Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Lion gun

texken - anyone who pays attention to the way my research is compiled knows that the "n" word doesn't come out of my corner.

I'll look for data, ask for data, opinions, compare and numbers of other angles until such time that the data may align and possibly a conclusion could be drawn even if tentative. It may change.

Sometimes others state an opinion, drive a stake in the ground and then attempt to defend it until the cows come home.
That style doesn't lead to good discussion and free flow of thoughts and ideas that may lead to a solid conclusion IMO.

I have engraved Savage rifles with factory letter that says "engraved". In these cases the ledger simply says engraved, not engraved by Tue. Now we (JTC and others) know Enoch Tue was the lead engraver of the day and generally what his works look like, but,... there were other engravers whose roles are not totally understood, so there ya go, N-S-N.

Gene - Sights and other rifle configurations is an angle to look at also. However, the nature of embellished Savage rifles is that these rifles may have also been ordered with checking, pistol grip, deluxe wood, sight changes, etc. So that could easily throw one off the trail.

I've said repeatedly, I'm no expert and trying to learn. I do have a fairly substantial library on the engraving topic with a number of books by the late R.L Wilson who was a master engraver and a prolific writer who documented all things engraving particularly the immigrant masters and American masters.
I also have a contact who is a founding member of the Firearms Engraving Guild of American (FEGA) and their historian. He has forgotten more about engraving than I will ever know. He has provided some insight to me in the past that has opened my eyes. There is a good reason engravers and those who authenticate engraving use a magnifier, a jeweler loupe, etc. The devil is in the detail.
At arms length, "they all look the same".

Anyway, the previous questions stand.
Got info on the Lion or Tiger rifle?
S.N., factory letter, etc. Feel free to chime in.
Who knows where it could lead?? It may confirm something or maybe something previously unknown will appear.

If there were other engravers working for Savage (and I think we know Tue had one or more family members doing that), it's always been our presumption that they worked under Tue using his designs and in his style.

I think that's true of every significant engraver back then. Believe Gough at one time had 20 folks working in his private shop? Yep..


But it's probably proper to call any engraving done during Tue's employment as Tue engraving.

Agreed.
I suspect in some/many cases the engravers under Tue or Gough for example were apprentices, journeymen and that sort of thing. Typical of European engraving institutions as well.
Engraving is done in layers or stages. Prep work, base work, secondary work, detail work, finish work, etc.
The apprentice and journeyman types started out doing the low order work while learning the craft leaving the detail and finish to the masters until they were ready.
There are some economies in this approach as well. Apprentice/journeyman could generate all the lower order steps while the Masters could focus on the high order steps. Throughput would increase.

Yep. And I've been told that they used sketches/templates/outlines (whatever the proper term is) as the basis for their engraving, so that they would be consistent.

Except when custom designs might have been ordered. Such as the moose gun. Probably still created one, but it wouldn't be the standard ones.

That is exactly correct!
If I am able to come up with a Tue pattern(s) from a family member archive, first I'll faint, then I'll share it with you all, then I'll put it squarely in FEGA's hands. I'm work'in at it.

The FEGA gentleman mentioned earlier did exactly that. While following threads, leads, etc. found a family member who had the Nimschke archives. Patterns, documentation of virtually all of his works. It now rests safely with FEGA forever.