Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters .22 RF alternatives

Moving forward with hopes of popping some caps tomorrow sometime.

The bullets are knurled with extreme precision and use of a pine flat and rolled with the edge of a medium flat file. The bullets are 30:1 alloy, .465" long and .2225-.223" diameter. Average weight is 40.1 grains for a sample of 30, extreme weight spread is .2 grains.



Next up is my magic lube, not yet patented. The components are common, but the ratio will remain highly classified, mostly because I have no idea what they are. Started out as a small puddle of melted SPG Lube in the plastic cup and I added graphite until my vision said That Looks About Right (TLAR). Not only does it retain the original texture, it now leaves one's fingers black as coal. It will be applied with diligence after the bullet is seated.



Conventional wisdom says to reduce loads 15% below max for starting. I dunno what max is, so...weighing three different brands of SV LR ammo powder charges I come up with 1.0 grains for Fed Automatch, Wolf MT and CCI SV. Will load one each of .7 and .8 grains (Bullseye/700X/Red Dot) and see what happens over the chrony. TLAR

A little dab of liquid alox might work too. I’ve used it lube some .22’s that tended to lead bores. Worked like a champ.

Alox is an option of course but who wants to do the simple? The SPG lube theory is fairly simple. Didn't want to wait for it to dry. A match head size dab was sufficient to lube 6 rounds with change left over. Put on a small patch and rolled the bullet, worked quite well.

Well, tomorrow will be the big day as they say.

Surprised at the load density, maybe 80% or so. Lower left is .8 grains of Red Dot, the other is .7 gr. The cases with Bullseye ran about 50% for the same charge. The ring you see inside the case is a very minor lip about as deep as the bullet heel.



Seated with finger pressure (firm), my version on the left and Wolf MT on the right.



My new babies prior to lubing.........

You need to turn them over and show a picture of the improved end.

Good as I got at the moment, most of them are kinda bashful.

Great thread. I am thoughly enjoying it.

Well, fears, consternation and befuddlement are behind me. Before the report on today's experience I want to relate some background on the learning curve.

Firstly, choreographing dimensions has be a challenge. Case in point would be the first round of brass cases which were not going to work regardless. There is a heeled bullet involved and this requires harmony on several levels. Another point goes to the very small rim as relates to a shell holder and the functions normally associated with the loading process. End of the day, it needs to chamber in the firearm, fire and extract normally. Bullets were knurled, seated by finger pressure and then lubed. Primer pockets were uniformed with an old Lyman tool intended for that purpose, removing a very small quantity of "dust". Though the shell holder pictured previously will work for removing spent primers, the tolerance for a full size bore hole to accommodate a primer ram left questionable margins, thus was not so engineered. Exercising my barbarian mindset I placed a primer on a robust piece of brass, inserted a brass ram in the case and pulled out the hammer. Tap, tap, tap, job done, and thinking cap still in place. It was easy, but not my preferred approach.

Next on the table is powder choice. In this case I took a shotgun approach with 3 styles of powder and made my best guess on a starting point. Bullseye, 700X and Red Dot, one shot each at .7 and .8 grains for initial evaluation. Did I say that being a test pilot is never boring?

Steve Brooks made the mould with his usual attention to specs and quality, form based on a Wolf MT bullet I forwarded for consideration. You have seen the photo above and it's fair to say he did that as well and anyone could, likely better is my guess. They are cast with 30:1 alloy at 775*F and quite literally rained from the mould without encouragement. I declined to request a grease groove, mostly because production RF ammo does not have one, and relies on a variety of strategies to include copper wash, graphite/wax, grease etc. I went the knurl and grease route with an open mind.

In the following image there are 5 groups, all shot at 20 yards. Precision was not expected with the CF rounds, this was an exercise of initial evaluation of function. Starting at the top left is a series of 5 Wolf MT used to verify zero and foul the barrel. The single outlier was the first shot thru a clean barrel. Average velocity was 1056 fps with an ES of 22. Subsequent shots were grouped by powder style and fired in order of increasing charge.

Bullseye
.7 grains - 791 fps
.8 grains - 836 fps

700X
.7 grains - 877 fps
.8 grains - 924 fps

Red Dot
.7 grains - 808 fps
.8 grains - 976 fps



After shooting the loads I saw no evidence of leading in any regard, but with intent to verify that fired 5 more rounds of Wolf MT at the center bull. Avg 1061, ES of 15 and one ragged hole made me smile. A patch thru the barrel after the session revealed powder residue but not a single spec of lead. Yes, I'm smiling.

Extraction was normal and after the fact examination tells me the cases can be reloaded without the use of size/crimp dies, though I'm uncertain of how many cycles will allow that.

Next up will come a series of 5 shot groups over the chrony with an eye on evaluating precision and a bit more velocity. My imagination tells me that something around .9-1.0 grains of powder will put this in the velocity realm of workaday match or subsonic production ammo. Likely .9 grains for the 700X and Red Dot, maybe 1.0 on the Bullseye.

On point of the powder, when I broke down the factory cases I found all with a very fine grained powder that resembled Bullseye in granulation, but with a different appearance, mostly a light green color for the Euro ammo and grey to black for US production. They were all very uniform at 1.0 grains of charge except the CCI Quiet which was .6 grains. I am reasonably certain I am using powders that are a bit slower in burn rate, but where the factory stuff was ballpark 50-60% load density, I found the Bullseye at about the same and the other powders at .8 grains to be about 80% load density. I don't know this will play on potential for precision or not, but found it somewhat interesting.

This is so simple a caveman can do it, though if you have 5 thumbs you might wind up mildly frustrated.

That is all, will be back after the next round.

DD

Thanks for the update. It's nice to see the progress this has made from a simple idea spinning in your noggin to actual handloads being tested...

So I'm kind of curious, what did they sound like, does the primer add a snap to the bang?

Jimy, I fired the first round from a naked barrel, the .7 grain Bullseye load and will characterize the report as somewhat milder than any of the standard velocity rounds. I don't think the primer influenced the report at all. The rest were fired thru a suppressor and the loudest sound was the "tink" on the backstop. Reason I tried the first one w/o the can was mostly the fact the bullet had not been previously fired and I thought it necessary to insure it did not tumble and wreck the baffles.

In prep for the next round I took a moment to check for any engraving on the bullet, with both a Wolf and CF round. I had not had occasion to shoot any of the Wolf ammo previously and found it has a .105" engraving trace, as do the bullets I've cast and shot with the new brass. Consistency is a marvelous thing! I may have a clue at this point what a tedious job it was crafting the brass but at this point I am favorably impressed....big time!

Expecting to run the next series Saturday morning with a focus on precision. Probably 5 groups of 3 as a minimum. Following that I'll move up to groups of 5 on the 50 yard line.

Never give up, never surrender!

Looks nice.

I'm in the market for a barrel !

On topic of barrels, I took a moment to check chamber on the 10/22 and the cases seat like they are greased. The T/C barrel was kluged up by Bullberry and has a match chamber, 1:15" twist, by Douglas. When a round is chambered the drive band is engraved by the rifling for .105", this with the CF ammo or Wolf MT. Difference at this point is I can remove the Wolf ammo intact due to the crimp....until I get the dies put together and can put a bit of crimp on the CF stuff that won't happen. Leaves the bullet in the barrel for sure. Not totally unexpected that.

Dies will probably be ready for pick up in a couple weeks.

Meanwhile, the next round of plinking is scheduled for Sunday if all else goes as planned.

And by the way, my calculations put case volume at .2cc on the .22 GTC and .27cc for the Wolf. In English that's .012 and .017 cubic inches respectively.

Any thoughts to making some lighter bullets, maybe turning some copper bullets of say 30-35 gr, maybe a +P load !

If that happens it will be down the road a ways. Short term I'm focused on getting this worked out as a functional alternative and I'm thinking it is off to a good start. One step at a time....

I'm thinking a pickett mold would be kind of sweet and easy.

Well, I went and did it. 6 loads, 3 shots each plus a scattering of factory RF ammo for giggles.

Ramped it up to .8 and .9 grains of the previously used powders and I am quite pleased. Except for my "buddy" who dropped by and shot the best group of the day with the .22 GTC. Same guy that looks at my first group and says "They're all on the paper." Geesh....

Will offer the data prior to the target post for your general information. I fired 8 groups on the paper. Two black crosses upper left (first) and right (last) were used for the strings of Wolf ammo.

20 Yards, double bag rest, chronograph 10' from muzzle. Wind light and variable, temp mid 60s

Wolf #1: Avg. 1062 fps, ES 62 (fouler string) .164" 5 shots
Wolf #2: Avg 1056 fps, ES 14, Sd 6 .318" 5 shots

.22 GTC, 3 shots same parameters as above. First 4 groups were fired with new brass, last 2 with once fired brass. WW SPP for all rounds, SPG/graphite lube, 30:1 alloy. First group with this ammo was fired at the 12 o'clock high target. Rest were fired in order, clockwise.

.8 grains Bullseye: Avg 903 fps, Sd 12, .445"
.9 grains.............: Avg 957 fps, Sd 24 .308"

.8 grains 700X:....... Avg 980 fps, Sd 11 .435"
.9 grains.................Avg 1018 fps, Sd 25 .730"

.8 grains Red Dot: Avg 944 fps, Sd 2, .422"
.9 grains.................Avg1002 fps, Sd 10, .400"

There was no leading encountered.




Picture of the fired brass and one w/o the primer. Note that a RF primed cartridge cannot be fired with a CF firing pin strike.



I need to cast some more bullets, mow the grass, drink some whiskey and promote general disorder, but will be back with more in about a week, maybe less.


DD
Charter Member*
Albino Aardvarks

*Founded 1966

A note on case prep for your perusal. It is straight forward but requires some ingenuity. Picture below illustrates the high tech tool used to clean the case interior and it seems fair effective. Primer pockets are cleaned as one would do for any CF round. Decapping is likewise done as usual, though one needs some diligence regarding decapping pin adjustment. The widget that holds the decap pin on the shaft will flare case mouths if pressed too deeply. I had enough foresight to examine the geometry before launching into that, glad I did.

Looking to make a priming device, not unlike the tools of old. meaning something not unlike the Lyman hand tool. Point is with these cases the rim is wee small and unlikely to survive conventional priming techniques. Per earlier dialog, I have placed a piece of brass flat stock on the vice anvil, set a primer in place, case positioned and used a brass rod to tap the case with a light hammer to finish it off. Easy, effective and tap, tap, tap.

Lot of learning curve on this project, simple ingenuity is key. I am at cycle 3 for loading with some of the brass and it still do not need to size the cases. Good thing that, I'm still working the die issue. When that is sorted out I will move forward to verification that the ammo will cycle thru a 10/22 w/o issue.



Other issues arise, such as a need for a case specific load block. A case charging funnel that is a bit more petite would be welcome, keeping my eyes open on that. Forget about throwing charges. The data provided earlier is clear that .1 grain of any of the powders used has significant impact on velocity. I use a powder trickler and note that it only takes a couple or three flakes of 700X or Red Dot to move the balance beam on my scale. The trickling process is quick enough, truly. The 18 rounds fired in the last cycle required about 30 minutes to load, including priming, charge, bullet seat and lube. With a couple of minor hiccups it only took 15 minutes to decap and clean the brass and that included invention of the steel wool/dowel cleaning tool.

It looks like the primers are getting hit hard enough, and dead center, hows the neck size holding up?

I should have some time this week to get a few more pieces done.