Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Spec your battle rifle!

I have to ask myself why I need or want a red dot these days? I think an IR 1-4 is a good idea, or decent iron sights are a good idea by themselves and I am sure someone will tell me that they are 10.3456% faster and more accurate with a red dot. What did we ever do before they came along!!

Awesome buddy. I'm going to have my wife read your post.. Maybe she will listen to reason....

The closest thing I have to a battle ready rifle is this one...:




It's not like most of yours, but it would work good enough for my needs. I guess my other ar's would also work...

Frank is a good dude and extremely capable, and builds the best sling available... but I disagree heavily with him on this. Ironically one of the first busted Elcans that I saw was on his rifle...


BUIS aren't just for when optics go down (however if you are using an EoTech they should be mandatory), for me and my guys they are mainly there for when it says raining, or for when the optics have fogged or frozen over. We don't call it on account of rain therefore I need a way to aim.






As for the guns- it depends on what is being done. However I do not have "game guns" and "battle rifles". My competition rifles are my work guns and my work guns are my Comp rifles.

The general purpose gun- i.e. we call a "Recce"-

14.5" Colt M4A1 (now has a LARUE Stealth barrel)
DD RIS II rail
Surefire Brake/suppressor adaptor
Geissele Trigger
Vortex Razor 1-6x mil/mil
Pic rings and riser
Magpul Pro LR sights
B.E. Myers MAWL-DA
Surefire scout light
BCM Grip/Stock/CH
WOTG sling








Short "Recce"-

11.5"
Geissele 10" Rail
Geissele Trigger
1-8x mil/mil scope
NF Mount
Surefire Warcomp
B.E Myers MAWL-DA
Surefire Scout
BCM Grip/Stock/CH
WOTG sling









General purpose M4-

Colt M4A1 14.5" fixed sight
Surefire Warcomp
Troy Handguard
Geissele SSF Trigger
Trijicon VCOG 1-6x mil/mil
Magpul Pro LR rear sight
Peq-15
Surefire X300V
BCM Grip/Stock/CH
WOTG sling







They all are variations of a theme. At a minimum they will have-

- Extended free float handguard
- Geissele Trigger
- Surefire Suppressor adaptor, usually a brake or Warcomp
- Good irons (usually Magpul LR)
- Usually a 1-6/8x mil/mil scope
- Surefire Flashlight
- WOTG sling

Formidilosus, why did you censor the 1-8X Nightforce?

I bet it ain't cheap

OK, so are the scope mounts QD or is the primary sight (mine is the swfa 1x4 til I can get a 1x6) just taken off when it's raining or failed with a hex? I think I have room for the LR's under the scope. Looks like they work on all the guns pictured. I have Frank's flashlight mount out there where I'd want the front sight but not a big deal.

Don't guess you could count on them being still dead on even if you had them set before removal like a good QD mount. If I'm taking the scope/mount off with a wrench I would have time to put buis on.

Funny I had read your comment earlier in the thread and then when I went to find the vid I saw Frank's pic with the Elcan, but the 1 X "something" explanation makes sense to me, just not "that" 1 X something.

After all your very negative comments over time about Vortex scope, why are you using one?

Have you changed your mind?

Just got a good one?

MM

I had a red dot quit me right before a match a couple of weeks ago. It helped that I knew the irons were zeroed on the pistol and I was able to shoot the match. It happens.

All of my potential defense rifles wear BUIS, the Northtech I posted has magpul pro's in the picture. My scope is in an ADM Defense qd mount

No, most are not QD. Through a lot of use I have found that I prefer hard mounted optics. There are some good QD mounts such as the dual lever Bobro, but almost all POI shifts and loss of zero issues went away once I went back to hard mounting. All of the mounts can be taken off with a leatherman and/or screwdriver, knife, etc. They return to zero excellently.


Nah, you can't detach and reattach the irons. They're pretty low profile, and you shouldn't have an issue mounting an optic over them.









For one it's an issued optic. They're very good on 1x, have great illumination, and excellent FOV on 1x. However, one must understand that you can't buy that exact scope. That's the fourth (4th) one, all the others catastrophically failed within 3k rounds. If you go and buy a Razor 1-6x, it isn't the same scope.

Along with that, I use all kinds of optics. Most I wouldn't recommend for even play toys. However, part of my job is to test, evaluate, and know what's out there. If I'm saying that you do or do not want to use something, there's a reason. I am continuously using Vortex, Leupold, Swaro, etc, etc. However, when it comes to what I actually use outside of testing- I practice what I preach.

This is shaping up to be one of the most informative AR threads I have ever seen! Thanks to those that have participated and please keep it going....


X-VERMINATOR

I have held back from purchasing another 1-6 or 1-8 due to, what I assume is, few manufacturers being able to get it right for a reasonable price. At that point, another Aimpoint or Nightforce 2.5-10 makes sense and will get more use from me. The Bushnell SMRS didn't seem too bad, I just didn't care for Bushnell at the time. Seems like they have changed their warranty though since then.

My PSA 7 twist mid length multi with all magpul furniture wearing a 2.5-10x24 NF W/zero stop, a Burris FF 2 mounted 45 degrees off and magpul flip ups for last resort, the NP-1 lit reticle is really good for both eyes open shooting, the 30 round p mags are stuffed with 62 gr TSX's, as is an ultra reliable 100 round drum.

Formidilosus:

Got a couple of questions re: this



What is the weight of the M4A1 by itself? (With the Geissele trigger obviously)

What is the weight after everything else on the list has been attached? Guesstimate is fine.

(Not making a point. Not going to make a point. Just curious.)

? Feel free to comment on anything you like.


Guessing bare rifle is 7-7.5lbs. All up probably 10-10.5lbs.

OK, thanks man.

What 1-6x or 1-8x can you recommend? I've been using the SWFA 1-4x Mil-Quad for that niche, but I'd really like a little more magnification & stay under around 20 oz on weight.

MM

Right now the 1-6x SWFA SS HD is about the best from a durability and reliability standpoint. The Trijicon VCOG 1-6x has done well for us, as well as the 1-8x Accupower. On both of those there is a disclaimer- the VCOG had issues when the Marines were testing them, though they seemed to have figured it out and fixed them, and the 1-8x Accupower I have only seen two (2) and both have limited round counts- less than a couple thousand apiece.

From an actual "it will work always" standpoint the SWFA SS 1-6x is unmatched so far.

Thank You.

MM

Which Geissele trigger in a fighting gun?

MM,

No problem.









Well.. any of them. Depending on what you're using it for/skill level. The SSA is the commercial version of the Mil issued SSF. It's a great starting point. The SSA-E is the same but lighter pull weight- I prefer it, but I like light triggers, though for most probably ambit too light for dynamic shooting. The Super 3-Gun is good as well, but very different than the others. I have one of them with some spring combo that drops it to around 2lbs and it's one that I prefer.