Home Forums Reloading Varmint Rifles Barrel life!

My .222 is 8500 rounds old, my 223 is 4500 rounds old.. I have friend who have about 12,000 rds though his 222.. The accuracy fell of so he rechambered to a .223... What are you folks finding the barrel life is in these two rounds??? If figure I have 10 years of shooting before age gets me.. These two may not last those years out.. I often put a 1000 rds, per rifle per year though these two.. Of course my swifts, and .22-250's account for a lot of rds also.. What is the barrel life of these rounds in your experience????

The GUN DIGEST scope expert for many years, the late Bob Bell, hunted woodchucks in Pennsylvania a lot. He mentioned a Sako .222 he owned that had been used to fire in excess of 10,000 rounds. Apparently, that was about where the accuracy fell off. He also rechambered to .223.

The barrel lasts as long as your are satisfied with your results, either in the field or on paper.

And I would recommend you think about rechambering, just like Bob Bell did. Good barrels deserve reincarnation.

I've shot out a 223, a 25-06 and a 22BR. The throats all eroded and I couldn't shoot the bullets I liked, so off they came. The BR barrel was cut back and re-done in 221 Fireball and it shoots better than me; the result was so good I still have the 25-06 barrel and 223 barrel in the project bin, both will be cut back and re-chambered in something else.
As for round life, I think the 06 lived about 1500 rounds. That barrel liked very warm loads.
The BR, about 3000, it's "new" round count is about that much now so far. It wasn't a great barrel to start with, but it really liked light bullet mild loads, so going to 221 was a good fit to what it wants.
The 223 barrel went about 4000 rounds -- it was kind of long in the throat when brand new anyway, shot a lot of loads well, slayed a lot of critters, and aside from a throat that looks like a dry mudhole, is still mostly pretty inside.

One caveat for re-incarnation. Ask your gunsmith about giving you a short throat, which will leave you the most possible life. It may crimp your style a little with heavy, hot loads, but I've always been more than willing to give up a couple hundred FPS for consistency and accuracy.

"Barrels don't wear out; throats burn out." - Rick Jamison, in a recent Rifle piece.

Then Rick was badly mistaken, I'm afraid. Aberdeen Proving Grounds has seen many 223 barrels become completely smooth (rifling gone) for all but just the last little bit before the muzzle. This according to a former test director there. Apparently, most ball powder is much more abrasive than extruded (or was?).

could that be due to automatic rate of fire with fmj bullets?

My thought as well. Believe Rick was talking about sporters.

Worked with a WW2 Navy vet that told me about how they fired their AA guns until the barrels started drooping from the heat, then unscrewed them, dropped 'em over the side, and wrenched in a new one and kept at it. Must have been in the Pacific, I'm thinking.

Abrasive or erosive? Or maybe both?

my Remington 700 V 223 REM. started loosing accuracy after about 3,000 rounds but at 9,000 rounds it still shot an inch at 100 yards ,but I still put a different barrel on it. the old barrel grooves were bad out to about 6 inches but that barrel still shot well at 9,000 rounds and many dogs died to that old killer of a gun !

The info I have does not reveal the difference.

The powder used and quantity has some input on how fast the throat wears or lasts...

Traded off a Ruger 77 VT with 15,000 rounds plus down the barrel...

good percentage was Blue Dot loads at Prairie Dogs and Sage Rats...

Ran into its new owner at the range one day, who bought it from the gun dealer
I had traded it to, on a new Savage BVSS...

He had ran 2000 rounds down it the previous season...
asked him how it shot...we walked down range together...and looked at the target
as he was going to be pulling out...

5 shots could still be covered by about a nickle...

He was shooting 25 grains H335, and 55 grain Ballistic Tips...

He had family that worked at Nosler and every spring got 2000, 55 grain Ballistic Tips
as a birthday present...

He was happy with the rifle... but was planning on turning the barrel back, and rechambering after the
coming season...

Trading in the rifle and $125, got me a new Savage BVSS... is why I hadn't just rebarreled it myself.

Thanks for the info.. I guess I will shoot til they go sour.. May add a .223AI to cut the wear on the other two.. Thanks again..

My first 223 was a used Herters. I am still shooting it and it has in excess of 15000 rounds by me. It sounds a lot like the one Seafire talked about. When I look down the bore It is definitely worn but still shoots about an inch at a hd. yards. When I rebarrel I think it will be a 20 Practical.

A good friend (and excellent shot--he was on the Marine Corps rifle team for a while) put 20,000 rounds through a .223 Remington before it quit shooting "minute of prairie dog."

The quickest a prairie dog barrel gave up for my standards was under 2000 rounds--a Remington 700 VTR in .204 Ruger that was my primary PD rifle for a couple years, so was shot hot and often. Have since gone to smaller cartridges for my primary rifle.

Used a heavy-barreled .223 Remington for a few years, which is now my wife's only centerfire rodent rifle. Durin its first 1000 rounds it was the most accurate factory centerfire I've ever owned, but after several thousand rounds wasn't. Fire-lapping the worn throat improved the accuracy considerably, but not back to its early standards. Still, it shoots its standard handload (and most factory ammo) into around half an inch for 5 shots at 100. I suspect it will do for a few more thousand rounds, and when it doesn't, it will be easy to set the barrel back and start again.

The amount of powder burned has the most effect on throat erosion, according to various military tests, but the size of the hole also really has an effect. But erosion visible in a bore-scope doesn't always affect accuracy.

My Blue Dot loads were running from 10 to 14.5 grains of powder...
depending on bullet weight from 12 to 14.5 grains using 40 to 55 grain bullets...

down to 10 grains, I was duplicating 22 Mag loads....with heavier bullets...

If one shoots a lot, you learn to " get an eye" for accuracy with that rifle when you use it..

what I refer to, is I had a new barrel from ER Shaw in 223, I mounted on a Model 70..

For the first 1500 rounds it was the least accurate 223 I had...

Still going over and shooting sage rats, I was still able to pretty much average the same
on hits, as I was with my accurate 223s...

After 1500 rounds, the accuracy got a lot better with that barrel...

but its percentage of hits in the field never really climbed..

Ask this question once of Ingwe in a PM... he responded that he figures in at least 10,000 rounds..
out of a 223....I think that is AT LEAST bare minimum...

if barrel wear goes south, I have found Blue Dot and SR 4759 will still nurse the accuracy out
of that barrel another couple thousand rounds....and that is shooting pop can sized sage rats...

Thanks it looks like I will not be in bind then.. My .223 is excellent right now as is the .222, so I will just have to watch the groups,, Setting the barrel back would be an easy deal as both are 26 & 27 inches long.. Many thanks..

That's a wise choice...

I had a doctor friend locally, that sadly passed in 2003...

but he had an old Heavy Barrel Sako in 222 he bought in high school in the late 50s working
at a gun shop in San Francisco...

he went to Australia for a few years and took it with him down there and used it a lot on
Kangaroos etc... he worked on a "Sheep Station" as he called it, in Western Australia...

When it passed, he had an 18 inch barrel on it...he told me that he had started out with a 26 inch barrel
but since he loved the gun, he just would rechamber when accuracy went south....

so from about 1958, to about 1998, it was rechambered enough times to shorten the barrel a total of 8 inches...

must have been a truck load of rounds down that thing in its life...

it was still a track driver when I shot it...and also a hell of a nice rifle...

Like they use to make them...

Blue dot loads and H335,AA 2230 will extend the barrel life on a 223 and AI version vs many of the stick powders. Also, as the throat gets long, go to a 55g Sierra semi point bullet which is as accurate as many match custom bullets.

The throats errode not only length wise but diameter also. A gunsmith has to have over size pilots for his reamer over a regular 9 pilot set to match the enlarged dia. of the new throat area. I have set back my own barrels with some allegator hide in the new throat and they will still shoot extremely well. The main issue is to get the throat dia back to within .0002 of the muzzle dia, and cutting off .250-.375 off the muzzle may be a great thing to do also due to back wash of the gases.

An issue on set backs is some of the chrome moly barrels are very, very hard. Also from a lot of firing, this area becomes extra hard and this may dull reamers. The gunsmith has to indicate the barrel in to attempt to get the rifle chamber on the same centerline as the bore centerline, and on barrels that have been fired a lot, getting these two numbers within .0003 is tough to impossible.

Accuracy is a relative thing. I have a Hart barrel that is on it's third chamber, now a 23" 223 AI, 14T, and N133 eats throats in a hurry(2000 rounds max).

Factory chambers are only close at best with the centerline of bore, but if you have had a really good gunsmith install the first barrel, he can indicate in on his own chamber and you will have a very, very good barrel set back. Getting the bore line to match the centerline of the chamber is critical for super accuracy as the bullet is getting started straight in the throat.

During the p. dog wars, we went to 30" unturned blanks. We would cut off 3/4" on the first rechamber, then around 1.5", then 2" on subquent chambers, and at 23-24" we would get the last chamber...these barrels were all made by Hart.

If you want to maximize your dollars on a custom barrel for varmint or target use and do not want a Unturned Blank, the purchase of a Max Heavy Varmint contour as long as you can stand it, will get you multiple chambers on it because of the 5" of straight section on the breach end. Be aware that some powders and calibers may errode a barrel for the first 6-10" of the bore and re chambering is not advisable.

I have my reamers ground with zero freebore, thorat for what ever bullet I want to shoot, and I set back my barrel when the leade has grown .100 or so. I would NEVER wait till the barrel quit shooting till I set the barrel back...things may have gone too far. I only shoot 416 Stainless barrels.

Over the years, I found that I could cut off good shooting barrels and they would get back to being great shooting barrels like they were in the beginning, but it takes a lot of work to re chamber a factory barrel...about twice the amount of work and time that it takes to chamber a new barrel blank. Factory chambers are crooked as hell and you have to make some compromises, especially if the bore is NOT running true or has a sweep in it right where the throat starts.

ON a new Remington varmint, it is good thinking to just cut the threads off and start from there, go to a Savage barrel nut if you have to to get rid of run out in the factory chamber, then you will have a 1/4" shooting barrel. Rechambering a factory barrel is a pain in the ass if you want a super accurate barrel , and I would advise against it if you have high expectations of guaranteed accuracy, there are exceptions. Self-respect leads me to rechamber my custom barrels only, and my exceptions on very rare occasions are Remington Stainless factory barrels, especially the Varmint weight barrels.

Hope this helps

Thanks for the post and insight Keith....

My friend Damon, with that old Sako, was taught to handload in Australia
on the Sheep Station by an old Aussie WW 1 Vet....

They were far from any real towns.. so anything was hard to come by.

But the old Aussie would take surplus 4895, which was abundant and cheap
back in the late 50s. He'd just poor a pile of powder on the table...

after resizing his case and priming it... he'd fill the case with 4895 via a spoon
until it over flowed... than skim off the top with a card...then seat his 50 grain
bullet on top and crimp it.

Damon said the old Aussie's shots were as good as anyone else on the station.

Although he didn't load all of his other rifles that way, when I knew him...
he'd load that old Sako 222, by filling it with 4895 to the brim, and seat and then
crimp the 55 grain bulk bullets he would buy...

I'd ask him about why he did it that way, once he learned easier ways...

He replied it was strictly a tribute to the old Aussie that taught him that way,
and who had taught him so much more in his two years down in Oz..

Life was simpler than our 'high tech" ways of doing things nowadays...
and still got the job done...

and Damon had said, 4895 was the only powder that rifle ever burned...
once he started handloading....which was a necessity in Western Australia
where he spent two years on that Sheep Station.

That is the same input, generally speaking, that the fellow from Aberdeen gave me.