I sold my SKS many years ago and always wanted another 7.62x39 for budget-friendly fun shooting.
So I ordered one of the uppers from PSA. Seemed like a pretty fair deal for $279 shipped, with charging handle, bolt carrier group, and the enhanced firing pin. Still, it was with a little trepidation that I ordered this upper, since I had done a fair amount of online research and not all the results are glowing.
I put the upper on a lower I pulled off another rifle. Trigger group is all milspec. I opted the rifle buffer/recoil system as I figured that has to be the easiest on the bolt, and there are stories out there of broken off lugs.
I didn't do any serious accuracy work today, as the weather is kind of blustery. Mainly I just wanted to do a function check on the rifle/magazines/ammo.
Magazines are AR-Stoner from Midway. I have a couple 30-rounders on backorder, and the 10-rounders that were in stock. These are marked ASC on the follower.
Ammo is Tula 124gr FMJ from PSA.
First test was one round in the magazine to check bolt lockback on the last round. That worked fine.
Second test was a full 10 round magazine for feeding and other function. I only put 9 rounds in the magazine as it got really stiff on the last round. But everything functioned 100%.
I put a box at 50 yards for a target, and shot sitting on my butt, leaning back against the truck tire, elbows on knees. Not real stable in the 10-25 mph wind, but I did my best and put a rough 50/200 yard zero on the scope. After zeroing I busted some cantaloupe sized rocks out around 200 yards..
Later I'll get it out with a bipod and do some tangible accuracy testing at 100 yards with 124gr FMJ, and the 154gr soft point.
Here's a pic of my rig, target, ammo.
I gotta say, I did have fun. The 100% functioning, and the thump of the 7.62x39 put a grin on my face.
If you are shooting 7.62x39, in AR, AK, SKS, boltgun, or....?, feel free to share here.
Fugg it ... ain't been on AR forum in awhile. Have put 60 rds of tula 122 gr hp thru it. Ran like a sewing machine and was on with confidence out to 40- 50 yds offhand.
No more bimetal jacketed stuff for it. Gotta chromoly green mountain barrel Bought 250 rds of hornady 123 gr sst for it. Gotta get it zeroed to those and buy 1 box of 50 a month with my starting cushion of 150 in reserve. Squirrel up 500- 750 rds for it . Shoot about 200 ish thru it per year. Keep it clean and lubed. No need to run a reliable machine into the ground just cause ya can. JMO....
With one of 3 new Croatian BHO mags. Copy of yugo BHO mags But that country don't exist anymore.
nice AK! back on thread, I put a 7.62x39 together about a year ago and it is my beside the bed weapon. shoots just like yours Montana Marine. i have ASC mags for it but regular ar mags work if you only load 10 or less. what is it about the 7.62x39 that makes us smile? just does even though it drags up old memories. mine shoots .308 just as well as .310's or maybe even better. 150's are the heaviest i have loaded mainly due to length. it shoots 150's into 2 inches benched. all in all one of my favorite rifles even though my SKS will out shoot it.
the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee ~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
MM.. I put together a Daytona Tactical 762x39 a while back. I use ASC 10’s and it has gobbled up every single round I’ve fed it. I don’t hammer on my AR’s very hard but this one is the exception. It’s had 800 rounds thru it in a day without anything but a few drops here and there on the bolt. The only modification I did, which was expected was to change out the trigger springs to work with the harder imported primers. It has not missed a beat and yes for some reason it do induce the grins
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
I too have a lotta love for the 7.62x39 cartridge.
The Cadillac. Arsenal SLR107 folder. Upgraded trigger to ALG AKT. Primary Arms 1-6x24 w/7.62x39 ACSS scope.
The Beast. Custom built for me by Chris Horn in AZ about 13-14 yrs ago, who now gunsmiths for Gary Reeder. Can bounce beer cans across the ground at 75 yds with iron sights. You wouldn't complain if you got handed this rifle to fend off any zombies in your zipcode.
Also have a WASR-10 that is proving impossible to dig the photo out of photobucket.
Slaves get what they need. Free men get what they want.
Was at Hellers a few weeks ago and he is running a 7.62x39 as well. We have put several hundred rounds through it and I hate to say it but im really impressed by the old Russian round. I actually find it more pleasant to shoot with more thump,and less muzzle blast. Have fun!
I held onto my old Arsenal SA93. Some time back, I added KVar furniture, an Ultimak rail, DocterOptic dot sight and a Surefire white light. My son keeps it out at his property for a 'bump in the night' weapon. It's accurate, dead nuts reliable.
I am also shooting a Ruger American Ranch Rifle in 7.62x39. I like it a lot.
Thank you thank you. I think the quality is excellent for the money. I just ordered a new 556 from them. https://www.cbcindustries.com/colle...r-15-buttstock-kit-ar-15-lower-parts-kit My dpms tpr with 20” is little too much weight to be a fun plinking gun. They have 300 BO for same price, but I’m sure they’d work with you if you wanted 76239
All of them do something better than the 30-06, but none of them do everything as well.
here is my CBC AR 762x39 whole kit for $350? minus the stripped lower. they are having sale right now for 319 for everything but the lower.
Very nice Dre. I shot against a guy today, in an AR shoot, and he was sporting a real nice 7.62x39 AR15. Very cool rifle. His is quite accurate as well. No hiccups during today's shoot either. You'll have to let us know how well it shoots for you. My buddy says his "shoots better than he does". I believe he bought his as a package deal from model 1 sales. I guess he bought his upper for around $300.00 "on sale". Not bad for a great shooting rifle upper...
Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.
Thanks bud! CBC has 10% off today. Code “Dad10” and free shipping. She shoots good for the only one time I had her out to sight the scope in. No jambs or anything using cheap ammo. Like I said before the quality is great for the money
Last edited by Dre; 06/17/18.
All of them do something better than the 30-06, but none of them do everything as well.
Did some 100 yard accuracy testing today. Tried two ammo types. Tula 124gr FMJ, and Tula 154gr SP. Both were about the same 3-4 inches at 100 yards.
Conditions were: temp 70F, winds 5-20 mph from 6 o'clock. Winds were wobbling my shooting bench a bit, those groups might be an inch or so smaller off a concrete bench or from the ground. The grass was too much for me to get on the ground though, I wouldn't have seen my target.
At this point I'm enjoying this rifle. I took it out to 600 yards on some rocks. The difference is that normally with the 308 I'd be shooting at grapefruit-size rocks at 600. With this 7.62x39 I'm shooting at rocks the size of a mini-fridge at 600...….grin
The rifle functioned 100% through about 50 rounds of 124gr FMJ. It bobbled twice going through 40 rounds of the 154gr SP. The soft lead tip looked a bit flattened as if it had slammed into the feed ramp. Going forward I'll skip the soft-point ammo.
A few pics,
I'm weighing up a permanent sight for this rig and find myself deciding on going with iron sight, maybe a fixed Troy or DD, or maybe a 3X prism optic.
I've been using a PSA model "KS-47" which is basically an AR that accepts AK magazines. The rifle shoots well, and has worked flawlessly. There are some limits about what mags it will take, but metal Combloc mags are fine, as are Magpuls. It was a lot less expensive than similar rifles such as the CMMG, or milled AK's.
Gents..I know there’s a few of us here that have these and really seem to enjoy them for what they are so I’ll keep this going.. My Daytona Tactical That has so far been flawless just quit on me.. My brother was shooting it and had about 2 or 3 rounds that suddenly weren’t feeding properly.. he cleared them and pressed on. Then at the last shot the bolt got stuck tight and would not open. We were up in the hills so didn’t have many tools available and could not get it to clear. As it was an empty case in the chamber I put it away to be looked into closer at home. As it was being packed up he noticed a broken bolt lug laying on the bench..I’ve read about that being somewhat common so assumed that was the issue and kept the piece and put the gun away.
I’ll try to explain this the best I can so bear with me.. Upon closer inspection looking at the bolt it seems the bolt did not “cam/rotate” as 3 of the bottom lugs had come straight back and embedded themselves into the feed ramp. It’s an m4 ramp and one lug had dug in either side of the ramp and one lug directly in the center.. Everything is kept pretty wet on that gun and never an issue before. I’m not going to beat on the thing or even disassemble it as I’ve got an email in and would like to see what they say. Without having it apart it’s hard to tell what the culprit may be but just thought I’d share Anybody want to hazard a guess? Broken Extractor maybe? Would a broken lug by itself cause the bolt to come back in such a manner? I don’t know as I don’t break too many parts. I will definetly follow up here when I know more
Approx 1800-2000 rounds on the rifle
Last edited by Certifiable; 07/02/18.
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
I might still do just that Flave.. just didn’t want to get any grief from them about doing so. But at this rate it’s looking like I shoulda stayed with Flave precision..
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
Considering the 3-4 moa accuracy of the rusky ammo, I decided to save some weight. Pulled the optic and put a Troy fixed rear sight on this carbine. Midway has the sight marked down to $42, so I went with it.
Crunched some numbers on JBM and it looks like a 39 yard zero will keep trajectory and line-of-sight within 2 inches of each other out to 200 yards, and about 15" drop at 300. So I'll roll with that.
After sending a second email asking wtf Daytona responded saying if I had a problem to send it in for inspection or repair.. I’ll box it up and ship it off this week and will follow up. Can’t say I’m overly warm/fuzzy but will see how it goes
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
Broseph I’m trying not to.. but when they only respond after a second prodding 10 days later I be gettin leery... I was gonna put in a call to Local Dirt to go shake them boys up but they came around just in time
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
Broseph I’m trying not to.. but when they only respond after a second prodding 10 days later I be gettin leery... I was gonna put in a call to Local Dirt to go shake them boys up but they came around just in time
I'm thinkin' anybody slappin' uppers and 80% kits together at those prices probably has a different definition of "quick turn around" than you and I do.
Originally Posted by Geno67
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual.
Originally Posted by Judman
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
Originally Posted by KSMITH
My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
Took the 7.62x39 out today to get the Troy rear sight dialed in.
After crunching some numbers on JBM it looked like a 39-yard zero would keep the trajectory within 2 inches of LOS out to 200 yards. Here's the trajectory table:
I was surprised at 39 yards it was shooting under 1" three shot groups.
When I went to 100 yards, it opened up to about 4", for 9 of 10, with one high flier out of the group. I guess that is what low quality (poorly balanced?) bullets do. My 100 yard group was about right for predicted traj of +1.9". But I did refine windage left a couple clicks. My 100 yard group with the irons was about the same size I shot using the optics earlier on.
100 yard target, 10 rounds,
I was shooting off a table with a bipod up front, and a beanbag aft.
At 165 yards I was smacking a basketball size rock no problem, traj was right on. For S&G, I tried hitting some stuff out around 400-600 yards. I used the big aperture and held the post above center. Not bad results at 300-400, but at 600 It was at best 'suppressing fire'.
Shane, I think your results will improve when you've dumped all that TulAmmo, and move up to at least Wolf. This guy works a lot with the 7.62x39. As you would expect, Lapua shines above all other. If you can get past this guy's accent, he does offer up good information.
Slaves get what they need. Free men get what they want.
Nephew loads 125 ballistic tips and I've killed yotes past 500 with his stuff in a model one sales upper... I don't care for BT normally but at this speed the open up just right on game out to about 200 or so yards, no blow ups.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Shane, I think your results will improve when you've dumped all that TulAmmo, and move up to at least Wolf. This guy works a lot with the 7.62x39. As you would expect, Lapua shines above all other. If you can get past this guy's accent, he does offer up good information.
I've watched many of his videos. He always tells it like it is.
Depends on what you want it for really. I can see the cheap ammo part... but cheap accuracy just bothers the hell out of me for some reason. I don't know if I've shot 500 rounds of ball 5.56 in my whole life.
My poly tech AK sucks so bad with ball ammo it sits in the safe since the 90s. Though I really should try some reloads to see if it is any better... but no time..
If I wanted to simply blast, hands down I'd buy SKS till I found an accurate one with ball and buy about 10 cases of ammo that shot ok in the SKS. I've seen them shoot much better than AKs.
So in many ways, an non accurate AR doesn't interest me.
Will be cool to see how accurate you get by swapping ammo.
I know there is a wolf 22rimfire that would scare the heck out of Federal 900 in our match AR 22lr upper.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
That dude needs to learn trigger control and a few other things. couldn't get past the fact he is saying accuracy testing and is slapping the trigger and resting the gun on its mag... ugh
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Neither of those videos had anything to do with accuracy. They were about velocity and the deviation thereof. With that, and that Labradar, i thought he laid that out pretty well.
He has other videos on accuracy.
Originally Posted by MontanaMarine
I'll give Wolf a try.
My mindset going in to the 7.62x39 was that I didn't want to handload for it. Rather, take advantage of low cost ammo.
Who knows, I might end up handloading a bit too.
Shane, if you decide to load up some of your own, Starline has been offering 7.62x39 for a few months now.
Slaves get what they need. Free men get what they want.
nephews 125s in the model one sales upper would shoot around an inch or just under for a few 3 shot groups that I ran over paper a few times. Yeah it proves nothing but it beats 4 moa. 4 moa makes me shudder. LOL. 4 moa added to my wobble.. teaches me nothing and makes me wonder where the next round will wander. LOL
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Well I got a brand new upper in the mail today. They shipped it only a couple days after they received mine so it was a pretty fast turnaround. All in all I’m satisfied.. on one hand they definetly made it right. Tho I feel they absolutely should have considering the round count being under 2K. On the other hand it would be nice if they answered emails without having to be reminded to answer their emails
I specifically asked them to let me know what happened to the upper, purely out of curiosity. I know some of you wanted to know as well. But no correspondence at all. Just an email saying I had a package coming. Anyway that’s all there is..I’ll get back to hammering on this one now I guess
She never made it past the bedroom door, what was she aiming for...? She's gone shootin..
Tried some Hornady steel case 123gr SST at 100 yards today. Intended to get a 10-shot group, but the weather rolled in on me (50's raining, breezy, odd August day).
Anyhoo, I put some glass on the carbine to give the benefit over my eyes and irons. Leupold 2.5-8x36.
Groups shrank for the Tula to under 3" for 5 shots, and 3.5" for 10 shots (9 into under 3").
The Hornady I only managed a 5-shot group at 2.3", with three of those touching. Weather turned on me for serious testing.
7.62x39 definitely benefits from the cheap surplus ammo, but did you consider 300BO at all when starting this project, Shane? I've always been a fan of it in AK's and a few SKS's years ago, but been playing with the AAC in a 700 bolt gun and it's a cool little round too. Been thinking I need one in an AR platform. Was considering the 7.62x39 too, so wondering what pushed you that way.
The Hornady 123gr SST does show some promise with 3 of 5 shots touching at 100 yards from a non-floated barrel, off a less than steady table in a bit of wind. I'd get down on the ground to get steadier, but I'd have to cut too much grass to see my target.
The Hornady 123gr SST does show some promise with 3 of 5 shots touching at 100 yards from a non-floated barrel, off a less than steady table in a bit of wind. I'd get down on the ground to get steadier, but I'd have to cut too much grass to see my target.
That's impressive.
Slaves get what they need. Free men get what they want.
Thanks for posting that. Interesting to see the Tula is faster (and by that much!) than the Hornady; my impression of Tula in other calibers the few times I've tried it has been that it was somewhat underpowered.
Just as an interesting comparison (not a "mine is better than yours" thing at all), that Hornady 123gr load is running almost exactly the same speed as the 123gr ELD-M handload in my 12.5" 6.5 Grendel. That's with re-formed 7.62x39 brass too, lots of similarities in those loads except for the barrel length.
I was surprised about the Tula velocity as well. From my internet readings I was expecting 2300-ish fps. Shootng the two ammos side-by-side, the Tula does feel like it has a little more gas though.
I'll bet the 123 in the Grendel has a heck of lot higher BC than the 7.62x39 also. I believe the 7.62 123gr SST has a BC around .290 or so.
I'm enjoying the 7.62x39 journey so far, and if there was a left-hand bolt action rifle, I'd probably have one. Who knows, might try a Ruger American 7.62x39 boltgun down the road, even if it is RH.
Yeah that high BC makes all the difference at longer range, it's a fun setup to plink with out around 600+ yards. The Grendel is a relatively slow cartridge IMO so that high BC is it's saving grace. Within "red dot sight distance" though it doesn't have any real advantage over the old AK round IMO. It's basically an improved and necked down x39 case so it does use a little more powder, and that short 12.5" barrel on mine is LOUD. Definitely some advantages to both cartridges still I think; I just found it interesting to note the similarities.
As a side note, I've heard but haven't confirmed (since I don't pay much attention to AK stuff any more) that some of the Russian/com-bloc people have taken up the Grendel as well and are chambering it in AK rifles. Kind of makes sense as a continuation on the old design I guess.
I've considered that American Ranch rifle in 7.62x39 as well; seems like a handy little setup.
Honestly I'm not sure you really could. The AR action isn't the weak link with one of these, it's the case itself.
Oh yeah? What have you found about it? Stretch a lot? Weak primer pockets? ?????
In my experience, it'll tend to loosen primer pockets before exceeding pressure capability of the AR platform, and with a properly gassed rifle (so it doesn't unlock early) you can run right up to the limits of the brass. Of course you can break a bolt too, but with modern bolts that's more an issue of an out of square barrel extension in the upper. To be fair, my experience with this is in the Grendel cartridge, but I'm using the same 7.62x39 brass just fireformed to the Grendel case. I don't know if stretching would be any more of an issue in the 7.62.
Did some velocity comparison today between the Tula 122gr FMJ vs Tula 124gr FMJ.
16" barrel. Chrony F1. 10 yards.
122 grain:
2376 2347 2372 2369 2402 avg: 2373 …………………….
124 grain:
2393 2421 2433 2422 2397 avg: 2413
Fired same gun, same day (today). Temp about 50F.
Interesting that the 124gr is 40 fps faster on average.
I was doing some internet searching to try to learn the differences between the 122gr fmj, and 124gr fmj.
One shooter wrote that he had pulled down about five rounds of each weight. The bullets were all the same weight, but the 124gr labeled had a heavier powder charge by a grain or so.
Here's a new pic of the 7.62x39 carbine. Made a couple changes. Put on a carbine stock wit an H3 buffer, UTG handguards, and a Magpul vertical grip.
I just like this thing. Put a couple hundred rounds through it today shooting close. Mostly 25-50 yards quick fire, working on some muscle memory. Did a little 100-150 yard rock busting, offhand.
Did some further shooting with the 14.7" 5.56. Went out to 650 yards using thePrimary Arms 5X with their reticle.
The PSA upper has the enhanced firing pin for soviet ammo. I've only been running Tula and some Hornady steel case ammo. I bought ASC magazines. 10-round and 20-round. This rig has never bobbled so far.
Did you run the H3 from the start? And is that a standard buffer spring?
Travis,
Initially I was using a rifle stock/buffer system. That worked well.
Then I went to a standard 3.0 oz carbine buffer in the M4 style buttstock. That worked well too, but I could feel the buffer hitting the back of the extension tube with a solid thump.
Then I ordered some tungsten weights and made the standard buffer into a 5.4 oz H3 buffer. This works great too, and the buffer isn't pounding the back of the extension tube. It feels very smooth.
Did you run the H3 from the start? And is that a standard buffer spring?
Travis,
Initially I was using a rifle stock/buffer system. That worked well.
Then I went to a standard 3.0 oz carbine buffer in the M4 style buttstock. That worked well too, but I could feel the buffer hitting the back of the extension tube with a solid thump.
Then I ordered some tungsten weights and made the standard buffer into a 5.4 oz H3 buffer. This works great too, and the buffer isn't pounding the back of the extension tube. It feels very smooth.
Gotcha. Thanks.
Originally Posted by Geno67
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual.
Originally Posted by Judman
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
Originally Posted by KSMITH
My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
A downside is that there is no last-shot-hold-bolt-open feature. Also some aftermarket triggers (like a Timney) will not clear the mag release.
The kit I bought came with a m-lock forend and a nitrided barrel. It shoots well with good ammo and should be tough enough to tolerate mil-surp
Tex,
What ammo does it like, and can you hold an inch with 5 shots?
IIRC I've only shot handloads in it. I don't recall if I entered it in the 10 shot challenge, but I have one photo where it put 10 into 1.67" and the next 10 into 1.34". That was 123 Noslers over 28gr of 1680, in Lapua brass. I reckon with some tuning it could keep 5 in an inch.
Originally Posted by MontanaMarine
I'd imagine so, probably get a 150 gr bullet to 2400 fps in a 20" barrel without any trouble.
I also have a Ruger #1 in 7.62x39, with a 22" barrel - 2550 with 123's was easy, and I was not pushing it hard, running 1680. It has a pretty long throat, so I do want to try 150's in it. The 123's I've tried, the Hornady SST and the prototype Nosler BT, seem to be pretty frangible
Something I've realized lately is that my eyes are not what they once were. I'm 57, wear bifocals.
Through the reading lens I can get a clear front sight, but cannot see anything downrange. Through the upper lens, I can only get a blurry front sight, but I can see downrange.
I like the basic simplicity of the irons, but reality is I can shoot about 3" with optics, and 6" with irons, at 100 yards. That's with this carbine and Tula ammo
This thread has just convinced me to putter around with one of these uppers. It can be costly spending time on the computer.
Don't do it, cuzz I might be tempted. That said, I'm going 300 Blackout, just cuzz BCG/Mags are the same and I have a bunch of both.
I went back and forth trying to decide. There still might be room for a 300BO for me also.
One thing about the 300BO that caught my attention, it's possible to chamber and fire a 300BO round in a 223/5.56 chamber. There are pics of kabooms out there. That's not a deal-breaker for me, but good to be aware of, and always double check what's what.
This thread has just convinced me to putter around with one of these uppers. It can be costly spending time on the computer.
Don't do it, cuzz I might be tempted. That said, I'm going 300 Blackout, just cuzz BCG/Mags are the same and I have a bunch of both.
I went back and forth trying to decide. There still might be room for a 300BO for me also.
One thing about the 300BO that caught my attention, it's possible to chamber and fire a 300BO round in a 223/5.56 chamber. There are pics of kabooms out there. That's not a deal-breaker for me, but good to be aware of, and always double check what's what.
That's a scary thought. I have never been to worried about confusing ammo and rifle.
But I never had two rifles as easy to confuse as several AR's.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
One thing about the 300BO that caught my attention, it's possible to chamber and fire a 300BO round in a 223/5.56 chamber. There are pics of kabooms out there. That's not a deal-breaker for me, but good to be aware of, and always double check what's what.
This is true, BUT - it's not that hard to just avoid using 300 Blk ammo that will chamber in a 5.56. That didn't really exist commercially until a few years ago, and only happened to handloaders when using shorter bullets. The original intent, using bullets profiled like the 125 NBT, was that the ammo would not chamber in a 5.56 except by repeated attempts to hammer the bolt closed. If you use a bullet like the 110 V-max and seat it deep enough, the round will chamber in 5.56 because the bullet doesn't hit the chamber shoulder first.
Personally I thought it was a huge mistake when Nosler started selling their Varmageddon load that would chamber in 5.56 barrels. I don't know if they were the first to do so commercially, but they were the first I knew about.
I load my 6x45 in nickle plated brass just for this reason. Fortunately IME 6x45 doesn't seem to chamber in a 5.56.
getting old i guess, i should have thought of that. my eyes can't pick up the size of the bullet like they could 40 years ago.
the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee ~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
I've considered that American Ranch rifle in 7.62x39 as well; seems like a handy little setup.
I have one and I've been reloading for it too 30gr of CFE BLK with a 123g VMAX runs 2450 in the Ranch's 16' tube. Only shot at 50 yards so far, but a 10 shot group is about the size of a quarter.... My C39V2 AK with the same load prints only about 3 inches....
Also tried a 150gr Sierra FP (.308 for a 30-30) and it's clocking 2300 with 26gr of CFE BLK with 10 shots around 2 inches. I'll try this load hunting WT's this year.
I've considered that American Ranch rifle in 7.62x39 as well; seems like a handy little setup.
I have one and I've been reloading for it too 30gr of CFE BLK with a 123g VMAX runs 2450 in the Ranch's 16' tube. Only shot at 50 yards so far, but a 10 shot group is about the size of a quarter.... My C39V2 AK with the same load prints only about 3 inches....
Also tried a 150gr Sierra FP (.308 for a 30-30) and it's clocking 2300 with 26gr of CFE BLK with 10 shots around 2 inches. I'll try this load hunting WT's this year.
That's pretty good. I wonder how much more the Howa 22 inch barrel would give.
I've considered that American Ranch rifle in 7.62x39 as well; seems like a handy little setup.
I have one and I've been reloading for it too 30gr of CFE BLK with a 123g VMAX runs 2450 in the Ranch's 16' tube. Only shot at 50 yards so far, but a 10 shot group is about the size of a quarter.... My C39V2 AK with the same load prints only about 3 inches....
Also tried a 150gr Sierra FP (.308 for a 30-30) and it's clocking 2300 with 26gr of CFE BLK with 10 shots around 2 inches. I'll try this load hunting WT's this year.
That's pretty good. I wonder how much more the Howa 22 inch barrel would give.
Probably only 50-100fps. The Hodgdon manual lists 29.7gr of CFE BLK at 2554fps with a 24 inch barrel. I chose 30.0gr since the pressures are in the 40K CUP range and figured the Ruger could handle it fine.
Seems the CFE BLK powder gets it's job done in shorter barrel lengths just fine.
I'm toying with the idea of buying one of the PSA uppers to play with.
I have had a set of Hornady dies on the shelf for years, even though I've never used them, and the dies have two expander balls, one of which is .308......which got me to thinking.
I have a BUNCH of 150 grain winchester silver tip bullets, made for the 30-30, that I got in an estate......and they measure .309......what are the chances that these bullets would shoot halfway decent out of the 7.62x39 upper??
From load data, it looks like I might be able to get them to +/- 2100 fps......if so, any guesses as to how they would do on pigs at 100 yards or closer??.
Put a Primary Arms 3X prism sight on this thing. I didn't want to, but my eyes aren't what they used to be, and bifocals don't play well with iron sights.
So, got it zero'd in (Tula 122gr FMJ), and did some ranging with the laser, and shooting with the reticle. Pretty good out to 510 yards. Not a target rifle, but for hitting torsos, it would be effective.
I'm probably going to work up some handloads this winter and see if I can get a 125 or 150gr SST or Ballistic Tip to shoot consistently under 2 moa.
No clue what the nephew uses on his model one sales upper, but its 125 BTs and I've taken coyotes out close to 500 with it. And deer, pigs, javelina closer. I've not shot it hard on paper off bags, but I've checked zero and shot enough stuff to know that the 125 works at that speed and must be fairly accurate.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Palmetto has these uppers on sale for Cyber Monday......$229.99.....placed my order as soon as I got the e-mail.
I intend to try some of the 150 grain Win silver tip flat nose bullets I mentioned earlier in the thread and see how they shoot out of this upper. If they show decent accuracy, I'll try them on pigs.
I know that. CB Shorts rock. They don't hurt ears, have any recoil and kill chitt dead. Assuming one can hit what they need to hit of course. Cheaper than commie crap, easier to carry a wad of them too.
Made in America, killing foreign invaders for a long time.
They don't scare the herd away on the first shot. Nope. All the brothers and sisters pause and ask themselves "WTH?" And then they die as well. Most I ever did at one setting was 5. Two grown ups and three kids. Yeah, that rig is a monster.
I have a few other favorites as well, take your pick.
My personal favorites have lead bullets, YMMV.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
And all of this 7.62x39 hate is because someone shot at you once while I n a helicopter and the round didn’t hit you or deform because it was metal core?
I’m not following your argument that a 22 is more effective than a 7.62x39 against pigs.....
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General John Stark.
For future reference I never brought a chopper home with more than 176 bullet holes.
I call bullshit on this. I have worked on Helicopters for nearly 30 years. I have flown in helicopters in combat missions. I have seen Helicopters hit by small arms fire, I have also repaired them. 176 rounds to one Helicopter is going to mean at the very least one catastrophic hit statistically. I am going to assume your so called experience was in Vietnam. Which now ups the likely hood of great catastrophic hits. I have seen some pretty shot up helicopters most of them belonging to the 160th. Not one was even close to 176 rounds in it. 176 rounds into even the largest of Helicopter cabins CH53 would result in casualties and more likely deaths. Not to mention bringing the aircraft down. Not saying you haven't been shot at or in fact hit, however I have a very hard time believing 176 times.
Call it what you wish. If I gave a chitt what you think I'd pull the pics and post them. I don't. The only systems still working on the bird were the power plant, drive train (perforated) and rotors (perforated). It was scrapped as non-repairable. None of the 6 on board were wounded which was a miracle in it's own right. Probability is just that and nothing more.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
Call it what you wish. If I gave a chitt what you think I'd pull the pics and post them. I don't. The only systems still working on the bird were the power plant, drive train (perforated) and rotors (perforated). It was scrapped as non-repairable. None of the 6 on board were wounded which was a miracle in it's own right. Probability is just that and nothing more.
Thats the typical response of someone full of chit. What is the AC's data tag number. I'll look it up. Single engine Huey, 176 small arms rounds impacted on a Huey with six onboard and losing all but drivetrain and power plant, not one person hit is impossible. You lost all comm/Nav and nobody took a hit? Haha you have been watching to many movies. The aircraft was scraped because of repairable small arms fire damage. Hmmm we have these really nifty things called Cabin and Tailboom fixtures. Hueys were originally designed to be thrown away but they soon realized how cost effective and easy it is to rebuild them. I have rebuilt a few from Colombia that have seen some serious damage. They were trucked to Guaymaral were we rebuilt them. Also Worked on the Hawk that struck a landmine on the mountain the FARC cleaned the landing spot for. Google Colombia Blackhawk hit by land mine you can see the video.
Not sure how to get the pictures from the gallery to hear. But as you can see in the gallery. This trip down to Colombia was for a few 308 Beam repairs. Have also done A to L conversions.
Call it what you wish. If I gave a chitt what you think I'd pull the pics and post them. I don't. The only systems still working on the bird were the power plant, drive train (perforated) and rotors (perforated). It was scrapped as non-repairable. None of the 6 on board were wounded which was a miracle in it's own right. Probability is just that and nothing more.
Thats the typical response of someone full of chit. What is the AC's data tag number. I'll look it up. Single engine Huey, 176 small arms rounds impacted on a Huey with six onboard and losing all but drivetrain and power plant, not one person hit is impossible. You lost all comm/Nav and nobody took a hit? Haha you have been watching to many movies. The aircraft was scraped because of repairable small arms fire damage. Hmmm we have these really nifty things called Cabin and Tailboom fixtures. Hueys were originally designed to be thrown away but they soon realized how cost effective and easy it is to rebuild them. I have rebuilt a few from Colombia that have seen some serious damage. They were trucked to Guaymaral were we rebuilt them. Also Worked on the Hawk that struck a landmine on the mountain the FARC cleaned the landing spot for. Google Colombia Blackhawk hit by land mine you can see the video.
Guess I forgot the tail number. Only been 48 years, excuse me all to hell. Mebbe you forgot something in the fine print. I did not say nobody was hit, I said nobody was wounded you silly phuoc. You have any familiarity with ceramic composite armor such as was in use back then? And that's about as much discussion as I have time for at the moment.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
There was a discussion going on on MontanaMarine's other AR post concerning the 7.62x39 in an AR15 breaking the bolt's locking lugs. The thread was originally about AR pistols and not 7.62x39 in ARs, so I'll post this question here.
It was stated that 5.56 operating pressure is around 62K psi, and 7.62x39 is around 45K psi. Based on surface area calculated by rim diameter of 5.56 case, at 62k psi, the force on the bolt will be 6,974 lbs. 7.62x39, using SAAMI spec pressure of 45k psi, will have a force of 7,058 lbs. on the bolt.
My question is..... What about the 6.5 Grendel. Max pressure on it is 52K psi and it has the same .44" (.442" vs .447") rim size as the 7.62x36. Has there been issues with the Grendel shearing off locking lugs?
Having some mild weather here, so I got in some range time with the 7.62x39 this afternoon.
Traffic was heavy but we made it through,
Set up steel at 81 yards,
Shooting Tula 122gr FMJ,
Shot about 60 rounds offhand, quick reaction drills. Only missed one round. At the end I turned the target around to the clean side, sat down and leaned against the truck tire, and fired a slow 10-shot group.
I've got a Colt 6720 with an EO-Tech on it and Magpul SL hand guards. That pic makes me want to stick my DD Omega rail and a vertical grip on it, and break out the spray paint... looks good.
My quad handguard is the broke-dick UTG Pro, but I must say it is nice and solid. The 7.62x39 barrel is essentially a heavy contour aft of the FSB, so it's a pretty chunky rig. I love shooting it.
I'm probably going to work up some handloads this winter and see if I can get a 125 or 150gr SST or Ballistic Tip to shoot consistently under 2 moa.
I've had pretty good results with 1680 powder in a PSA KS-47, and also in a Ruger #1. Both would easily stay under 1½" for 5 shots. Using the Ruger I took one deer with the 123gr Hornady SST, and also some hogs with the Nosler 123gr, which were available at their Pro Shop for a while. Both are .310 bullets, and both are pretty frangible on game. I'd like to see somebody make a bonded 123gr bullet that holds together a little better. At some point I'll try the various 150gr .311 bullets in the Ruger, which has a long throat.
FWIW 1680 also works well in the .218 Bee, and subsonic in the 300 BO.
Took the 7.62 x39 to the Icebreaker to stretch it out a little. I was just shooting Tula 122gr FMJ. Shooting at a steel coyote at 465 yards, I was getting about 50% hits. Better than I expected from that ammo, and the 3X optic. Kind of motivates me to maybe work up a handload with a good bullet in the 155gr weight.
The ACSS reticle worked out well at that distance. I didn't take it further due to the accuracy limitations. Also, you could tell by the sound of the bullet hitting the steel it was just about out of gas.
Took the 7.62 x39 to the Icebreaker to stretch it out a little. I was just shooting Tula 122gr FMJ. Shooting at a steel coyote at 465 yards, I was getting about 50% hits. Better than I expected from that ammo, and the 3X optic. Kind of motivates me to maybe work up a handload with a good bullet in the 155gr weight.
The ACSS reticle worked out well at that distance. I didn't take it further due to the accuracy limitations. Also, you could tell by the sound of the bullet hitting the steel it was just about out of gas.
That's the x39 on the bipod to the left.
Is that a PA optic on your 7.62x39? How does it feed, I heard of some jams with the very early ones. It's would make a neat deer rifle.
Something I've realized lately is that my eyes are not what they once were. I'm 57, wear bifocals.
Through the reading lens I can get a clear front sight, but cannot see anything downrange. Through the upper lens, I can only get a blurry front sight, but I can see downrange.
I like the basic simplicity of the irons, but reality is I can shoot about 3" with optics, and 6" with irons, at 100 yards. That's with this carbine and Tula ammo
I saw that you're using the 5X PA. BTW I'm 55 years old and the VA gave me trifocals. I told the young lady lab tech "they must be mistaken, 50 is the new 30.". She said no Sir you need trifocals.". The "Sir" part made me feel very old lol.
I've got the PA 1-6x24 on another AR (5.56) . it has the ACSS reticle that goes to 800 yards. I haven't had it a long time, but no complaints so far. You can see part of it in the last pics, laying on it's side on the ground.
Do you have any trouble seeing rats with that 1-6X? If you get a 4-14X I'd be interested to see how you compare the glass to your SWFA 12X.
I haven't looked at a prairie dog through it yet. At 6X it should easily be enough for 200 yards. It has that chevron reticle for the zero point. That lets you hold on anything you can see without covering it up. Past 200, the AR-15 (my AR-15s anyway) isn't really precise enough for serious PD's shooting anyway.
The 7.62x39 has the PA 3X Prism sight with the ACSS reticle calibrated for the 7.62x39 out to 600 yards.
Mine has been feeding flawlessly. I'm using the ASC 20 round magazines.
My odometer just rolled over to 58. No doubt the eyes start to show their age.
How many rounds do you have through the 7.62 x 39 AR now? Its an intriguing project with the inexpensive ammo prices at 18 cents a round. You just got the PSA upper and put it on a std lower correct?
I've been pretty lucky building my AR15's. Sub moa so far without free floating. M4 was around 1/2" @100 yards and my HBAR with minimal load work up around 1/2-3/4" @ 100.yards. Pretty consistent to 200 yards on rats and 400 yards on chucks. I'd download my coldbore headshot @ 400 yards on a chuck pics but they say the file is too large.
Do you have any trouble seeing rats with that 1-6X? If you get a 4-14X I'd be interested to see how you compare the glass to your SWFA 12X.
Probably good enough for Democ-rats
LOL oh well "can't we all just get along?" LOL. Be happy you're in Tri cities and not over in Seattle. When I was in LE/ Mil. outside sales I'd stop by SPD's training center and there would be hypodermic needles all over the parking lot. I was always happy to head east towards you all while traveling to MT.
When I made the headshot I just finished assembling my M4 and had a cheesy Bushnell Banner Scopechief on it. I got it on trade and was the only spare scope I had. My handloads using once fired Federal brass I got from the range, Nosler 2nds 55gr BT under some TAC. I swapped that scope off and had a Zeiss Conquest 1.8-5.5x32mm on there afterwards. I just sold that scope last week and am considering the PA 1-6X for the M4. I have a Nikon 4-12X Mildot on the HBAR right now. My load is 50gr VMAX under TAC or H4895. I might try H322 or H355. I'll be shooting the 53gr VMAX latter this season as the rats get more wary.
The 7.62x39 has the PA 3X Prism sight with the ACSS reticle calibrated for the 7.62x39 out to 600 yards.
Mine has been feeding flawlessly. I'm using the ASC 20 round magazines.
My odometer just rolled over to 58. No doubt the eyes start to show their age.
How many rounds do you have through the 7.62 x 39 AR now? Its an intriguing project with the inexpensive ammo prices at 18 cents a round. You just got the PSA upper and put it on a std lower correct?
Yes a PSA upper. I have around 600 rounds or so through mine. Never hiccup'd.
From what I learned doing some research before diving into the 7.62x39 AR-15, there are two likely problem areas one may run into.
1 - Light firing pin strikes causing failure to fire. The fix is twofold. First you need a heavy hammer strike, so milspec trigger is one way to assure that. Secondly, some x39 ammo has hard primers that are sometimes seated a tad below flush. The fix for that is an "enhanced" firing pin. The enhancement is that it is a bit longer. The PSA upper comes with the BCG/CH, and already has the enhanced firing pin in it.
2 - Magazine troubles, failure to feed. Sometimes this is nothing more than people using 223/5.56 magazines, and of course they fail if loaded with more than 4-5 rounds. The fix I read mostly was to go with ASC magazines, in particular the 20 rounders. I have a couple of the ASC-20's, they have been flawless. I did buy a couple 10-round AR-Stoner magazines from Midway, and the followers are marked ASC. I don't know if ASC makes them for AR-Stoner, but they have worked fine too.
So, in a nutshell, you want an enhanced firing pin, milspec trigger, and ASC 20round mags.
On a different note, spring is definitely here. It's snowing this morning....
I miss my stops in Montana. Truly God's country. My buddies in Bend had snow this week. I'm on the border of Oregon/ Idaho and we're going to have 70 degree temps this week. And the sage rat babies are just starting to show up. Crappies are starting to show up too, tough decisions to make here soon
The 7.62x39 has the PA 3X Prism sight with the ACSS reticle calibrated for the 7.62x39 out to 600 yards.
Mine has been feeding flawlessly. I'm using the ASC 20 round magazines.
My odometer just rolled over to 58. No doubt the eyes start to show their age.
How many rounds do you have through the 7.62 x 39 AR now? Its an intriguing project with the inexpensive ammo prices at 18 cents a round. You just got the PSA upper and put it on a std lower correct?
Yes a PSA upper. I have around 600 rounds or so through mine. Never hiccup'd.
From what I learned doing some research before diving into the 7.62x39 AR-15, there are two likely problem areas one may run into.
1 - Light firing pin strikes causing failure to fire. The fix is twofold. First you need a heavy hammer strike, so milspec trigger is one way to assure that. Secondly, some x39 ammo has hard primers that are sometimes seated a tad below flush. The fix for that is an "enhanced" firing pin. The enhancement is that it is a bit longer. The PSA upper comes with the BCG/CH, and already has the enhanced firing pin in it.
2 - Magazine troubles, failure to feed. Sometimes this is nothing more than people using 223/5.56 magazines, and of course they fail if loaded with more than 4-5 rounds. The fix I read mostly was to go with ASC magazines, in particular the 20 rounders. I have a couple of the ASC-20's, they have been flawless. I did buy a couple 10-round AR-Stoner magazines from Midway, and the followers are marked ASC. I don't know if ASC makes them for AR-Stoner, but they have worked fine too.
So, in a nutshell, you want an enhanced firing pin, milspec trigger, and ASC 20round mags.
A couple other things,
I'm running a H3 buffer also. It worked with the standard buffer, but I could feel it thumping the back of the extension tube pretty good. The H3 smoothed it out.
Also I put the UTG Pro quad rail handguards on the upper.
MontanaMarine good information and the price is decent on the PSA upper. I wonder how many you would get down the nitrided tube before any significant wear from the mild steel bullets would be a problem?
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