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More fun with Manners - It's a long journey #12643007 02/15/18
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257heaven Offline OP
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I waited 10 months for my EH-8. Was supposed to have a barrel inlet for a Rock #2 with a 1" shank. When I finally got it, it was inlet for a 1-3/4" or so shank, so it was not acceptable. I contacted Manners and they said send it back. The inlet mistake made me sick, so I let it sit for a couple of months before emailing back and letting them know I would send it in. Matt was very helpful and I asked if they could change the bottom metal inlet from ADL to BDL, and he said he would take care of it. I asked the cost and was told no cost.

So I sent it back. Matt asked me to send in everything, including my bottom metal, trigger, etc. So I sent it all in.

That was a week shy of 3 months ago. I checked 2 or 3 weeks ago and was told that the Shot Show was delaying everything, but I was next in line. I received an email from Manners a few days ago with an invoice attached for a good sum of money. I forwarded it to Matt, and he said he'd take care of it.

The big brown truck came today with the delivery. The stock looks great. I laid the barreled action in it and it fit perfectly. Manners also bedded the action and lug, and it is a very nice job. Looks perfect and has the BDL inlet.

I keep digging and find the bolt. But the BDL floorplate, mag box, spring and follower, and action screws are nowhere to be found. Somehow, I knew with this jinxed project that I wouldn't get it all back.

I'll wait for a response, but not feeling too good about it at this point. And for the first time in my custom rifle building life, I have lost interest and don't even care to shoot this damn rifle.

BTW, it's a 250AI that I waited a long time to get back from Diablo/Ryan Kelsey....but I was lucky and actually got it back with the work done as ordered after staying on him for several weeks. I hear some were not so lucky.

To be continued.....if anybody is still reading. LOL.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643075 02/15/18
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Holy hemorrhoid - perfectly understandable to have lost your vigor for this project.

My Manners experience was quite similar to yours in both timeframe and incorrectness. They offered to make it right but the proverbial horse had already left the barn.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643107 02/15/18
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I knew I should have just kept it and bedded the barrel channel. But I didn't want to take the time to do that...even though I've done it a few times on other stocks. Live and learn. What pisses me off is that was my only set of stainless BDL metal. I can make do with a black set for now. Rifle is all stainless.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643132 02/15/18
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You need to call a witch doctor to break that rifle's curse.

Seriously though, that really sucks....hope they get your bottom metal back to you without issue.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643134 02/15/18
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Wouldn’t happen to be on a Pierce ti action, would it?

IC-A

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643137 02/15/18
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Glad I read this, I don’t think I’ll send the one I have back to be painted.
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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: AKwolverine] #12643149 02/15/18
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i have gotten tired of getting stocks that arent right anymore after waiting months...i have gone to having gunsmiths fit a stock to my barreled action with either a bansner/brown/rimrock blank and have had a better looking finished product

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: AKwolverine] #12643164 02/15/18
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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
Wouldn’t happen to be on a Pierce ti action, would it?


No sir. SS Rem 700. Why?


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643188 02/15/18
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Just curious who has mine. 😞

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643197 02/15/18
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Figured in the campfire world, there was a halfway decent chance it was you - and it would help explain the need for a witch doctor!!!

IC-B

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643207 02/15/18
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Manners makes a great stock and they are good guys. They arent perfect to say the least and often dont have their [bleep] together. Tom needs to hire me. grin

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643260 02/15/18
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257heaven Offline OP
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I may be calling on Tom if they don't send my bottom metal back to me.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: AKwolverine] #12643264 02/15/18
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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
Just curious who has mine. 😞


Damn.....I kinda' thought that was why you were asking. I was lucky to not only get mine back, but with the work done. Seems like I waited about 4 months. And I was waiting to order the stock to make sure Ryan did the shank length I specified.



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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643282 02/15/18
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Tom Manners is a great guy and always bends over backwards to correct their mistakes, but the question remains; why are there so many errors in providing the customer what he ordered? I’ve only ordered two Manners stocks. I love the design and the quality was excellent but neither one of them showed up as ordered and both had to go back to have corrections made.

John


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12643807 02/15/18
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Custom guns are roulette....but I keep playing because I'm an idiot. Just got a McMillan that I've been waiting for and the machining looks right. I was actually surprised.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644353 02/16/18
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Not to hijack your thread, but I’m still fighting the battle with Ryan Kelsey/Diablo. MANY empty promises. He contacted me out of the blue last May and said my rifle was completed and he would ship it next time he goes into town. Guess the liar doesn’t go to town much because I still haven’t heard or seen a thing.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644412 02/16/18
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Got a reply today that they found my bottom metal and they are shipping it. I bet they are sick of hearing and seeing my name.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: deerhunter5555] #12644423 02/16/18
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Originally Posted by deerhunter5555
Not to hijack your thread, but I’m still fighting the battle with Ryan Kelsey/Diablo. MANY empty promises. He contacted me out of the blue last May and said my rifle was completed and he would ship it next time he goes into town. Guess the liar doesn’t go to town much because I still haven’t heard or seen a thing.


Wow! I thought everything had been resolved. So he still has yours and AKwolv’s rifles? I guess I really was lucky to have mine back. I kinda wonder if he was leasing a space and got locked out? The landlord may have taken possession if that was the case. Surely not.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644744 02/16/18
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Action only on my end. Purchased with intent of Ryan doing the build, but when reports of more than the usual ‘smith issues began surfacing, I asked for my action to be sent. Ryan stated that he had used it on another build “ as I said he could.” He apparently was confusing me with another. Supposedly there was a replacement ordered and on it’s way to me. That was many moons, shaggy dog stories, and unreturned communications ago. I hold out hope it is “lost” at my FFL...

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644861 02/16/18
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For you gents waiting on Ryan Kelsey, ride his a$$, call his cell phone every weekend, email him, and you might get lucky. He started my build last April, when it all blew up on here he had my money, and I decided (based on his promises) to ride it out and let him finish the project. He sent me pics of the finished rifle in early Sept; and after chasing him relentlessly for several months he finally shipped it in late-Jan......after getting false tracking numbers a couple of times. I was amazed when the FFL told me it had come in. Now getting a bug or two worked out by a local gunsmith.......It will end up being an inexpensive custom rifle, but man was it painful......

Tim

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644872 02/16/18
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I’m about 18 months in between Kelsey and Manners. Not too bad, but I may still need to send it to have it bead blasted........again.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12644889 02/16/18
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I freaking despise liars. Ryan has proven to be a liar over and over again. I’m on YEARS now. Way past time to go the legal route. I’m gonna gather up everything and start calling the Attorney General and the ATF. Didn’t want this fight, but he brought it on himself.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: Hondo64d] #12645226 02/16/18
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Originally Posted by Hondo64d
Tom Manners is a great guy and always bends over backwards to correct their mistakes, but the question remains; why are there so many errors in providing the customer what he ordered? I’ve only ordered two Manners stocks. I love the design and the quality was excellent but neither one of them showed up as ordered and both had to go back to have corrections made.

John


Same here. And one trip back, they kept the entire action and only returned the stock, then when the action was returned, it was missing the screws, and they sent new replacements that I had to trim and weren't cerakoted to match (like my original ones were). The other stock that was returned had a mini-chassis system, and when it came back, the action was bedded to it, which pretty much defeats the purpose of the mini-chassis.

Great stocks, but I don't want the headache. McMillan has never delivered a stock that wasn't 100%.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: gene270] #12645253 02/16/18
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Originally Posted by gene270
i have gotten tired of getting stocks that arent right anymore after waiting months...i have gone to having gunsmiths fit a stock to my barreled action with either a bansner/brown/rimrock blank and have had a better looking finished product


While more costly, this is sounding more and more like a better route. Experience can be an expensive teacher!

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12646058 02/16/18
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Manners customer service is a bad joke.


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A good liberal will give you the shirt off someone else's back.

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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12646089 02/16/18
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About 4 years ago I had Manners make a simple ADL stock for a rem 700 short action barreled action. When I received it the ADL mag box inlet was ~1/2 inch short, as in the front of the mag box inlet needed opened up by that much. I could have dremeled it out but thought I should let them know in case it as an error with their inlet programming. Tom requested I send it in with my barreled action. He fixed the inlet and pillar bedded it while it was there. They did right by me + some but it would have been better for both if it was right from the start. They make a quality product but could use a bit of polish on the little things.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12646204 02/16/18
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don't be telling these kinda stories. I have a Manners on order.....

Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: deerhunter5555] #12647756 02/17/18
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Originally Posted by deerhunter5555
Not to hijack your thread, but I’m still fighting the battle with Ryan Kelsey/Diablo. MANY empty promises. He contacted me out of the blue last May and said my rifle was completed and he would ship it next time he goes into town. Guess the liar doesn’t go to town much because I still haven’t heard or seen a thing.


He installed a fluted take of barrel for me (one of his barrels) and installed a side discharge muzzle brake. Muzzle brake was great but the barrel was a full half a flute off (in spite of my written instructions to index). Shipped it back with no insurance even though I sent $35 extra to cover the insurance. He worked on it again and the flutes are still off a little plus he forgot to re-index the brake, which now sits obviously off level and the gun torques at the shot. I'm just going to eat it at this point and pay someone else to do the work I already paid him to do.


257heaven,
Sorry to hear about all your troubles. I've been down that road myself several times unfortunately, both in the past and recently. My local part time gunsmith quit when the ITAR rules came out. Had shoddy work by a couple of others since then. There is a gunsmith about 2 hours away recommended by the local guy who quit. I've spoken with him and he says he will do the work while I am there to save me another 2 hour drive. This is his website www.valleyviewguns.com . If he is as good as it sounds it will be well worth the drive.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's been a long journey [Re: ctsmith] #12650223 02/18/18
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Originally Posted by ctsmith
Manners makes a great stock and they are good guys. They arent perfect to say the least and often dont have their [bleep] together. Tom needs to hire me. grin

They need to hire someone...
My Manners stock does not fit my bottom metal well, at all...This was after another snafu that caused me a delay. It's a nice stock but I don't think I want any more from them.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12658573 02/20/18
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Got my bottom metal back today!!! Woohoo!

Stock looks great. Now to shoot it and see what's what.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12658662 02/20/18
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Nice bedding job


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12660659 02/21/18
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That looks incredible, 257. Blasers have almost cured me of custom rifles. I have yet to have issues, know what to expect and they shoot as well as the better customs out there without all the feeding and function problems and various other problems with customs.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12660683 02/21/18
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I'm glad it finally worked out for you. I'm a fan of buying used with stocks. Of the half-dozen manners' that I've had over the years only one was ordered new....and that was a long time ago. It was the T2 when he first started making the stock and had a group buy on the hide. Currently I'm down to 0 manner's and just all McM's but I really want to try an EH-6

That rifle looks great!!!


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12661127 02/21/18
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Thanks, guys. I may have to try a blaser one day.

And I remember those snipers hide group buys. I got in on a few. Cost me a lot of money!!


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12663069 02/22/18
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Originally Posted by 257heaven
Got my bottom metal back today!!! Woohoo!

Stock looks great. Now to shoot it and see what's what.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]


That looks real nice 257heaven.........could you tell me what your barrel length is please????

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12663140 02/22/18
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Thanks. 22”.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12664818 02/22/18
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Steve, that stock looks nice! Mind if I ask, why the flush cups?


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12673772 02/25/18
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Sent my barreled action, mag box, spring/floorplate and bottom metal to Manners this weekend. Hoping it goes well and turns around quickly.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12674055 02/25/18
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Originally Posted by 257heaven
Got my bottom metal back today!!! Woohoo!

Stock looks great. Now to shoot it and see what's what.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]




Dibs... grin

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12674073 02/25/18
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cant dig that style of stock with the open grip, but I like the colors and the bedding looks good. Congrats.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #12674886 02/26/18
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I got a call yesterday from McMillian. This is the 5th time they have called to straighten out my order. This time they lost the paperwork.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: Clarkm] #12675385 02/26/18
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Phone call #6 just now.
Did you want pillars with that? Gotta have pillars or we can't warranty.


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The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.-- Edward John Phelps
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: Clarkm] #12675411 02/26/18
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Originally Posted by Clarkm
Phone call #6 just now.
Did you want pillars with that? Gotta have pillars or we can't warranty.


Then why the hell are they even optional!?

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: Kimber7man] #12676339 02/26/18
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Originally Posted by Kimber7man
Steve, that stock looks nice! Mind if I ask, why the flush cups?


Just to make for more comfy carry.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14351421 12/08/19
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I revisited this post after posting the link for a Manners' wait time question.

The curse with this rifle continues. I left it in the safe and shot other rifles. I finally decided to scope it up and zero it. Got everything ready and tried to chamber a 250AI round (I've had several in the chambering, including a NULA - and had some loaded fireformed ammo). Round would not chamber. Bolt would not close. So I dug for some 250 Savage rounds and tried to chamber one of those. No go.

I had some 6mm CM brass, and thought maybe he chambered it in 25 Creedmoor. Bolt won't close on a 6mm CM round.

So I have no idea what I have. Barrel is marked 250 AI. Obviously it's not chambered in 250 AI, or it's short-chambered. I will now have to send it off to have a 250 AI reamer run through, assuming the current chamber is cut straight.


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Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14351643 12/08/19
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Oh man that sucks bad.


A guy can go to hell just as fast for lying as he can for stealing.



Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14351753 12/08/19
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LazyV Offline
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What a horror story. Hope this somehow turns around for you.


"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- Michael Scott
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14352658 12/08/19
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jdunham Online Content
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Unbelievable.


NRA Life Member

~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14352678 12/08/19
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efw Offline
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Dang man really sorry to hear that Steve!


Don't you ever wonder why
In spite of all that's wrong here
There's still so much that goes so right
And beauty abounds?

The thunder rolls and the baby sighs
And the rain comes down
Don't you wanta thank someone for this?
-Andrew Peterson
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14355602 12/09/19
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jmp300wsm Online Content
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If people would quit giving him the business then he might start to pay attention to the details.


"If you find yourself in a hole, quit digging"
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14356993 12/09/19
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S
shootAI Offline
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Steve you should of kept that ULA. It’s been a great rifle. Glad you sold it and sorry to hear of your troubles with the new one.

Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: shootAI] #14357418 12/10/19
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257heaven Offline OP
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Originally Posted by shootAI
Steve you should of kept that ULA. It’s been a great rifle. Glad you sold it and sorry to hear of your troubles with the new one.


It is a good one! I'll get this one done some day. I think Barrett needs to open up a custom shot and take custom chamber orders for the Fieldcraft. I'd be in line from the get-go!


Sent from my Dingleberry Handheld Wireless
Re: More fun with Manners - It's a long journey [Re: 257heaven] #14357872 12/10/19
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ol_mike Offline
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Originally Posted by 257heaven
I revisited this post after posting the link for a Manners' wait time question.

The curse with this rifle continues. I left it in the safe and shot other rifles. I finally decided to scope it up and zero it. Got everything ready and tried to chamber a 250AI round (I've had several in the chambering, including a NULA - and had some loaded fireformed ammo). Round would not chamber. Bolt would not close. So I dug for some 250 Savage rounds and tried to chamber one of those. No go.

I had some 6mm CM brass, and thought maybe he chambered it in 25 Creedmoor. Bolt won't close on a 6mm CM round.

So I have no idea what I have. Barrel is marked 250 AI. Obviously it's not chambered in 250 AI, or it's short-chambered. I will now have to send it off to have a 250 AI reamer run through, assuming the current chamber is cut straight.


This thread reminds of when i built houses for a living on the mississippi coast - problem after problem after problem because of incompetent people .
Hope whoever you choose to redo the rifle is awake .
Best ...


dang
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