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
I too was just using the Zeiss calculator, it was a winner. I wasn't coordinating drops with subtensions, just charting dopes for a 3-12x50mm Duralyt w/ASV turret. I could've used any ballistic calculator for this, but figured I'd check out the Zeiss. I found it very intuitive and simple to use. Hopefully they haven't "upgraded" it since.


Originally Posted by 16penny
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 296
L
LJB Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
L
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 296
The user interface changed a bit, but it appears to work fine. You can choose imperial or metric units, and you can have it calculate BC with V1 and V2 if you want (but can just enter the BC, which is pretty simple).

Zeiss published the same ballistic calculator as a smartphone app. This works pretty good too.

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
Campfire Oracle
Offline
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
I was using it on my iPad.


Originally Posted by 16penny
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
F
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
F
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
Judging from your replies, my worst fears are confirmed, they have re designed the calculator for 21st century man, leaving the 20th century computer illiterate in the dust. When I selected imperial measurement, I got metric, repeatedly. There were no drop down boxes explaining stuff like V1 and V2. I think my optics dollars will be better spent with old school equipment and the simple intuitive ballistic on line calculators. All I wanted to do was shoot different loads with the same gun and scope quickly with reasonable accuracy to 600yds which worked superbly with the "old" calculator. Didn't really want to have to take a computer tutorial to pull a trigger. It's an age thing I guess. In reality, I don't ever remember killing an animal further than 200 yards anyway. It was just kind of fun knowing you could shoot farther if the situation required. Thanks all for your input.


Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
E
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
E
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
I carry a old TI calculator to make people think I have a cell phone if that helps.

I am still amazed that your different loads have the same impact at 100 yds to be able to use the hold over reticles.


If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
IC-B B4

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 296
L
LJB Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
L
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 296
I agree - the U/I is a little clunky, but the output looks fine. Sometimes "progress" is a few steps back. Of course it shouldn't be, but in the case of Zeiss sport optics products they seem to have lost their way the past few years. The clunky new ballistics calculator internet upgrade being the latest example.

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
Campfire Oracle
Offline
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
Originally Posted by Etoh
I carry a old TI calculator to make people think I have a cell phone if that helps.

I am still amazed that your different loads have the same impact at 100 yds to be able to use the hold over reticles.


For any load data entered these ballistic calculators map yardage to reticle subtensions at various magnification settings.


Originally Posted by 16penny
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
F
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
F
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,132
Etoh, Just because I am whining about the Zeiss program doesn't mean you can't use the power ring for holdover on any hashmarked scope. Let's say you have a Sightron with the HHR reticle, or Burris Ballistic on your old '06. Looking at the ballistic chart in say a Nosler manual, we see the bullet path of a 150 ballistic tip at 2900fps is damn near a perfect fit for the HHR reticle ON 9 POWER. And it should be. But because we are loonies, we have a few 220gr roundnoses that putter along at 2200 fps, but, we can make that work just by turning the power ring to 6X which expands the value of the first hashmark (300 yds) to 15 inches of drop for the 220 from the 5 inches of drop for the 150 boat tail at 9x. Silly example but you get the point. Real world, I use fairly high bc bullets of radically differing weights and velocities and this usually only involves 7.5X and 8.5X to match my trajectories. I do the math at home and then double check on the range. Gotta love 2nd focal plane scopes for this reason.


Well this is a fine pickle we're in, should'a listened to Joe McCarthy and George Orwell I guess.
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
E
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
E
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
yup , and the algorithms assume that the load is zeroed for that load on the gun/scope side not the input computer side.

flintlocke is assuming the windage poi (as an example) is the same for two different loads, and I am just saying I wish I had a whole bunch of loads that was true of

what i really wish was the scope manufactures made was power ranges that were real, and power mag, that had detents.

or parallax adjustments that weren't as critical using SFP scopes, when using off center of optical axis corrections. (to say nothing of windage) (really have a problem with this with my Z1000 Victory)

jee if it were only V1 or V2 id be a happy camper




If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
E
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
E
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
Using my Z6 with a TDS 2x12 its a lot easier to break things into 3 categories
slow, fast and super fast, knowing that categories of bullets having the same BC and same velocity will have the same drops.

or using my V3 4.5x14 varmint reticle simply take the range off the mag dial, by using the target height as a known. and range it off the bottom bar

and I do have an old Burris were you turn the mag until the deer is between the two bars and the reticle adjusts, and a new Redfield that does the same thing.

I even have an old Burris with adjustable Iris that increase the depth of field at high mags. for help with parallax

and who'd a thunk Vortex just came out with the same product.

Last edited by Etoh; 04/21/17.

If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
Campfire Oracle
Offline
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 29,959
You guys need a micrometer power ring adjuster.


Originally Posted by 16penny
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
E
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
E
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,883
I looked that up, but all I found was something about Power Rangers.


If you have an opinion, it's on a bell curve--somewhere
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 36
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 36
Pretty easy really... Just download Strelok for an Android.



Moderated by  RickBin, SYSOP 

Link Copied to Clipboard
CTV-TRX
Who's Online Now
60 members (280Rem1, 1911a1, 47stalker, 1Akshooter, 8 invisible), 711 guests, and 598 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
RR2/3-22

UDG-IP









Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2022 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
 
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.041s Queries: 14 (0.004s) Memory: 0.9085 MB (Peak: 1.0355 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2022-05-16 08:14:38 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS