|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620 |
What is true ebony? My interest is piqued. Ebony is a Genus of trees with very black wood.... Gaboon ebony is the most commonly used wood for making fore end tips on wood stocks. Persimmon has coal black heartwood, but not much of it. The sap wood is very white. Persimmon is extremely hard and heavy,, like black ebonies. It is used for making wood golf club heads. I saw a floor made of it at a golf country club and it was incredible. Persimmon, cut and dried, makes some fine woodcutting wedges that won't tear up your chainsaw if you accidentally hit it. Dogwood, too. I bet a persimmon floor would be impressive. Ed If you are into that sort of thing, try to get your hands on a chunk of mountain mahogany... it is the only NA wood I would say trumps persimmon... and I am including both ironwood and cocabolo in that comparison. Mountain mahogany was tested for use in woodwind instruments but they could not find fasteners stronger than the wood when testing screw-holding ability. Shuttles in woolen mills were exclusively made of persimmon forever because it never wore out... Sitka, is mountain mahogany the same as Madrone? i know i have destroyed many saw chains on Madrone No, madrone is nothing like mountain mahogany. Madrone is the absolute best wood for making charcoal for making black powder though. It leaves very little ash when it burns.it is also quite dense so it has some btus. It is fairly closely related to manzanita.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620 |
Buckeyes and horse chestnuts aren't the same thing.
Buckeyes have 5 palmed leaves with pointed tips and the fruits are covered with spines. The buds are dry.
Horse chestnuts have 7 palmed leaves with rounded tips and the fruits have fewer spines than buckeyes. The buds are sticky.
Buckeye trees get taller. Buckeyes are native to the US while horse chestnuts were introduced from Europe.
Neither are edible. Supposedly you can boil buckeye seeds to remove the acid and they're safe to eat. I tried it one time with some horse chestnuts. After a couple hours of boiling, they were still far too bitter to even taste.
Persimmon leaves are alternate down the stem. They aren't palmated like the ones in this photo. I have no idea where this info comes from, but it is mostly incorrect... Buckeyes and horse chestnuts belong to the same Genus and the names are pretty much interchangeable. To decide to call some buckeyes and others horse chestnuts goes against what everybody else has been doing for a very, very long time. Your separation by leaf numbers is completely false, as is the shape. If nothing else you are leaving out some of the common ones from Asia, Japan, and other parts of the World. Also, most can be crossed and produce fertile offspring in many cases... Same genus, yes. Same species, no. While they might cross, that doesn't make them the same thing. Case in point: dogs and wolves. I've argued for years that dogs and wolves are breeds of the same species but I've been outvoted time after time. So, I'll use everyone elses argument and contend that these trees are different. What they're commonly called is irrelevant. What they actually are is what matters and they are genetically different. Really!?! Sorry, but you are totally and completely incorrect. There are MANY species of bushes and trees called buckeyes/horse chestnuts. In many parts of the World they have their own names that we usually translate to buckeye/horse chestnut. They are all common names and generally don't mean squat. No texts that I used in college or since list a difference between buckeyes and horse chestnuts. They are not different groups under the same genus... splitters would be all over that. Your division by leaves is incorrect in every example I am aware of.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620 |
Back in the 1980's the Japanese got on a golfing kick, so they started buying up all of the persimmon they could find to make golf clubs with. Prices here soared. Lots of people would go to church on Sunday morning and come home to fine the persimmon tree in their yard gone. There was a minimum diameter that would be bought, but I forget the size. miles Fad trees take it hard sometimes!
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,258
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,258 |
I grabbed this from Wikipedia. It's a short list of common buckeye and horse chestnut species. If they're all the same, why this list? If they can interbreed and produce fertile seeds, then they're all the same species and this listing is all in error.
Aesculus arguta: Aesculus glabra
Aesculus californica: California buckeye (western North America)
Aesculus × carnea: red horse chestnut
Aesculus chinensis: Chinese horse chestnut (eastern Asia)
Aesculus chinensis var. wilsonii: Wilson's horse chestnut (eastern Asia)
Aesculus flava (A. octandra): yellow buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus glabra: Ohio buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus hippocastanum: common horse chestnut (Europe, native to the Balkans)
Aesculus indica: Indian horse chestnut (eastern Asia)
Aesculus neglecta: dwarf buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus parviflora: bottlebrush buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus parryi: Parry's buckeye (western North America, endemic in Baja California del Norte)
Aesculus pavia: red buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus pavia var. flavescens: Texas yellow buckeye, yellow woolly buckeye (eastern North America, narrowly endemic in Texas)
Aesculus sylvatica: painted buckeye (eastern North America)
Aesculus turbinata: Japanese horse chestnut (eastern Asia, endemic in Japan)
Aesculus wangii: Aesculus assamica (eastern Asia)
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620 |
Wiki is far from my first choice for definitive info on anything... but the same page you linked from starts with this: "Common names for these trees include "buckeye" and "horse chestnut" "
Notice where the common names derive and see if you do not catch on about common names versus scientific names...
You can be dumb, obtuse, whatever, but that should be enough... you probably had to read past that for your cut and paste!
Common names for these trees include "buckeye" and "horse chestnut"
You earlier posted different leaf counts for buckeyes and horse chestnuts... you were wrong there too as they all have the same leaf count.
Have a nice day!
art shaking head and laughing
Last edited by Sitka deer; 09/12/17. Reason: typo
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 6,245
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 6,245 |
Here in N. La., buckeyes grow on a bush that grows about head high. About the most buckeyes I ever saw on a bush was 10-12. When I worked in Ca., there buckeyes grew on trees. I saw buckeye trees that were 25-30 ft tall with hundreds of buckeyes. Just to make sure they were the same thing, I picked a few. The buckeyes from Ca. were larger. Yep, I saw the above picture and thought "That's not a Buckeye..." California Buckeye
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,620 |
Here in N. La., buckeyes grow on a bush that grows about head high. About the most buckeyes I ever saw on a bush was 10-12. When I worked in Ca., there buckeyes grew on trees. I saw buckeye trees that were 25-30 ft tall with hundreds of buckeyes. Just to make sure they were the same thing, I picked a few. The buckeyes from Ca. were larger. Yep, I saw the above picture and thought "That's not a Buckeye..." California BuckeyeAt least you won't have problems understanding that Aesculus means "horse chestnut" even though the common name is mostly "buckeye"... cannot be said for the denser sort... Where ya been, Scott?
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19,098
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19,098 |
Back in late 1969, early 1970, Not long after I had returned to Surveying for the Highway Dept. from my Army tour, We were topo'ing a yard North of Searcy, Arkansas for the new 4 lane version of US highway 167. The property owner came out and asked the Instrument man to guess what kind of tree that was in His yard. The Instrument man looked it over, and replied that it looked like a buckeye to Him, but He had never seen one that big. It was a tree about 8-10 inches in diameter. I had never seen a buckeye of any kind at the time, but I remember it very well. I could probably find that house, if it is still there, today. I got pretty good at ID'ing trees as time went along, but still ran into some transplants that would stump me. I figure that was brought in from elsewhere, as I never saw another as big in Arkansas after that. I did see a forty acre patch that was probably near 50% persimmon near Fordyce, Arkansas that was the largest that I ever saw. They would run between 24" and 30" diameter. I never knew until then that they got that big. All that I have ever seen was small, around 10" diameter. Was back there a few years later and that patch had been clearcut. miles
Look out for number 1, don't step in number 2.
|
|
|
|
|
653 members (1beaver_shooter, 1eyedmule, 10ring1, 1lessdog, 1234, 19rabbit52, 57 invisible),
2,910
guests, and
1,310
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,190,695
Posts18,456,662
Members73,909
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
