Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Bowhunting Would it............................

Now have some wooden arrows with properly fletched real feathers on the way for testing from Ron LaClair, this is about to get REAL good!

Well.......I've seen scopes on old school muzzle loaders and Sharps rifles. You wouldn't be the first but I would try to make it vintage appropriate. Find a sight that isn't stupid modern and simple looking.

I will say this, shooting a traditional bow the traditional way isn't something you just pick up and do like a compound bow with all the bells and whistles. You fatigue a lot faster and get frustrated a lot quicker if you aren't on. There's been many a time I wanted to snap my bows over my knee but sometimes walking away is the best medicine. Shooting at a bullseye style target gets old and for me gets frustrating. Do some fun shooting at things other than traditional targets. Stump shooting, shooting at tennis balls, eggs, whatever with a flu flu can sharpen your eye and improve your shooting skills. Also do some shooting and just concentrate on form. Stack up some hay bails or shoot at a large target and just focus on form and not where your hitting. I've found most people quit because they expect to be Robin Hood the day they pick the bow up. It takes time to get good with a traditional bow and even when you've been shooting on for thirty or so years you have days where you couldn't hit the ground if you tried. Stick with it and it will be rewarding.

Thanks Stickbow, my major malfunction through 11 pages here and countless hours of frustration shooting my long bow was due to having a 5" brace height, akin to having a chit barrel on an otherwise good rifle, with a good shooter and ammo on board, it aint gonna work.

With my now set brace height of 7-3/4"s my groups were cut in half, am experimenting now on differing anchor points to try and shorten my draw length, a 31" draw doesn't send out the best flying arrows I'm finding out.

I think the assumption was that the string length of the bowstring on you bow was correct. The correct length is usually written on the limb with the poundage at draw.

Not sure how twists you added, but it sounds like a doctrinal truck-load to get that much change.

I'm betting your string is 1-3 inches longer that specified for your bow.

Yup, but me going into anything I don't know a thing about is madness waiting to happen, bet the original string stretched over time, the guys at Toelke told me when i bought the bow the only reason to ever unstring it was if I was gonna leave it in a hot pickup for several hours.

I sure know now what to watch out for a far as brace height.

Flemish twist strings stretch. A few twists to shorten will fix you right up.

Compounds weren't even a twinkle in the eye of Holless Allen back in the day when I killed my first deer with a Ben Pearson recurve. People shot pins on their traditional bows all the time. Having someone tell you to not use one is horsesh*t. If it makes you more accurate, use one and don't pay any attention to the opinions of others. Archery is a big tent (although I don't think that crossbows are bows, they are guns that shoot arrows but that is another discussion entirely).

Besides, chicks dig guys who shoot traditional bows. They are typically well endowed, witty, intelligent, and humble.

A year later - how's it going?

LOL, yes on the Flemish string stretch, I'll be checking that regularly.

Centershot, I've made more progress in the last week with the brace height adjustment than I have all year fighting a bow wrongly configured, I'll start with the proper spined arrows AH64Guy gave me and go from there, that should further reduce group sizes.

Actually, no. The other way round. Long guns took thier shape and handling from crossbows. They have been around since 400BC (look up "belly bow") but it is a bow, held in place by a mechanical release. Early crossbows had shorter range than longbows, but could be taught much faster. The added range meant archers could rain death from outside crossbow range. All real comparison to guns though is only superficial. Mechanisms, forces, projectile, trigger is all very diffrent. Like saying a dagger and a paintbrush are the same thing.

LOL, you missed the entire point of his post. John knows his stuff, I'm sure there's no confusion on his part about which came first.

"....I don't think that crossbows are bows, they are guns that shoot arrows....." just which part of that statement did I miss?

http://www.crosman.com/airbow this would be closest to a "gun that shoots arrows" but it uses compressed air.

kellory, the entire point of my post was to say that using a sight pin on a traditional bow was okay.

The statement I made about archery being a big tent which should include traditional bows with sights but should not include crossbows was peripheral to the point I was trying to make.

But since you want to discuss it: crossbows have a stock, use a mounted telescopic sight, require zero holding force on the part of the user, and release the projectile with a trigger. Sounds like a gun to me. Someone with practically zero skill or practice can pick one up and immediately shoot accurately - just like they were shooting a gun with a telescopic sight. There's a reason that crossbows were once only approved for use by people who were physically unable to draw and hold a bow - it's because they are as easy to use as a gun.

Archery hunting seasons were set up a long time ago to be long because the skill required to get close enough to harvest an animal with a bow made it hard to be successful. Therefore extended seasons were instituted with few if any limits on how many hunters could participate. If "archery" becomes as easy as hunting with a gun then seasons will get shorter and participation will be limited. The introduction of crossbows threatens the original idea behind having an archery hunting season.

I'm involved in the archery industry at a fairly deep level and feel that crossbows should not be in the "big tent" of archery. You're welcome to your opinion just as I am to mine.

Funny, I don't even hunt with a bow that much and I understood exactly what you were saying.

First off, I respect your opinion, and you have a right to your opinion, come what may, but that does not change facts.

If a scope makes it a gun , then all holo sights, reddots, and telescopic sights (all of which CAN be mounted to a bow) would make every such bow illegal to hunt with where as only light emitting lasers are forbidden.
Advancements in all hunting tools make a difference, but do you draw the line at cams? Cable instead of fibers? Spring steel instead of wood limbs? The accessories do not change what it is. (Just improve it).
Since the crossbow has been around since 4ooBC, it hardly fair or accurate to call it a gun, it would be more accurate to call a gun an imitation crossbow.
The "belly Bow" had no trigger, no release, and require both hands to even draw it back, and held by hand, no sights either. (Grin)
It was the first crossbow.
They were used for fixed defenses, (larger size) and even grew into the Ballista (powered by a twisted skein of each limb, and could throw very large arrows or even shot or stones.
It is an ancient weapon that has morfed a bit over time, (grin) but has never made the leap to an explosion driven chunk of metal through a confined space causing acceleration.
All similarities to guns is what guns borrowed from crossbows, so it began a bow, and remains true to itself, regardless of a copycat weapon, driven by a diffent method, and vastly more modern. It does not change state to become the imitation. It is the original.
To deny this, is to deny the history of the weapons themselves.
History itself decrees the crossbow, is a bow, because there was no other title possible.

Not true.





It's not denying history. It's simply making a value judgment on what kinds of weapons should be allowed during special archery seasons. It's not history, and this is not rocket science.

Light emitting sights are the only sights forbidden to me to use. This is because (according to the ODNR ) this makes it a poachers weapon, and allows for hunting beyond legal light times. You may have some local restriction for your area.
.
"Longbows and crossbows may be used to take legal game. However, crossbows may not be used to hunt migratory game birds. Longbow hunters may use a hand-held mechanical release or a mechanical device with a working safety. Crossbows may be cocked with a device, but must have a working safety and a stock more than 25 inches long.
Poisoned or explosive arrows are unlawful. While hunting, it is unlawful to have attached to a longbow or crossbow any mechanical, electrical or electronic device capable of projecting a beam of light."
http://wildlife.ohiodnr.gov/hunting...trapping-regulations/general-information
(I visit ODNR legal dept every year, to check new and old rule changes, and to make suggestions.
One of the changes I have been pushing for has now passed.
Ohio now allows ALL straight wall rifle cartridges from .350-.50. (My AR-15 .450bushmaster is now legal for deer.)

My most sincere apologies. I didn't realize we were talking about Ohio game laws. I thought we were talking about crossbows. My mistake.

I have zero problem with a dude running a trad bow with a sight pin.
If it helps him shoot well, so be it.
His freakin' bow.
Seen too many "purists" that shoot like crap.

If your arrow hits what you want, that's good enough!

BTW, my personal limit is 30 yards on deer. Sucked when I had a 145" deer at 35. Let him walk away, wide open.
Had him closer but he got nervy and didn't offer a shot until out farther, and then it was over 30 and an edgy deer.............just too risky IMHO.

My first coyote was shot with a 55# Blackwidow at 42 yards, uphill. Smoked him. He spooked a doe that I had crawled into a downfall for, she was feeding on other side of the ridge and would have come right to me............'cept yellowdog spooked her.

I just remember my tab on my face and hearing a yip.

He went maybe 30 yards.

From my sidewalk in old Victorian section of town, back to my bag target in front of the less than pristine shed was 40 yards. I did a practice deal every time, starting at 5 yards. If 4 of 5 into circle, stay, 5 of 5, move back 5 steps and try again. 3 of 5? Move 5 steps up (min was 5 yards though). When I got that new Widow I spent at least a week of just shooting 5 and 10 yards. I sucked.

But I shot a lot, and got the muscle memory started, and then would move back now and then.

Another thing I did..............2 brain farts and the practice was done for the DAY. No exceptions.

No bad habits ingrained.

I was shooting at 25 often after a month, and by second month of practice would occasionally work straight back (no screwing up and having to move up) to 40. Usually 30.
Got divorced.............kept my bow. LGS was also archery range. I'd shoot their every freakin night.

I won't say I was good, but dayam was I consistent, enough to look like I knew WTH I was doing. Did OK at 3D, but usually shot from the compound bowhunter and bowhunter release stakes. Yeah those 45 yarders would get missed now and then. Killed quite a few of them (with audience). Folks shooting super fast bows w black nocks........watch me lob one in with recurve, and nail it..........would go freakin' nuts.

Screw the win, THAT kinda stuff was FUN! And got some folks into trad too

BTW, haven't shot since last yr. Back is screwed. I actually drew my Blackwidow (48#) today and man my neck lit up immediately). No lasting problem though (everything OK after an hr). My middle back issue didn't happen, so that's kinda neat. So............................I'll strap on the quiver and try a dozen arrows tomorrow, at 5 yards.
See if the old spine stays put.

Bought a new 2017 compound in case it screws up. 58#. Aint even shot it yet.

Buddy ordering new BW at Nationals..............hmmmm, a FF equipped 43# new BW might hit as hard as my old B50 48#............hehehehehe. 1100 bucks. But if my back goes that's an expensive wall hanger.

Back problem has me spooked pretty bad.

IMHO one cannot be thinking about stuff "here" when the focus is out "there". Just hope this crap doesn't add Target Panic.
Hence the 5 yard and only a doz arrow start out.

The biggest problem in archery lies between the ears IMHO.

Thanks Hook, I found a new anchor point on my right cheekbone, it shortens my draw length to about 30's, got some new wooden arrows from Longhunter, with a proper spined arrow and the new and correct brace height I just fired a 3 shot 10 yard group with all arrows nearly toughing, blew me away, I couldn't believe what I was seeing.

I'll learn to shoot this longbow without a sight pin, and yes, over time and MUCH practice will have the confidence to use it to kill game, as hard as it shoots, and as far as those 697 grain arrows go into the target bag, I'll have NO penetration issues to deal with.

That 10 yard group blew me away so bad I took a photo and started sending it to friends, very relieving when you get your equipment spec'd out correctly.

They way over penetrate...just sayin...