Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles John B. Snow says that the 6.5 Creedmoor is the ultimate rifle round

The 123 rolled stuff from Laupa in Swede looks like it'd be a dandy. Buy a case and find another hobby.

Can't tell if this is a serious post or not, but went back and read previous posts. Got it.

wyoming260,

The press has jumped on the "creedmore" (the spelling is Creedmoor, after a famous shooting range established in New York state in 1873) because both rifles and ammunition have been selling well for a long time. It was introduced a decade ago for target shooting, but within a short period hunters started buying them as well, partly because of the great ammo and widely available ammo that Formidilosus mentions, but partly because the rifles available tend to shoot well right out of the box.

I knew about the Creedmoor from the beginning, after reading about in several places, but the buzz in this part of Montana really started 2-3 years later, when local stores started stocking rifles and ammo. The hunters that bought both were very pleased with the accuracy and field performance--and they were mostly hunters who'd never purchased either a 6.5x55 or .260, because of a lack of rifles and ammo.

I wasn't one of those, because I owned and hunted with both 6.5x55's and .260's for a long time, and knew what they could do. But in 2010 I broke down and bought a Ruger Hawkeye in 6.5 Creedmoor at a local store, along with a few boxes of Hornady factory ammo. The rifle and ammo not only shot at least as well as handloads in my custom rifles 6.5x55 and .260, but were faster as well. (And I was using all the bells and whistles to load for those custom rifles, including Lapua, top match bullets, etc.)

As any example, the first 100-yard group with the 140 A-Max Hornady factory load went into .6 inch at 100 yards. That was with FIVE shots, not the 3-shot groups most hunters use, in a rifle that, aside from taking half an hour to work over the trigger, was just as it came from the factory. The muzzle velocity was also 100 fps higher than Remington 140-grain factory loads for the .260, and 200 fps higher than American factory loads for the 6.5x55.

Aside from that, the Hornady brass was very good--in every way that I can measure as good as Lapua, whether consistency in weight and dimensions, or case life. In fact I still have brass from 2010, and am still shooting it in my present 6.5 Creedmoor, a Ruger American Predator that cost half as much as the Hawkeye, but is if anything more accurate.

No, there's no real reason for anybody who has a good 6.5x55 or .260 to get rid of their rifle and buy a 6.5 Creedmoor. I still have both of mine, and have hunted with them since 2010, and like them a lot.

But for somebody looking to buy their first rifle chambered for a "moderate" 6.5 cartridge, there's every reason to buy a 6.5 Creedmoor instead. Not only is there a wide variety of very affordable and good factory ammo, but more and more rifle manufacturers chamber it, including some in Europe. After a decade it is NOT the current fad, but it well on its way to becoming a standard world-wide cartridge. If you and others want to pout about that in public, be my guest. If you don't want to buy a 6.5 Creedmoor, fine, nobody's forcing you.

In a way, this all reminds me somewhat of the to-do over the 7mm Remington Magnum back in the 1960's. I was just old enough to start hunting big game, but can remember it well. There wasn't any Internet back then, so every owner of a .270, 7x57, .280, .30-06, .300 H&H or whatever similar round couldn't stand up in public and complain about how the Seven Em Em Mag didn't do anything their favorite could do.

But there was still quite a bit of that bitching back then, in sporting goods stores and hunting camps, along with letter letters and even articles published in hunting magazines. But none of that mattered, because the 7mm Remington Magnum soon became a world-wide standard, chambered by just about every factory that makes bolt-action rifles. That's because thousands, and then hundreds or thousands, of shooters and hunters bought them, along with plenty of factory ammo.

Which is exactly what's happened with the 6.5 Creedmoor today. No, it is not the latest fad, it's a well-established factory round--just as the 7mm Remington Magnum was in 1972, a decade after it appeared.

I see that Lipsey's has had Ruger make a small, 250?, run of stainless 77 RSIs in 6.5 Creedmoor. Kind of tempting, the 21st Century answer to the 1903 Mannlicher-Schoenauers in 6.5x54 that were carried afield by the likes of Roy Chapman Andrews and Ernest Hemingway.

I didn't mean to denigrate Mr. Snow when I started this thread, but I can't control what other folks write.

I have to say that after seeing 6.5 Creedmoot at Walmart for 18.50 a box, I have to agree.

Yes, it surprised me too when I saw Winchester/Olin's Deer Season Extreme 125 grain load at Wal-Mart for $18.33, less than all the other CF hunting ammo that wasn't 30-30. As a counter point, I don't recall having seen a single box of any brand of 260, 6.5x55, or 6.5-284 factory ammo for sale at any price at Wal-Mart.

Screw JBS and the nag he rode in on!

Pretty much why I have seen/felt no need to jump on the latest wagon and buy a Creedmoor or six...

I like to try new things, so despite having rifles in 260, 6.5x55, 256 Newton, and 6.5-284, I started playing with the 6.5 Creedmoor in 2014. As I'm sure that you know, idle hands are the Devil's workshop.

Agreed. Idle hands definitely create an opportunity to 'need' something... I guess I'm just not quite the rifle nut that I used to be.

That pretty much sums up my feelings about the 6.5CM as well. If I wasn't a reloader I'd be looking hard at one. If I was starting fresh it would be on the "must have" list. Even as a reloader with a .257 Roberts pushed to +P velocities and a 6.5-06AI, I'm tempted.

If my Savage FXP3 .243 had not turned out to be such a great shooter, I'd probably already have one. Paid $295 out the door for it with every intention of rebarreling it with a cheap 6.5CM barrel. Typical "Don't shoot the donor" scenario.

"Ultimate" sells.

What is this "factory ammo" of which you speak......

I think the popularity of the Creedmoor is mostly what fuels the disdain of unabashed Creedmoor haters like myself. If 90% of 6.5 converts were being baptized in the New and Everlasting Church of the Holy .260 (or 6.5 Swede) I would probably be looking for a couple nicely dressed young men that were going door to door passing out factory Creedmoor ammo. Heaven help me if I ever see a Ruger American chambered in 6.5-06!

Hating an inanimate object doesn't make sense to me. If you don't like something, don't buy it, simple as that.

^This. I especially never understood hating cartridges.

You know I have been reading magazines on outdoors, rifles, shotguns, handguns, tactical this or that, Boys Life since about 1982 and in all that time I have never read an article that was negative about any rifle, shotgun or hand gun or anything new or trendy! Nothing worse then someone that worships at the altar of all things periodical spouting nonsense about "modern" and "technology" it is laughable. Nothing that has come down the road cartridge wise has any new technology in it. The cases, the bullets, and the primers are unchanged for well over 60 years. Sure powder has changed some but that is it. Anyone can take 100 year old technology and alloys and crank out a new design that is not new technology or modern anything!

This is what we have today thanks to gun writers and maybe public schools and universities! 1) People who can not think for themselves and decide what is pertinent and what is a distraction. 2) Short Actions are lighter and stiffer and more accurate so I should build a trendy whammy short magnum or short fat round on a short action! 3) I need to run the heaviest for caliber VLD's in everything from my plinking rifle, my hunting rifle and my F-Class rig.4) I can not feed my short super whammy trendy cartridge from the magazine of a short action unless I seat the super heavy VLD bullet into the case and eat into powder capacity! 5) How do I get 3999fps out of my 6.5 PRC from my R700 SA with 180gr 6.5mm Berger. 6) To fit in the magazine so you do not have single shot rifle that bullet is so far away from the rifling especially if you used some custom spec.'ed reamer to allow you to shoot loaded ammo with an OAL that will never fit in that magazine.

The above is almost all you hear on forums. That and people trying to figure out how to build a 338LM on an action that really was not meant to handle a cartridge that long because they did not do their home work. All of the above is so easy to see coming and not fall for.



Bartlein and Hawk Hill Custom make up 69% of the barrels on the top 100 shooters in PRS (https://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/11/21/precision-rifle-barrels/).I know that is 2015 info but it was readily available. That said I can remember when Brux, Krieger,Hart, Lija, Shilien and Douglas where all at the top in one form of shooting or another.

Over the next 40 years I am sure I will see many more cartridges come and go but very few stick around or have any staying power. Their is very good reasons why the 30-06Spr, 25-06R, 270W, 300WM, 300 Whby Mag, 7RM, 22LR, 30-30, 45-70, 308 Win, 338WM, .243W, 7-08R, 6.5-06, 7Mauser, 8Mauser,6.5 Swede, 260R, 6BR, 6PPC, 6 Dasher, 22PPC,22-250, 458 Lott, 404 Jeffery, 375 H&H, 9.3x62 are still with us and popular. When Hornady stops making 6.5 Creedmore brass you can always switch to 260R. Oh and seldom is your fastest load your most accurate load which is another thing people always seem to forget about. Unless you are shooting at close range group size down range is always more important than almost anything else.


The 6 Creedmore and 6.5 Creedmore have little going for them in terms of hunting or target shooting. The 6PRC and 6.5PRC likewise other then being trendy better cartridges have come and gone then they will likely ever be. It is not that the cartridges can not be made to work so much as they can never live up to the hype being showered upon them combined with better options already existing. Hornady's brass is not inline with it's price in terms of number of reloads compared to things that cost a little more but give you 3x-5x the life expectancy. There are cartridges that will produce the same practical results with less powder and lower pressure. There are cartridges that give better barrel life. There are cartridges that give you more powder space and higher velocities. It can not do what 284 does in F-open, TR can not use it, PRS guys are favoring 6mm low recoiling rounds. Bench Rest is not interested. The newer cartridges in rural America can be hard to find and when you do find them you have limited selection of bullet weights and construction. We already have everything we will ever need to to hunt Elephants to Elk and P-Dogs and Pheasants in cartridges that have been with us since 1963 and prior. Hype is a double edge sword because when the real life results do not match it leave a sour taste. Worse than that though you get all kinds of of guys showing up on the internet praising it because if they admit they where suckered in by the hype and marketing they will look like fools. On top of that people that look to make a living selling you things are in the business of not being as honest as we would like because they have to keep you buying.

In many ways Tubbs 6XC 117gr. and 115gr. DTAC makes far more sense then the 6CM and 6.5CM from a target shooting perspective but he never had any real backing or support and no deep pockets like Hornady, NORMA and Lapua. Likewise the popularity of the 338LM is silly for any American when you look at the 338RUM, 338Edge, and look at of an action to build a proper 338LM with out modification to an action never meant to handle a cartridge that long. Any penny's you save modifying an action is lost to machine time unless you do it your self.On top of that the cheaper options have not proven to be very accurate in many cases.

In my lifetime I have not seen anything too amazing in rifle cartridges because it always comes down to barrel life vs powder burnt vs trajectory vs cost for special proprietary brass vs weight of action vs weight of barrel and what it can do for you in real life. Some people do not mind spending 5X as much in the long run to gain 100fps but that is foolish when you look at real world results. You never get 5X the accuracy or consistency. The margin of return starts to drop off fast.

In the next 10-15 years we will see a lot of changes because all the Baby Boomers with the deep pockets and the time to actually perfect their skills with lots of range time or a range in their back yard will start dying off at an accelerated rate. I think we will see things go in a different direction. Not sure yet which direction things will go or if it will be good or bad. We do not have as many Doctors, Lawyers, Engineers, Machinist in the population as we once had and fewer youth are getting into hunting or shooting sports. It will be interesting for sure and I am thinking chaos!

You are out of your [bleep] Tree!

In my opinion it's a BIG stretch. I think a .270 Winchester is all you need. Then there's the 7x57 or the .280 Remington. Or the .284 or the .30-06 or the what ever!!! How can you say things like that?

It's basically like heated seats and carpet in a pickup...

Like most magnums that were sold over the last 60 years, most hunters don't need any new cartridge or .600 BC bullets to kill or shoot the deer family of animals 100, maybe 200 yards away (the deer feeder and tree stand crowd, maybe 50).

The Creedmoors fill a lot of wants and probably zero needs, but 30-30's are pretty boring.