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#12201540 - 08/11/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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spj Offline
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That video shows a nice solid scent point. The dog was even chewing scent. Period. From the proud owner of a class fdsb pointer. But dMn let that dog alone lol.

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#12201964 - 08/12/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: spj]  
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battue Offline
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Does indeed show a solid point, however, the point was if the Lab had been hunting with a good Pointer or Setter the ground would have already been covered. The bird already pointed.

Bust thru nasty cover and flush running Wild Pheasants, I'd take a Lab. Point Quail and Ruffed Grouse a pointing dog.

Any pointing Lab yet to win any of the serious pointing field championships? Even if one was great at the pointing part, it couldn't keep up when it comes to covering ground. Shotputters don't win the marathon. That was a young Dog and he was quickly sucking wind on easy ground. He isn't built for hunting fast and hard for any extended period of time.

A good Springer would also run that Lab into the ground and flush the Birds before he/she had a chance to do any pointing.

Last edited by battue; 08/12/17.

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#12227332 - 08/23/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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spj Offline
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A big depends. A big assumption that the big running pointer covers the same ground as effectively as the pointing lab. If the lab is from field lines run is not a problem at least where I hunt. I have never been limited by a field trial bred lab while hunting grouse and woodcock, day after day. Breeding counts for this. The lab gene pool is big enough for different lines. The AKC has done far more damage to the breed then a couple pointing lab breeders will ever do. As to why labs point, while no one knows the special sauce the good english lords bred in with their st john water dogs, setters were there for sure. Traits can be brought back to the top via selective breeding.

Last edited by spj; 08/23/17.
#12227635 - 08/23/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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Mule Deer Offline
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Like battue, I must have missed this thread the first time around. Must admit up front that I'm not a field-trial guy, but an all-around upland/waterfowl hunter. My first Lab's father was the Utah field-trail champion, long before I can ever recall the idea of pointing labs ever coming up. My dog taught himself to point certain birds, without an encouragement from me, and was doing it pretty consistently in his later years. He also taught himself to catch cottontail rabbits in snow, when he was younger and faster, which I didn't mind either. None of my other previsou Labs have shown much drive to point, though my present 60-pound chocolate female started to some last fall, at five years of age.

Have hunted with a number of different dogs in my travels around the world, one a bluetick hound in Alabama that pointed quail as well as the well-bred pointing dogs in his owner's string.

One of my Labs was actually half Llewellin setter, given to me by an Arizona guide who had a dozen Llewellins for quail, and one Lab for waterfowl. One of the female setters and the Lab had a party (through a chain-link fence) one night, and the result (of course) was 11 puppies. My friend kept a female and gave me a male. Hunted him until he was 12, and while he retrieved better than any setter I've hunted with, he never showed any tendency to point. But he could sure run and flush all day long.

Obviously I'm not into the purity of breeds, and debating about diluting them....


John

"Gunwriters, as you know, aren't as informed as their readers are and if it wasn't for the readers, there would be no need for writers..."--Shrapnel, May 2015
#12227661 - 08/23/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Mule Deer]  
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No doubt you can sometimes get a good surprise out of a thru the fence breeding. Labs are the coolest of Dogs, but when they size up it becomes difficult for them to keep up in the uplands. I tried to buy one down in Georgia that was a midget, but I've only seen one other Dog that had a nose equivalent to his. He would have made a great Grouse flusher.



Addition: Right now Merlot is working on being a Groundhog specialist. He doesn't have it all down yet, but for some reason he thinks they are evil.

Last edited by battue; 08/23/17.

laissez les bons temps rouler
#12227808 - 08/23/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: battue]  
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One of my Labs was a chocolate male from parents that weighed 65 and 75 pounds. He was 92 by six months, and around 100 at maturity when lean and mean. He was the best retriever and waterfowl Lab I've owned, but you could not hunt him in the uplands during September and most of October unless right next to a cool stream, and even then he'd only last an hour or so. On December pheasant hunts he'd roll around in snow to cool off. But he could bust brush, both to flush and retrieve pheasants, as well as he could retrieve Canada geese.

The present 60-pound female we deliberately bought when she was 18 months old, to make sure she would be the right size for early-season upland hunting. The breeder we bought her from lives on a ranch, and we got to take a winter walk with our potential dog and two other Labs while sizing her up. She soon started acting birdy, with her nose in the air rather than down on the ground, and followed the scent to a covey of Huns 250-300 hundred yards away, the other two Labs following along behind her acting puzzled. She's not as good on Canada geese as the big dog was, but she can hunt upland birds in September, and we hunt far more upland birds than waterfowl anymore.


John

"Gunwriters, as you know, aren't as informed as their readers are and if it wasn't for the readers, there would be no need for writers..."--Shrapnel, May 2015
#12227919 - 08/23/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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battue Offline
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A flusher that goes to the Birds head up-like a pointer-instead of fooling with ground scent is a jewel. I've only had one and the little Lab I mentioned was another. Both had an incredible scenting ability.

Last edited by battue; 08/24/17.

laissez les bons temps rouler
#12228615 - 08/24/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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They're all different, aren't they? It's one of the aspects of bird-hunting with dogs that keeps it endlessly fascinating, along with the fact that bird-hunting without dogs isn't much fun.....


John

"Gunwriters, as you know, aren't as informed as their readers are and if it wasn't for the readers, there would be no need for writers..."--Shrapnel, May 2015
#12231080 - 08/25/17 Re: Pointing Labs: what ever happened to them? [Re: Pete E]  
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spj Offline
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Labs are well known to throw some bruisers to small parents sometimes! I like my labs no more than 60 lbs to lift them into the boat one handed. Their intelligence makes them killers and great partners and versatile. Battue I have had a line bred hege haus deutch kurzhaar along with my current pointer and YES their athleticism is astonishing sometimes!

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