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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Originally Posted by bellydeep
Mike is apparently an expert at uploading Barney Fife photos and memes. That much we can give him.


He's a huge fan, calls himself "Mr. Furley."



A wise man is frequently humbled.

BP-B2

Joined: Dec 2008
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Campfire Ranger
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All this talk about these "tough" elk have got me scared.... I'm thinkin 375 mode....


Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.

Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Campfire Outfitter
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1. Get a rifle.
2. Pick a load.
3. Learn to shoot it.
4. Choose your shots based on your ability.

99% of problems solved.


Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
Joined: Dec 2009
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Originally Posted by Coyote_Hunter
1. Get a rifle.
2. Pick a load.
3. Learn to shoot it.
4. Choose your shots based on your ability.

99% of problems solved.





That's not what you said earlier


Originally Posted by shrapnel
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle.


Originally Posted by JohnBurns
I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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Originally Posted by bellydeep
Originally Posted by Coyote_Hunter
1. Get a rifle.
2. Pick a load.
3. Learn to shoot it.
4. Choose your shots based on your ability.

99% of problems solved.





That's not what you said earlier


Show me where I've said anything else.


Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
IC B2

Joined: Feb 2014
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Campfire Regular
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Originally Posted by Draftmule
This post caught my eye because I drew a premium Nevada Elk tag and am test shooting a bunch of different bullets. I for one need to step back and evaluate all these new bullet choices in context. In my home state I bow hunt and occasional rifle hunt bulls in a wide open high desert location that some tracking is no problem other than I can not stand witnessing a slower than faster kills. In scouting my Nevada unit with thick Juniper/Cedar knock-down bullet choice is more on my mind. I was talking to an old friend outfitter last weekend describing all the various bullets I am shooting.I asked for his advice for my desire for long range plus drop ability. he reminded me how much more advanced all bullets are these days. Of course he reinforced what we all recognize about normal shot failure.That is when bow and rifle hunters do NOT take out both lungs. Penetration, bullet weight retention plus fragmentation are all on our mind but most likely number one is accuracy. It is hard to dispute that Berger shooters have got the confidence in shot placement down. It would be helpful if some fire members could send a picture or two of real bullet failure if in fact the animal was recovered. Similar arguments with the all copper/copper-alloy bullets with impressive penetration but less so all-inspiring internal devastation. Being a newby long range shooter it takes a bunch of time to reload for 600 yards plus. An accurate down range bullet is a must for starters. Have had my share of tuning challenges with several of the long range bullet designs but will get it and then the harder best design choice. Thanks
for the debate.



What unit?


"Never miss the opportunity to shut the f$%K up." Colonel Hopewell.
Joined: Feb 2004
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Originally Posted by Draftmule
This post caught my eye because I drew a premium Nevada Elk tag and am test shooting a bunch of different bullets. I for one need to step back and evaluate all these new bullet choices in context…. It would be helpful if some fire members could send a picture or two of real bullet failure if in fact the animal was recovered.


First, not from animals but from water jugs, which I’ve found to have a decent test medium for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is that bullets that perform well in the jugs seem to do so in animals as well.

The photo blow shows various bullets and the number of jugs they penetrated. The .30-06/165g Sierra saya ‘XTP’, copy/paste error. In reality is is a GameKing, as specified by the “Federal P3006D”.

[Linked Image]


The three bullets shown below are:

.30-06, 165g North Fork @ 2800fps, 500yds from dirt, 145.0g retained
.30-06, 165g North Fork @ 2800fps, ~25yds from cow elk, 133.2g retained
7mm 140g North Fork @ 3200fps, ~150yds from buck mule deer, 131.2g retained

Not a lot of difference, regardless of range or target. The last one (140g 7mm RM) went from ham to sternum .

[Linked Image]

The bullets below:

350g North Fork, .45-70, 6x6 elk, obliterated a section of leg and near rib, shattered far rib.
160g Grand Slam, 7mm Rem Mag, 5x5 elk, 70.7% weight retention, destroyed both shoulder joints, made it to far-side hide.
162g Hornady BTSP, 7mm Rem Mag, spike elk, 48.7% weight retention, hit a near side rib.
180g North Fork, .300 Win Mag, 200-yard steel – the only bullet I tried that didn’t splatter in a gazillion fragments (as witnessed by nearby paper targets that got shredded).

Note that the Speer Grand Slam and Hornady InterLock bot impacted about 110 yards out. The Grand Slam did a LOT more damage and retained a lot more weight. In 20+ years of using them, this was the first Grand Slam I recovered.

[Linked Image]

Took my last elk, a small 6x5, with this 7mmRM/160g Speer Grand Slam at 411 yards – 4 steps and down according to my hunting buddy.

[Linked Image]


Quote
Similar arguments with the all copper/copper-alloy bullets with impressive penetration but less so all-inspiring internal devastation.



Quote
Being a newby long range shooter it takes a bunch of time to reload for 600 yards plus. An accurate down range bullet is a must for starters. Have had my share of tuning challenges with several of the long range bullet designs but will get it and then the harder best design choice. Thanks
for the debate.


For accurate down-range bullets (600 yards) I’ve had no problem with North Fork SS, Barnes TTSX/LRX or Nosler AccuBond, regardless of cartridge. More importantly, I expect these bullets to perform about the same regardless of range.


Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
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