Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles Tumbling with Dawn & Lemi-shine..............

Like most of us I cleaned my brass with corncob/walnut media for years, when stainless steel pins came along I gave them a try. I was satisfied with the results from both but never liked the job of separating the brass from the media. Walnut or corncob got stuck in the flash hole and the pins would wedge themselves in the primer pocket, both situations called for laborious sorting. Since I was already adding Dawn and Lemi-shine to the pins I thought why not eliminate the pins and see how the brass looks. To my surprise after three hours of tumbling in Dawn, Lemi-shine and hot water the brass came out spotlessly clean. Best part no media in flash holes or pins in primer pockets to mess with, so I no longer use media or pins and have nice clean shiney brass.

Or better yet, don't tumble at all.

Just one more useless step that anal retentive handloaders seem to enjoy.

Yep.

I knew the nattering nabobs of negativity would check in. You are certainly free to not tumble should you choose to do so. Once dirty brass scratches your dies you may find that tumbling has some benefits. Y'all have a nice day.

Clean brass does reflect a bit on ones character, but excessive tumbling can actually shorten ones brass via peening the necks. Not something I would do with every pass over the loading bench. It's more of an issue in the BPCR realm where precise chamber fit and lead slugs are common.

Case necks can be too clean inside as well.

Yeah, a little carbon is gonna wreck havoc on those dies.

PS: Did you ever find that deer you lost last year....

I rarely tumble any brass. It has to be pretty gd'ed bad before I bother with it. Funny thing, with just normal wiping/lubing of brass I have yet to ever scratch a die- some of which dies have been in my service since Nixon was President (including a set of RCBS steel dies that have been used to load an ungodly number of .38 Specials.)

There's a lot more to worry about in this man's world than shiny brass that only serves to impress the nimrods at the range, if they even notice.

Clean brass or lack thereof is a reflection on one's character?

I was wondering that myself, gotta be the bizarre statement of the day.

It ain’t no big deal to get the brass out of the pins. Only take a couple of minutes.

I don't worry about tumbling rifle brass at all. But, handgun brass gets nasty, especially the stuff picked up in the caliche dirt at the range. So, I tumble/clean all of my pistol brass.

I still use walnut media in a Dillon 750 unit. Also have a Thumbler's tumbler that I use with SS pins, Dawn and lemishine. I tend to use the walnut more since I don't have to mess with drying the brass afterwards.

I use reptile bedding from the pet store (ground walnut shells). It's cheaper than the walnut media sold for brass cleaning. I add a squirt or two of liquid auto wax and the brass comes out shiny.

I was talking about getting the pins out of the primer pockets, they can become very tightly wedged. No pins, no media in flash holes = no problems, the result clean brass.

Get some .047" pins. That'll cure that problem.

I'm gonna try your water/soap/lemishine method and see how it works.

The length of the pins is the problem, not the diameter. They get stuck crosswise in the primer pockets. The Dawn/Lemi-shine/hot water works fine, the brass is clean you just don't get the jewelry like shine the pins produce.

Or if you're inclined to tumble (I'm not) you can always tumble before decapping? Cleaning primer pockets is also a massive waste of time in my world.

The pins i have seen are longer than that.

I tumble em sometimes

just tried the Dawn, Lemon Shine and hot water on a 5 gallon bucket of 223 range brass shot out of full auto AR-15. Tumbled for 3 hour, primer pocket are not as clean as with stainless steel pins but the outside is nice and clean and brass from full auto get really dirty.

That's what I do, I always tumble my pistol brass first thing. I have had the stainless pins lodge themselves in the old primer too. Doesn't happen real frequently, but you sure know when it does and the decapping pin hits it on the down-stroke.

I use the RCBS rotary tumbler. But use the Lyman pans to separate the brass from the pins. I like loading clean brass. To each his own. Hasbeen

Those pins will clean silver dollars like you wouldn’t believe.

Clean primer pockets are not worth worrying about, a waste of time.

I agree

I agree

I used to tumble brass a lot, but I'd shoot a couple hundred rounds per day and I wanted the brass clean. When steel pins came out I tried that. It worked wonders on my 45-90 BP cases, but I hated those pesky pins. I too, thought they were a pain in the democrat.

I don't polish cases much anymore. My Lyman corn cob polisher is dead (Lyman will not answer any request for warranty) and I hate those pins.

So, if I need to polish cases again, I'll try your method.

One thing though, I spray the outside of my case necks with Hornady one-shot and from the shoulders down I use Imperial case sizing wax (or similar products). -- I do not like Lyman spray lube, because it is way to messy and greasy.

After sizing I use a paper towel to wipe off the lube. The cases stay pretty clean that way. I stopped using the greasy RCBS lube pad many years ago. I think that may have been the cause for the need of cleaning/polishing the cases as much as I had.

I see no personality flaw in wanting ammo, rifle or any other gun equipment clean.

Now there's one application that is truly wrong- a sure fire way to lessen the value of a silver dollar to a collector, by a lot.

What’s not to like about clean brass. In this case 45acp. Hasbeen

I started out using RCBS lube and then went to spray lube which I felt was kinda pricey, I have been using Imperial Wax for some time now. I apply RCBS to eh inside of the case necks with a Q-tip, when done sizing I wipe the outside of the cases with rubbing alcohol on a microfiber cloth. The lube inside the necks is removed with alcohol on a Q-tip. This combination of lubes works for me, sometimes I lube the inside of the necks with graphite (Motor Mica) I have a Bonanza tool for this. I like the MOtor Mica because it does a good job and requires no clean-up and won't contaminate the powder charge.

Graphite and motor mica are not the same.

When I do clean brass I no longer use a case vibrator and now use a tumbler. Because I reload, shoot and do a lot of casting I try to keep my lead/dust exposure down as much as reasonable. The case vibrators create a ton of dust! Ever see the dirty water in the tumbler? The Lemi-Shine is just citric acid with floofy smells in it, you can buy bulk citric acid on amazon for less. Additionally, you can use vinegar as well or just use the pins.

Over time I have picked up a lot of Carbide expander balls. Redding sells them. They are a little expensive but if you load one caliber a lot it’s worth it. Hasbeen

My favorite case cleaning method for properly dirty brass involves a bucket, 1/4" hardware cloth, and hot water with dish soap and vinegar. The hardware cloth is set up a few inches above the bottom of the bucket. The bucket gets filled about halfway with brass, and the rest of the way with soapy water. Put a top on the bucket, throw it into the pickup bed, and drive to Oshkosh and back. Let the bucket sit for a few hours, then fish out the now clean enough brass. Dispose of the used cleaning media responsibly by pouring it down the nearest woodchuck hole.

I have had some dies in which I installed the Redding carbide expander balls, they're well worth the expense. I have one for my .257 Roberts die on order.

I agree, but then why do you deprime the brass before tumbling? Seems like an extra step that just results in your pins getting stuck, as you've said.

The brass dries faster without the primers to trap water in the primer pockets. Sizing also takes a little less effort when you aren't depriming at the same time.

I'll buy the better for drying bit, but less effort when sizing? Really???

The way I figure, you're going to deprime sometime, either before or after tumbling/cleaning. So while it may not be worth any extra effort to clean pockets by themselves, it don't hurt none if they perchance get cleaned along with the rest of the case. I won't tell if nobody else will.

As far as pins getting stuck in the flash hole or pocket, that's the reason for the OP, skip the pins and just wet tumble with Dawn and Lemi-shine. I candle annealed a batch of brass yesterday evening and even wiping the necks off with a wet cloth after annealing they still have fairly sooty necks. So I figured this was a good time to test the no-pins tumbling. Ran the tumbler for two hours with just detergent and Lemi-shine while I did something useful like watch TV or catch up on all the drama of "As the Fire Burns" up in the top section.

Anyway, the cases came out pretty clean. Not as shiny new looking as they would have with SS pins but a far cry better than the dirty black necks they started with. To my eye they looked about as clean as they would have given the same amount of vibratory cleaning with corn cob or walnut media but without the dust.


I try not to make too many editorial comments any more, but all of this back and forth about "I do this" and "well, I'm better than you because I do THAT!"

Really? It's a hobby, do what pleases you. If it pleases someone to do it one way and not another or to do or not do something at all, why does anybody else care?

+1 to the above especially the last sentence. It isn't about caring so much as some folks need to stir up chit.

The old silver dollars I have are not collector grade. I buy them to give to grandkids on their birthdays. They like them clean and shiny. My grand mother gave me one every year until she died. I still have all 23.

I like the way my handloads look when the brass is spit shined. They don’t shoot any better. Getting the brass separated from pins isn’t a big deal.

Hasbeen’s brass looks like new. Pistol brass I don’t worry about cleaning. Looks great though Hasbeen. On the other hand, rifle brass I do clean. First I clean the inside of the necks with a bore brush inserted into my drill, wipe the outside of the neck to remove loose carbon, lube the case then size the case. Then I squirt some Flitz on a rag, spread it, put an old pistol bore brush in my drill, insert the bore brush into the neck of the rifle brass, and wrap it with the Flitz coated rag, run it for a few seconds, then run it on a clean rag and sisboombah-new brass. Lots faster than a tumbler. No separation of media etc. I then clean the primer pockets and anneal the necks.

just did three 5 gallon buckets of 223 brass without pins, very good results, no pins to play with, I'm sold, no more pins, I'll be listing 60 pounds of pins in the near furture

I used to not clean my rifle brass, but several years ago, I started with a vibratory tumbler and corn cob media. I still clean before i reload that case - both for looks and to preserve my dies was the thought at the time.

I use Imperial wax on the cases and their dry lube on the necks unless only using a Lee Collet neck sizer - then no lube at all - yippee! I don't clean the inside of the necks other than tapping them on the reloading bench, but I clean both lubes off the outside of the casing after sizing, with a rag.

I've only started annealing my brass in the past couple of years, and only do that after 5+ loadings.

Think I'll start skipping the tumbler sometimes, if no one has experienced die issues. I really like loading and shooting, the prep not as much.

I like the loading part also, all the prep work? NOT

I'm still trying to get my head wrapped around doing all this with wet media. I'm still doing mine in corn cob with a vibratory cleaner I bought in 2000. I don't mean to belittle anyone else's process. I'm just trying to figure out what the benefit is, and it would be a good idea to switch. The big drawback I see is that whenever I get the cases wet, I have to figure out a way to get them dry. That's usually a whole separate operation.

Normally, I don't decap prior to cleaning. I'm in the camp with the guys who think cleaning and uniforming primer pockets is just too much effort for the gain.

I changed out my media this past weekend. It had gone 3 years without a problem. I started getting black smears on the finished brass, and knew it was time to go.

After I get home from the range, I pop in the fired cases, cover with corn cob, and set the timer for 12 hours or so. It doesn't matter to me how fast it gets done, so long as the batch is ready by the next time I go down to load. It seems to be such a simple process that I can't find a way to work myself up to changing.

Maybe y'all can enlighten me.

The rotary tumbler is set up for cleaning a lot of cases at once. Weight limit on mine is 30 lbs.
SS pins 5 lbs
Water 16 lbs (2gal)
Container 2 lbs
That leaves room for about 7 lbs of brass.
When I return from the range, I punch out the primers with a Lee die. I use plastic coffee cans to separate my brass. 9mm and 38 can
be cleaned together. If I try to mix in 45 the cases will become stuck inside each other.
I put a couple of tablespoons of Dawn with a 9mm case full of Lemi Shine. Run tumbler about 2 1/2 hours.
Then I pour the contents thru the 2 Lyman separators. One catches the brass the other the pins. All this separation is done in the kitchen sink. I wash the brass at this time. I carry the clean brass and pins outside to a table. Most of the pins have been caught in one of the Lyman pans. I spread a towel on the table and pour the brass on this to dry. I pick up the rest of the pins with a magnet.

I shoot a lot more pistol than rifle these days. Rifle brass can be added to a load pistol brass.
There has been some talk that the pins work harden the case necks on bottle neck cartilages . Hasbeen

My Tumbler is pretty big I use about 40 lb of pins for up to for 5 gallon buckets of brass

shaman,

I feel the same way about wet tumbling. I'm not sure I see the benefit over a vibratory tumbler with walnut or corncob media. I use a wall timer set to 2 hours and I "set it and forget it". It takes virtually no time to dump your brass into the tumbler, toss in a used dryer sheet (to keep dust down), and fire it up and walk away. I can leave the brass in it for weeks if I don't have time or see a need to put it away. It's ready to use straight out of the tumbler, with a quick wipe down from a paper towel. No drying period.

The wet tumbling method admittedly gets brass "like-new" shiny inside and out. But I see no tangible benefit to that. It also seems to me like it just generates more work with creating an extra step for getting the brass dry. Before the vibratory tumbler I manually cleaned grungy brass in a 5 gallon bucket with a cleaning solution found online. I hated drying the brass and sometimes had water trapped in the primer pocket days after I thought I had it completely dry. Moving to dry tumbling was a big step up to me. I don't think I'd like to head back in the other direction.

But to each their own. As has been said before, what someone else does doesn't affect me any.

Drying the brass is easy - rinse it well, drain it, then put it on a pizza pan in the oven at 200 F for an hour or two. (bottleneck cases can take longer than pistol cases)

I'll use a wet soak in a soap & citric acid bath for really nasty or dirty brass before dry tumbling; that works pretty well. But for most reloading, just a dry tumble works for me and as said above, it doesn't take very much effort. I do prefer to load clean brass, but won't claim it's necessary and don't really care what someone else thinks about it.

The wet method is definitely superior at eliminating dust. The first time I ever cleaned brass I did it by shaking the brass in a 5 gal bucket and letting it soak for a bit using the NRA vinegar cleaning solution because I hadn't bought a vibrator cleaner yet. Cleaning brass with a wet solution is not really inconvenient. It didn't get the brass shiny though, just clean which is all I really cared about. After draining the cleaning solution, rinse with very hot water. Then pour out the brass and water into a tumbler media separator. Tumble the brass quickly so trapped water drains out of all the cases before they cool. The heated brass will dry quickly. I bought and currently use a vibrator and corn cob media because when I first started handloading, I figured it must be the superior way, but it really isn't. Either way is easy and each has its own inconveniences. If my vibrator takes a dump, I probably won't buy another, but I still have plenty of corn cob media to use up. Definitely deprime first if cleaning with a wet solution.

You must be using a concrete mixer. 😁. Hasbeen

That's exactly what I'm using, took the mixing paddles out of it Rhino lined it

There's no need to deprime first, if you use the simple drying procedure I mentioned above. Depriming first adds a ton of time to an otherwise almost effortless procedure, and is completely unnecessary.

Not having to dry brass is even easier.

A cookie sheet in the oven for a few hours works too, if you have a spouse who doesn't mind sharing the oven & cookie sheets in that manner. Not my wifes favorite idea but I could probably get away with it if I cared enough to do it. And I guess I just like the "fire and forget" method of dump the brass in the dry tumbler and walk away. It shuts off after 2 hours and there is no need to worry about leaving clean brass sitting in the solution for days on end or leaving an oven on. I take the lazy mans approach.

And I still haven't seen what real benefit a wet tumble does over a dry one. I guess, for me, a dry tumble is good enough.

I stole our biggest pizza pan from the kitchen and keep it in my reloading room now for drying brass. My wife understands that evaporating water off of metal doesn't harm the oven or affect the food. Not sure what you're getting at with the type of pan though; seems like you're suggesting the same thing I said, but as an alternative somehow? I don't see how that makes any difference at all.

If you read my whole post, you saw that I dry tumble too, and often I don't wet tumble if the brass doesn't need it. It's not necessarily a one or the other thing; if I wet tumble I always dry tumble after. The wet tumble is to get the nastier dirt, mud, and corrosion off, and it does that well. One could certainly just go straight to loading after the wet tumble and drying, but I don't.

I put my brass out in the sun for a while. It drys it pretty quick.

You must do a lot of shooting to use a concrete mixer to clean brass!!!

I buy it by the buckets full, just got 15 five gallon buckets of 308's, but I do alot of shooting too.

One thing is we do not lack for is sun and heat in South East Texas. Mine dry real quick in the sun. Hasbeen

I'm in the pacific northwest; most of the year if I put my brass outside, it'll just get wetter. (yes, I do miss the sun, but like the mild weather)