24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
-->
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,430
A
Campfire Ranger
OP Offline
Campfire Ranger
A
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 25,430


�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.

---------------------------------------------------------
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
GB1

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,880
1
Campfire Ranger
Online Content
Campfire Ranger
1
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,880
A lot of good info on that site.


The last time that bear ate a lawyer he had the runs for 33 days!
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
A lot of mindless BS about "hydrostatic shock". So it is a batch of brownies with only a teaspoon of dog shlt in it.

Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 14
T
New Member
Offline
New Member
T
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 14
Good article--thanks for posting!! m

Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 13,366
R
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
R
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 13,366
I don't actually agree with his hypothesis on what kills. Having killed plenty in the last 45 years with many different cartridges and generally finding little difference between different cartridges killing power. If you bullet expands and penetrates properly, hits a vital area then you will have to gut and clean the animal you shot with it.

Last edited by rickt300; 08/18/17.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]



IC B2

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Z
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Z
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Hope to find out this fall with the 45-70 I just bought.

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Z
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Z
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Originally Posted by rickt300
I don't actually agree with his hypothesis on what kills. Having killed plenty in the last 45 years with many different cartridges and generally finding little difference between different cartridges killing power. If you bullet expands and penetrates properly, hits a vital area then you will have to gut and clean the animal you shot with it.

One problem with discussing different calibers or bullets, is people who say the animal is just as dead. No [bleep]. 22 LR works too.

For me, how far it goes is a huge consideration, I don't care if it is just as dead at ### yards as 1.

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,401
B
Campfire Regular
Online Content
Campfire Regular
B
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,401
"Yet today, more than 80 years later, the subject of meplat shape and surface area is largely untapped" , False statement. Veral Smith in "Jacketed Performance With Cast Bullets" fully explores the subject for handgun bullets. Regarding rifle bullets Michael458, Terminal Bullet Performance, Big Bores thread, www.accuratereloading.com thoroughly covers the subject for solids. By actual experimentation he determined that the optimum meplat size in relation to bullet diameter is 60%. Paco Kelly even figured this out for .22 rimfires and designed a tool to file off the bullet tips consistently on any 22 round. CCI makes the Small Game Bullet in 22 rimfire. Elmer Keith and the semi wadcutter bullet was the beginning, not the end of the body of knowledge regarding wound ballistics and meplat.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by dla
A lot of mindless BS about "hydrostatic shock". So it is a batch of brownies with only a teaspoon of dog shlt in it.


There's no value in getting into a battle of semantics on this topic, but anyone who has ever watched a bullet enter into gelatin in slow motion will agree that there is a "wave" the pushes out violently from the bullet. I can see how that wave of pressure could shock the animal into collapse. What do you call that "wave" and what effect do you think it has on the animal?

One thing he mentioned that I was completely unaware of is the autonomic plexus. It has been my go-to aim point for DRT shots with my mild 257 Roberts. That shot is my favorite and my experience mirrors his.

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
The neat thing about this web sight is it based on a lot of "events". As was explained by a gun writer in New Zealand you can get in multiple harvest events per year,they consider large game a pest.


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












IC B3

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
I love the authors suggestion of doing a field necropsy on the harvested animal to scrutinize trauma and ordinance efficiency.

I think there should be more information on normal and abnormal tissue appearance so people can make up their own minds.

But I sure enjoy harvesting game with the Lever big bores so I definitely have some bias.


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Z
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Z
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Last year I completely destroyed both lungs on deer with spitzer 30-06. It still ran 100 yards. I had shot a deer with factory flat corelocts. Did not do much to lungs, other then a hole. Granted these are just 2 instances. I am curious if there would be any diffiference with a flat bullet, such as 45-70, with twice the weight.

I was just talking to guy who though 30-30 with the flat nose, had more knock down than 30-06. Hunters are known for opinions. Most of us don't get to shoot enough, to really know, if it is the bullet or other variables. On the surface, it would seem something flat have to push through would deliver more trauma. Hit a nail with a hammer, or hit a board, with hammer.

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,229
B
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
B
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,229
I've killed alot of deer with various full bore and saboted shotgun slugs and muzzleloader conicals that had ballistics in the neighborhood of a.45-70 with more diameter and far bigger "meplat" {12 gauge Brenneke K.O. which is essentially a .73 caliber wadcutter} . None put deer down any quicker than my .30-30.

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
For " knockdown" I believe you need CNS involvement in the trauma. Jeffbird posted some excellent videos of a repeatable DRT shot on boars and deer. Check it out! I would ask him his thoughts.

That is where the autonomic plexus or brachial plexus come in. Or brain,or spine etc.

To see the whole lungfield gelatinsed is about all a " meat saver " shot into the thoracic cavity caudal to the front leg is going to show.

The animal could still be ambulatory for a short time.

Unless some kind of CNS trauma also occurred.

Last edited by Angus1895; 08/21/17.

"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by dla
A lot of mindless BS about "hydrostatic shock". So it is a batch of brownies with only a teaspoon of dog shlt in it.


There's no value in getting into a battle of semantics on this topic, but anyone who has ever watched a bullet enter into gelatin in slow motion will agree that there is a "wave" the pushes out violently from the bullet. I can see how that wave of pressure could shock the animal into collapse. What do you call that "wave" and what effect do you think it has on the animal?

One thing he mentioned that I was completely unaware of is the autonomic plexus. It has been my go-to aim point for DRT shots with my mild 257 Roberts. That shot is my favorite and my experience mirrors his.

If you think a gel block is tough, you should see a deer.

No such thing as hydrostatic shock, and the pressure wave was shown long ago to be irrelevant.

If you know nothing, then the writeup will give you something - a plate of brownies made with a teaspoon of dog shlt added.

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by dla
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by dla
A lot of mindless BS about "hydrostatic shock". So it is a batch of brownies with only a teaspoon of dog shlt in it.


There's no value in getting into a battle of semantics on this topic, but anyone who has ever watched a bullet enter into gelatin in slow motion will agree that there is a "wave" the pushes out violently from the bullet. I can see how that wave of pressure could shock the animal into collapse. What do you call that "wave" and what effect do you think it has on the animal?

One thing he mentioned that I was completely unaware of is the autonomic plexus. It has been my go-to aim point for DRT shots with my mild 257 Roberts. That shot is my favorite and my experience mirrors his.

If you think a gel block is tough, you should see a deer.

No such thing as hydrostatic shock, and the pressure wave was shown long ago to be irrelevant.

If you know nothing, then the writeup will give you something - a plate of brownies made with a teaspoon of dog shlt added.


How is it that my .257 bullet at 2700 fps turns a deer heart and lungs into a gelatinous mess? Wound channels much larger than the expanded diameter of the bullet?

From Wiki:

Autopsy Findings in Iraq[edit]
An 8-month study in Iraq performed in 2010 and published in 2011 reports on autopsies of 30 gunshot victims struck with high-velocity (greater than 2500 fps) rifle bullets.[25] In all 30 cases, autopsies revealed injuries distant from the main wound channel due to hydrostatic shock. The authors determined that the lungs and chest are the most susceptible to distant wounding, followed by the abdomen. The authors conclude:

Distant injuries away from the main track in high velocity missile injuries are very important and almost always present in all cases especially in the chest and abdomen and this should be put in the consideration on the part of the forensic pathologist and probably the general surgeon.

— R. S. Selman et al.[25]

Last edited by PaulBarnard; 08/23/17.
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
U can lead a human2 knowledge but U can't make em think.


Common sense does not grow in everyone's garden.

Last edited by Angus1895; 08/23/17.

"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
While I have seen some anecdotal evidence of different visible reaction to flat front bullets, I'm not sure there's any science to them killing quicker than a rapid expanding pointy pill that penetrates, either. If I'm worried about tracking and can't hit CNS, I know they can't run too far with just two stern legs if I break both shoulders....with anything.

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Why are posters here so frigging stupid?

So called "Hydrostatic shock" was debunked 60 years ago and yet forum nimrods continue to try to use the word in a sentence.

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,912
J
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
J
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,912
Originally Posted by dla
Why are posters here so frigging stupid?

So called "Hydrostatic shock" was debunked 60 years ago and yet forum nimrods continue to try to use the word in a sentence.



Proof please


Most people don't really want the truth.

They just want constant reassurance that what they believe is the truth.
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by dla
Why are posters here so frigging stupid?

So called "Hydrostatic shock" was debunked 60 years ago and yet forum nimrods continue to try to use the word in a sentence.


Yeah, the persons who performed the autopsies in on our soldiers in Iraq were wrong. They didn't see distant wounding in the autopsies they conducted. I'll dismiss their observations in favor of some dipshidt blowhard on the worldwide web.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
Yeah, all those myths about bloodshot meat just keep on happening.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by hh4whiskey
Yeah, all those myths about bloodshot meat just keep on happening.


Bloodshot meat is a myth. Unless the bullet makes direct contact with the tissue, the tissue is not damaged.

Last edited by PaulBarnard; 08/29/17.
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Z
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Z
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 805
Ya myth, like no one uses 45-70s anymore.

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
From what I have been able to " extract" from the " grananimal pack" is a study that had equations derived from using a machine to remove kidney stones. It basically " debunked" at that time the thought that hyperspeeds out of a handgun would replace mass and bore size?

I have yet to see any debunking of current studies based on centerfire rifles, still waiting.


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
"Blood shot" happens because the heart is still pumping. You get lots of it with archery kills. Seriously, some of you are total dumbshlts.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by dla
"Blood shot" happens because the heart is still pumping. You get lots of it with archery kills. Seriously, some of you are total dumbshlts.


It's quite difficult to know how to engage in a discussion with someone who snipes like a child. I'll ask you again what you make of the autopsies of our soldiers in Iraq. They were autopsied by medical professionals and most often showed injuries distant from the wound. What are your thoughts on that? What would explain a heart literally tuned into a ball of mush by bullet expanded to just .5 inches? Fist sized chunks of lung turned to jelly? What causes damage much greater than the diameter of the bullet if not a violent pressure wave?

I know it's going to be difficult for you to answer those questions. But give it your best whirl.

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by dla
"Blood shot" happens because the heart is still pumping. You get lots of it with archery kills. Seriously, some of you are total dumbshlts.


It's quite difficult to know how to engage in a discussion with someone who snipes like a child. I'll ask you again what you make of the autopsies of our soldiers in Iraq. They were autopsied by medical professionals and most often showed injuries distant from the wound. What are your thoughts on that? What would explain a heart literally tuned into a ball of mush by bullet expanded to just .5 inches? Fist sized chunks of lung turned to jelly? What causes damage much greater than the diameter of the bullet if not a violent pressure wave?

I know it's going to be difficult for you to answer those questions. But give it your best whirl.

You are an especially dense dumbshlt. You're too stoooooopid to realize that your mythical Autopsies, which you have zero 1st-hand knowledge of, or data to show, are meaningless. And, you're also way to stooopid to understand that "bloodshot" and tissue disruption are different . OTOH, I and a bazzilion other hunters have experienced bloodshot, (rifle and archery).

By the way dense one, blood is a non-compressible liquid, and heart is full of it. So "duh", the heart chamber will explode.

There, I've typed more than this was worth.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
Archery bloodshot meat? Never had that problem of hydrostatic shock blowing up much with an arrow. I have cut away a LOT of ruined tissue that a projectile never touched out of a gun, in various critters over the years. You call it whatever you like or act like a retard over it....I don't care. I wasn't really having some huge debate on one end of this discussion or the other, merely pointing out simple observations that have applied to stuff since gunpowder came along. Seems you just accidentally explained some fluid dynamics relating to all of this, yourself.

Last edited by hh4whiskey; 08/31/17.
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by dla
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by dla
"Blood shot" happens because the heart is still pumping. You get lots of it with archery kills. Seriously, some of you are total dumbshlts.


It's quite difficult to know how to engage in a discussion with someone who snipes like a child. I'll ask you again what you make of the autopsies of our soldiers in Iraq. They were autopsied by medical professionals and most often showed injuries distant from the wound. What are your thoughts on that? What would explain a heart literally tuned into a ball of mush by bullet expanded to just .5 inches? Fist sized chunks of lung turned to jelly? What causes damage much greater than the diameter of the bullet if not a violent pressure wave?

I know it's going to be difficult for you to answer those questions. But give it your best whirl.

You are an especially dense dumbshlt. You're too stoooooopid to realize that your mythical Autopsies, which you have zero 1st-hand knowledge of, or data to show, are meaningless. And, you're also way to stooopid to understand that "bloodshot" and tissue disruption are different . OTOH, I and a bazzilion other hunters have experienced bloodshot, (rifle and archery).

By the way dense one, blood is a non-compressible liquid, and heart is full of it. So "duh", the heart chamber will explode.

There, I've typed more than this was worth.


It sounds like you are saying that the pressure wave created by the blood in the heart causes it to explode. Since you struggle to answer questions and engage in adult tenor discussions, maybe you can give me a link to support that the pressure wave created by the bullet passing through the vitals of an animal creates no meaningful shock or damage.

You are wrong about blood not being compressible. That doesn't really have anything to do with the discussion anyway. Here's a link (one of many) that supports my position. https://www.researchgate.net/post/Are_liquids_compressible So far I have have provided two links to dispute your beliefs. You've done nothing but bloviate.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by hh4whiskey
. Seems you just accidentally explained some fluid dynamics relating to all of this, yourself.


Ya think?

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by hh4whiskey
Archery bloodshot meat? Never had that problem of hydrostatic shock blowing up much with an arrow. I have cut away a LOT of ruined tissue that a projectile never touched out of a gun, in various critters over the years. You call it whatever you like or act like a retard over it....I don't care. I wasn't really having some huge debate on one end of this discussion or the other, merely pointing out simple observations that have applied to stuff since gunpowder came along. Seems you just accidentally explained some fluid dynamics relating to all of this, yourself.

You mean to tell me you've never seen the blood spread out between the muscle and silverskin around the arrow entry/exit? Thats bloodshot and if you don't get it out it will taint the meat.

Bullets crush tissue, broadheads slice it. The crush zone bleeds and if you dont get the blood out the meat will be funky. Crushing is normal and not part of some mythical pressure wave. This is one area where gellatin blocks are showing you the truth.

Deer,Elk, humans are not bottles of water. Go read Fackler.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
You mean to tell me that you think bleeding is the same as damaged/destroyed, blood infused tissue that no projectile ever physically touched?....cuz you're just talking about bleeding. An animal can stump a toe and bleed. Crush zone? When tissue gets jellied 6-10" away from the bullet path, do you stay up all night scratching your head over it? Maybe we should throw out that projectiles start producing different results on most anything, at >1500 and again at > 2000.....and likely more or it's likely a range. I'm not trying to get into detailed physics here, but just the common sense and experience end of things.....like the bottle of water comment. Most all mammals are 70% water. You must be focusing on that other 30% of sticks, hide, and hair?

Last edited by hh4whiskey; 09/01/17.
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by hh4whiskey
When tissue gets jellied 6-10" away from the bullet path,


Classic dumbshlt statement.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
Sure. Whatever you say.


Thanks for that


Now everyone here knows what they're dealing with and how to view your posts.


Discussing what effects energy has on game vs bullet types, is not the same as promoting energy or any other theory over anything else. Recognizing energy transfer DOES exist, is only logical, due to physics. The form and effects have always been debated. Nor does pointing this out mean I'm trying to prove some magical pressure wave effect. Energy is transferred beyond what a projectile physically touches. Argue over what it does all you want.

Last edited by hh4whiskey; 09/01/17.
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Why don't you read Faulkner to us. Thanks.


I personally think he is telling a way different story than what you portray.

Last edited by Angus1895; 09/01/17.

"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,426
Originally Posted by Angus1895
Why don't you read Faulkner to us. Thanks.


I personally think he is telling a way different story than what you portray.


He's not interested in conversation. He's not here for discussion. He's not here to impart knowledge. He's here to compensate for something lacking in his life. People with self-respect don't do what he is doing. What I typically see with these types when I meet them in real life is that they have short man syndrome or they are morbidly obese. It may be something different with him. But I have never met an internet [bleep] who was comfortable in his own skin.

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by Angus1895
Why don't you read Faulkner to us. Thanks.


I personally think he is telling a way different story than what you portray.


He's not interested in conversation. He's not here for discussion. He's not here to impart knowledge. He's here to compensate for something lacking in his life. People with self-respect don't do what he is doing. What I typically see with these types when I meet them in real life is that they have short man syndrome or they are morbidly obese. It may be something different with him. But I have never met an internet [bleep] who was comfortable in his own skin.

Sounds like moanings of a feucktard who has just realized what a feucktard he is. BTW, it's Fackler, not Faulkner. The former was a doctor and pathologist, the latter a spinner of tales.

Read Martin Fackler's works on wounding mechanisms. And then you'll graduate from feucktard/dumbshlt to noob.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
H
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
H
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,601
There existed an opportunity to actually explain some things here, but ad hominem attacks are indicative of blind faith and not knowledge. It helps to comprehend any sources, as well. Again, regardless of terminology, science and evidence show effect outside of projectile alone. What it's called, what it is, and what it means is the issue to many.

http://www.rathcoombe.net/sci-tech/ballistics/methods.html

Last edited by hh4whiskey; 09/02/17.
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
To bring it out in the light......

I reviewed a synapses of fackners, Faulkner, whatever his name.

He based his calculations on a kidney stone shocking machine.....

He disputed small light high velocity pistols in the human.......

It made the deal change back to heavy slow pistol rounds for human defense.....

A far cry from 2000 foot pounds in a 180 grain .308 caliber colliding " imperfectly " into an 700 pound elk.

Please correct me if I am wrong.......thanks.


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 11,678
Campfire Outfitter
Online Shocked
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 11,678
dla has been a fuc-khead for years on here. Just pretend he doesnt exists or put him on ignore. Even easier

Last edited by gunchamp; 10/21/17.
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
I find it fascinating how higher education will cause a certain amount of the population to paint themselves into a corner and find no way out! Reminds of an Alfred Hitchcock skit where there is a skeleton in the closet.

It seems they lose their ability to admit flaws in reasoning, or open up to observations made by others. The lose their Oooops ability and any humility. Instead they lash out to discredit any dissenting or opposing opinion. Perhaps Narcissism is at play. Who knows?

What are U gonna do?

Just smile, and hopefully some day it will become THEIR idea.......and it will be all good.


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,784
J
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
J
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,784
Here is one for you.

I shot my first deer with a 45-70 yesterday. I was in the ground still hunting and the deer was coming straight for me. I knelt and shot him just as he popped into the clear. So, was at the exact same level as his chest at about 40 yards. At the shot he ran about 150 yards and I saw him pitch over and flop around. When I got to him he was still alive and kicking pretty hard and it took him another 30 to 45 seconds to die.

So I was shooting that Hornady 325 Gmx round for the 45-70. The bullet penetrated him stem to stern through the body cavity the entire way. It never touched any meat. The deer's heart was literally in three pieces when I took it out. Some of his lungs were jellied and of course, the stomach was a mess.

The weirdest thing though was that his stomach contents came out the front. It was like shaking a coke bottle and having all the contents come out the hole. The contents of its stomach came up to the front hole and were all over between the skin and the body in the front of that deer. Under the leg and on the ribs there were stomach contents everywhere. And it was in the meat, even though the shot had passed through the chest cavity and never touched the meat. The flank outside the ribs was heavily bloodshot and covered in stomach content even though the ribs themselves were between that meat and the bullet.

Like I said it was like shaking up a coke bottle. Except maybe you shake up a bottle and then slap a plastic bag over the top of it and watch the mess.

Last edited by JoeBob; 10/29/17.
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,733
Thanks for sharing. A person needs to get photos of the necropsy findings of these events. It seem academia strives to out think common sense.


Been there done that!


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
D
dla Offline
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,373
Originally Posted by JoeBob
Here is one for you.

I shot my first deer with a 45-70 yesterday. I was in the ground still hunting and the deer was coming straight for me. I knelt and shot him just as he popped into the clear. So, was at the exact same level as his chest at about 40 yards. At the shot he ran about 150 yards and I saw him pitch over and flop around. When I got to him he was still alive and kicking pretty hard and it took him another 30 to 45 seconds to die.

So I was shooting that Hornady 325 Gmx round for the 45-70. The bullet penetrated him stem to stern through the body cavity the entire way. It never touched any meat. The deer's heart was literally in three pieces when I took it out. Some of his lungs were jellied and of course, the stomach was a mess.

The weirdest thing though was that his stomach contents came out the front. It was like shaking a coke bottle and having all the contents come out the hole. The contents of its stomach came up to the front hole and were all over between the skin and the body in the front of that deer. Under the leg and on the ribs there were stomach contents everywhere. And it was in the meat, even though the shot had passed through the chest cavity and never touched the meat. The flank outside the ribs was heavily bloodshot and covered in stomach content even though the ribs themselves were between that meat and the bullet.

Like I said it was like shaking up a coke bottle. Except maybe you shake up a bottle and then slap a plastic bag over the top of it and watch the mess.

So I'm curious, what do you think happened?

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,784
J
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
J
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,784
Originally Posted by dla
Originally Posted by JoeBob
Here is one for you.

I shot my first deer with a 45-70 yesterday. I was in the ground still hunting and the deer was coming straight for me. I knelt and shot him just as he popped into the clear. So, was at the exact same level as his chest at about 40 yards. At the shot he ran about 150 yards and I saw him pitch over and flop around. When I got to him he was still alive and kicking pretty hard and it took him another 30 to 45 seconds to die.

So I was shooting that Hornady 325 Gmx round for the 45-70. The bullet penetrated him stem to stern through the body cavity the entire way. It never touched any meat. The deer's heart was literally in three pieces when I took it out. Some of his lungs were jellied and of course, the stomach was a mess. We

The weirdest thing though was that his stomach contents came out the front. It was like shaking a coke bottle and having all the contents come out the hole. The contents of its stomach came up to the front hole and were all over between the skin and the body in the front of that deer. Under the leg and on the ribs there were stomach contents everywhere. And it was in the meat, even though the shot had passed through the chest cavity and never touched the meat. The flank outside the ribs was heavily bloodshot and covered in stomach content even though the ribs themselves were between that meat and the bullet.

Like I said it was like shaking up a coke bottle. Except maybe you shake up a bottle and then slap a plastic bag over the top of it and watch the mess.

So I'm curious, what do you think happened?


I don’t know. I’ve shot more than a hundred deer with everything from a .22 LR to a 9.3x62 and that was some unique damage.

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
AX24

545 members (01Foreman400, 12344mag, 007FJ, 10gaugemag, 1lessdog, 1234, 61 invisible), 2,380 guests, and 1,214 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,190,663
Posts18,455,732
Members73,909
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 


Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.



Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.088s Queries: 14 (0.005s) Memory: 1.0557 MB (Peak: 1.3730 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-04-19 18:28:54 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS