Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors 99 in 30 wcf

You know, by golly, if I ever were to cook up a .30 wildcat I would call it the .30 Lightfoot. It has a certain je ne sais quoi ring to it! It would look good on a 99 barrel underneath a Lightfoot mount too. Maybe neck up a .25-35 case to .30 caliber, a light .30-30 if you will.

I have to question Winchester caring about Savage doing that, I would think it more likely Savage immediately found a problem with that designation confusing dealers and buyers as to what ammunition the guns actually took since there probably wasn't anyone making boxes of 30 WCF that were also marked 30 SAV or 30 SAVAGE - anyone asking for that probably was handed a box of .303 Savage and told 'it must take this, I don't see any 30 SAV'.

Marlin called the 30 WCF the 30-30 Marlin as least as late as 1915 and they also are probably the ones who came up with the 30-30 designation - Winchester did not use or have any special rights to the name 30-30, I don't think Winchester stamped 30-30 on any guns until sometime after WWII, before that all were stamped 30 WCF, the official name. Remington originally called what became the 30 Remington the 30-30 Remington, but that also cause a lot of confusion so it eventually got changed, but not because any involvement by Winchester. The only cartridge I know of that was officially named 30-30 when introduce was the 30-30 Wesson from about 1881, and it was a true -30 using 30 grains of blackpowder. The 30 WCF was introduced as a smokeless powder cartridge so I don't think the '-30' ever really applied because I don't believe it was ever factory loaded with blackpowder.

Like Mike mentions it seems other gun makers did not want to put anything referring to Winchester on their guns, even if it were just initials (or maybe that's what Winchester told them they couldn't use???). When Remington started to chamber guns in 22WRF rimfire they called it the 22 Remington Special and never changed that as long as they made guns in it. Stevens stamped their guns in 22 WRF as 22-7 or 22-7½ for many years, they did refer to it as 22 WRF in some catalogs, usually in parenthesis.

The first reference to the second chambering I can find is on the 1901 powder can and it is listed as the ".30-30".

From the serial number range of the "SAV .30" (it is stamped SAV .30 not .30 SAV) stamped rifle production started in the last half of 1900.

There is no 1901 catalog that I know of. I can't tell when the first Savage loaded .30-30 ammo started.

Looking through advertising from 1900 and 1901 the ads just state ".303 and .30-30 calibers". It is interesting to note that the .303 Savage chambering is simply stated as ".303".

Well...everyone knows Rugers won't shoot worth a darn, so we have to keep everybody chasing their tails and hope they don't notice that they won't shoot. So, for everyone's viewing pleasure, I found this which I believe that Savage might have been a little confused when Mr. Bill was still a gleam in his daddy's eyes...lol.


Sav 30 link

I'm sure some of you gentlemen have already seen this, but I found it interesting.

Guys-after going back and re-reading the forum I have linked to in my post above, I guess I am more confused than ever. If one end of a box of 303 Savage (photo in the link) is marked 30 cal Savage, and yet it is not the experience of you gentlemen who own a 30 SAV that the 303 will chamber in it. That's strange or am I way off the mark on this. And by the way...I don't have a 99...yet. But if it counts, I do own a Savage 110 in the venerable 30/06. But I don't think that is what it will be when it grows up.

Your link is to a discussion of ammunition as it relates to the 1895 release of the Savage lever gun.

1899s stamped with 30 SAV is a whole different context in my view. The members of this forum resolved this issue years ago and remain quite sure the 30 SAV stamped guns are indeed .30-30s.

Trust us...

Sorry about that

Lot of incorrect information in that thread, tho understandable. First, the 303 Savage was THE FIRST cartridge for Savage, Savage introduced with their very first rifles. Savage was entertaining ideas of selling Savage 1895's in 30-40 Krag (30 US) also at the time, but they never sold any that we know of. Savage did interchangeably call it a 30 caliber rifle and 303 caliber rifle constantly in the early information, which is probably due to the rifle being a .308" bore rifle and the ammunition being .311".

What UMC had in their 1895 catalog doesn't correlate to the SAV 30 stamped rifles which were 5 years later. In 1895 UMC was producing 303 Savage ammunition under contract for Savage, for the Savage 1895's which were only chambered in 303 Savage. That ended in 1897 and Savage started producing their own ammunition.

Here's a UMC / Savage box from 1895-1897. Clearly marked .303 SAVAGE. There was no "30" listed on them at this time.




Both UMC and SRACO and 303 (Savage Repeating Arms Company) on the headstamp:

Thanks for the link...very interesting. That sight is were I first saw the earliest Savage boxed Ideal loading tool many years back. Great guys on there.

Rick,What is your earliest rifle s/n with sav 30? just wondering how tight the range is. Don

It's all been interesting to me. Wish I could afford the rifle. Thanks for all the information Gentlemen.

Don,

1338x
1500x
10 in the 16xxx range
2 in the 17xxx range
6 in the 18xxx range
5 in the 19xxx range.

Rick ,Thanks ,thats what i was looking for. Don