Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Minimum Accuracy requirement for a long range big game rifle.m

I like to stay under MOA. Better is nice and fun, but isn't as huge a factor as many like to believe. Cold bore, consistency and wind-drift are bigger factors.You don't get sighters when hunting, and seldom get to shoot groups or strings.

What is "MOA" to you? Is that MOA regardless of point of impact? Is it "MOA" when you occasionally have a MOA group? Is it MOA for 3 rounds? 5? 10? Is it MOA only if it hits a 1 MOA target everytime on demand?

While the common usage is the ability of the rifle to shot 1 MOA groups, to me, a more meaningful standard for a "1 MOA" rifle means the shooter can hit a 1 MOA target with the cold bore shot with the set-up as it will be used in the field including the scope and ammo.

Under field conditions, cold, tired, stiff, wind, and a sub-optimal shooting position can easily double or triple the size of the results compared to a controlled range session.

For hunting, what matters is the ability to hit the intended point of aim with the cold bore shot.

That really depends on what you consider long range to be. I'm not comfortable shooting far with guns or loads that won't do moa. I like the idea of stretching out shots more than the reality though, usually because of crazy winds/updrafts/downdrafts that can come into play. I don't have a dedicated LR rig, just some guns that shoot accurately and flat enough with the right bullets.

I'm comfortable stretching out an '06 with 185 VLD to beyond 600, because it is utterly predictable when the wind is cooperating. It shoots well below moa: 2/3" at 100, 1.5" at 300, 4 and some change at 600. I've done that enough to be confident in it over and over again, as long as I get serious about it.

So, my standard is well under moa in conditions where wind isn't a factor, say .8 moa. I doubt I'll shoot at anything past about 600 yds though. It has been a good sensible max for me.

I like 3 shots one hole at 100 yards.

Thats pretty much where I am. I am simply not willing to hump around a rifle heavy enough to make sure kills on game past 600 yards in my hands.

My 7lb 308 is doing well under MOA with my 155g Scenar handloads and working to get that down to conisstently close to or at .5 MOA before I call it good.

.5 @ the 100 or all the way to 600?





Dave

I'm routinely amazed how easily guys with a "1/2 MOA Gun" will repeatedly miss 2 MOA targets... almost regardless of range...

Or milk jugs..

Me three.




Dave

Four

Got the 105hpbt with 49grains of RL26 in .665" for five at 100yards. 22" 243AI that's happy happy happy enough for LR.
How much milk do you guys drink? I would be out of targets way to quick.

What is "MOA" to you?

For the purpose of this thread, I was referring to the mechanical precision of the load and rifle and only that.

Is that MOA regardless of point of impact?

In this case, and referring to answer #1, yes.

Is it "MOA" when you occasionally have a MOA group?

Of course not, that would be dumb.

Is it MOA for 3 rounds? 5? 10?

In the case of my "Over-bore" Hunting rifles 3. In the case of my FTR rifle, 15 and 2 sighters. Our V-Ring is 1/2 MOA.

Is it MOA only if it hits a 1 MOA target everytime on demand?

Wouldn't that be something? Last weekend I was going from 6 MOA left to 6 MOA right wind from shot to shot with a rear fish tailing wind at the 1000 yard line. A 1 MOA target every time on demand is a nice fantasy.

There's a reason I call the 12" round Steel Gong at 600 yards the "Plate of Humble Pie"... again, I'm amazed at how many "half inch rifles" can't put bullets on that 2 MOA plate.... especially the ones built to "shoot 1000 yards".

We have a 2 MOA at the 300 and it's amazing how few rounds hit that thing.




Dave

A lot of guys would be surprised at a 1.5" rifle on it too.

Yep.




Clark

Yep. The farthest plate on my place is 830 yards. It's a 12" plate. When I get on it, I have no trouble staying on it. But a first round hit on it doesn't come as often as I would like it to. The rest of my plates are 8". 1st round hits are a given up to 600. At 600, for whatever reason, things start getting pretty interesting. This is from a rig that routinely puts its favorite load in the .3s to .5s. That's five shots, not three.

Point being there is a whole bunch more going into hitting targets at extended range than just the rifle's mechanical accuracy capability.

Here's four rounds at 830 from a few days ago. Prone w/ bipod from the bed of my truck. I was pretty happy with that. 4shot group measured 3.5" with tape measure.

John

I agree that 6-700yds is where things tend to get less consistent for me.




Dave

My sight in spot has a 100 yard backstop for sight in, and a couple of rocks at 500 yards and one at 800 yds, all three painted orange, for long range verification. In my mind, if I'm consistent at 800, and keep my hunting shots within 500, I'm good. I have two dedicated big game/long range hunting rifles.....a 300 win shooting 200 gr accubonds and a 338 rum shooting 225 gr accubonds. At 500 yds, both rifles shoot a "skinny" moa, usually keeping 3 shots within 4"....even with a light and variable crosswind. At 800, I still run a "skinny" moa, but only vertically. With that same "light and variable" crosswind, my groups run 6" vertically X 10" horizontally.....and this is with a LIGHT and variable breeze. The 6" is passable, but I don't trust the size of the horizontal group, for big game (where only 1st shot bulls-eyes count). The amount of wind at any given time, at distance, has the final say under big game hunting conditions.....varmints don't get that courtesy! I once read where trajectory is science and wind drift is voodoo. I couldn't agree more!

Andy3