Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Always thought "Speed Kills".....

Anytime you plant any kind of bullet in the vitals of an animal at 2x the speed of sound or greater... it's gonna die. Doesn't matter if it's a .223 or a .458.

That being said I have a whelen project in the works right now =]

Is this an inside joke, or does LA consider those calibers primitive weapons?

They do consider them 'primitive'. Mississippi also. I've seen more 35 Whelen ammo on the shelves in MS than I ever saw in AK.

I've been hunting slow this year, and have been pleasantly surprised. Not so premium bullets perform nicely launched a bit slower, so it seems. I've been shooting the old 140 interlock out of my Creed, and it's been great for bucks. Need to kill a few more these next few weeks to really get a good look at it, but I've been surprised at good exits and the lack of blowing shoulders to smithereens like I did with more speed.

On private land in Mississippi you can use any legal firearm,
Ronnie
Primitive Weapons
Weapons legal for use during the Primitive Weapons season are all archery equipment and primitive firearms. "Primitive firearms," for the purpose of hunting deer, are defined as single or double-barreled muzzleloading rifles of at least .38 caliber; OR single shot, breech loading, metallic cartridge rifles (.35 caliber or larger) and replicas, reproductions, or reproductions of those type rifles with an exposed hammer; OR single or double-barreled muzzleloading shotguns, with single ball or slug. All muzzleloading primitive firearms must use black powder or a black powder substitute with percussion caps, #209 shotgun primers, or flintlock ignition. "Blackpowder substitute" is defined as a substance designed, manufactured, and specifically intended to be used as a propellant in muzzleloading or other black powder firearms, excluding modern smokeless powder. Metallic cartridges may be loaded with either black powder or modern smokeless powder (cartridges purchased at sporting goods stores). Telescopic sights are allowed while hunting with any primitive firearm during the primitive weapon seasons. During any open season on deer with primitive weapons after November 30, a person may use any legal weapon of choice on private lands only, if the person is the title owner of the land, the lessee of the hunting rights on the land, a member of a hunting club leasing the hunting rights on the land, or a guest of a person specified above. If the person is required to have a hunting license, the person must have a primitive weapon license, Sportsman's License, or a Lifetime Sportsman's License.

Copied from La. Hunting Regulation handbook


LEGAL GEAR
Legal Gear for Primitive Firearms Season
includes:
–
Rifles or pistols, .44 caliber minimum, or
shotguns 10 gauge or smaller, all of
which must load exclusively from the
muzzle, use black powder or approved
substitute only, take ball, shot, or bullet
projectile only, including saboted bul
lets. All of the above may be fitted with
magnified scopes.

Single shot, breech loading rifles or sin
gle shot, breech loading pistols, .35 cali
ber or larger, having an exposed ham
mer that use metallic cartridges loaded
either with black powder or modern
smokeless powder. All of the above may
be fitted with magnified scopes.
–
Single shot, breech loading shotguns,
10 gauge or smaller, having an exposed
hammer, loaded with buckshot or slug.

That's a good one, JPro.

I posted the Primitive hunting specs above and the 30-30 is not considered a primitive weapon. A friend of mine had a 30-30 single shot and had it bored to a .375 Win., so he could 'primitive weapon' hunt with it.

I think it's really just a way to put extra fees on a license and generate more revenue. It made a little more sense back when we could shoot single shots of .375 or greater. A 444 or 45-70 isn't that much different in performance from in-line muzzleloaders. But in reality, a full-house Whelen is a 400yd rifle with the right bullets.

Speed flattens trajectory. But bullets don't kill. Speed doesn't kill. Guns don't kill. Shell casings and powder charges don't kill.
Bullet HOLES kill. This is the premise of the OPs post and he is 100% correct.

Many US Service men walk around alive today with metal in their bodies. I know from personal experience! Many of those metal pieces were put there at velocities well over that of rifle bullets, but if they hit someplace non-vital, they can be survived.

Bullet holes that penetrate vital places are what kills!

Case closed.

The .35 Whalen is fairly fast. I love my .38-55 WIN. It does a nice job. But it drop them as quick as my 257 WBY. Speed does some amazing things.

So my single shot 7mm 08, break action, is primitive? Somebody has too many deer.

7mm-08 is smaller than .35 Caliber.

Penetration kills...with speed it kills quicker.

Dan

This

My 45-70 has the trajectory of a brick thrown off a cliff. But I guarantee it will kill anything I point it at.

JPro,

When Mississippi originally went to the primitive weapon rules everybody down there that new me was calling because I had an in at H&R and could help them get a 45-70 or .444. Gun shops down there was putting buyers on a waiting list for the next one they got in. I had both and actually preferred the .444.

Just before I retired and moved back down there, Mississippi changed the rules to allow the Encore and 35 cal. rifles. I got 35 Whelen barrels for mine and eventually gave one to my brother. He liked it so much he's one of those guys you refer to. He hasn't used another gun for almost eight years. Last year he finally gave it a break and used I .308 Win. I bought him.

Bought an H&R 444marlinn off a buddy a few years ago , really like it for some reason . Short stubby w/a 1.5x6-36 Bushnell 4200 firefly reticle scope , it shot 1'' groups at 50 yards with some 225gr, FTX starting loads .
It's going to be my close range treestand/blind/night hunting gun , going to try the shade tree ceramic coat paint on it .
Got some 300gr. pistol bullets sitting on the shelf , should really knock the stuffing out of a big hog .

As I mature [get older] these type guns appeal to me more and more b/c they appear to work just fine .

JPro you're being way too nice to those coyotes ..
Nice hog !

Rifles are like cars. When you're young, you want fast and sporty. As you get older, you want comfort and reliability.

I want to get an H&R .444