Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Bear Creek Arsenal

I'm sure this has been discussed on here before, but I missed it if it had. I've found a place that has some BCA uppers on sale, and I know nothing about them. I don't really need another AR, but I have a complete lower that needs an upper, and I've been thinking about finding something to go with it.

So, what can someone tell me about the Bear Creek uppers. Thanks.

I have a 450 BM its awesome. Shoots 1" or less when I do my part and its not failed on shot yet. Finish quality is nice, would not call it perfect, but for money I have been very happy.

Cheap junk.

You don't always get what you pay for, but with Bear Creek it's true. Also their customer service is pretty bad.

Okay, so far a draw.

Sometimes the barrels are good, sometimes not. But I understand they are pretty good on customer service and will replace bad barrels.

Are you looking at 6.5 Grendel’s or just .223 uppers?

I’m either case I’ve read enough bad reports on BCA barrels I’d spend a little more if it was me. Of course that’s just an opinion formed from browsing forums, not firsthand knowledge....

I bought a couple barrels from them a few months ago; one of them they sent the wrong item, completely their fault. It took them 2 weeks of hassling to get a shipping label to return it, and another 6 weeks after receiving mine back to get around to refunding it since that one was no longer in stock. Too bad, it was in stock until about a week before they finally got around to it. I think I had to contact them 5 or 6 times through the whole thing to get it done, and had to talk to a supervisor twice. I had to laugh when they offered a 10% coupon off my next purchase - as if there's going to be a next time after all that...

That's not good service by any definition I know.

Of the barrels I did receive, neither was machined very cleanly, and the chambering jobs were mediocre at best. I wasn't surprised, given the price, just don't expect magic from a bottom-priced product.

I found some BCA uppers, both in 223 and 6.5 Grendel at what I thought was a pretty decent price, and just wanted to see what experiences others have had with them, as I've had none. I was thinking about either building or buying an upper, and am just kicking around some ideas. This won't be a rifle that will I'll shoot a lot, just something to stick back in safe, and I'm not going to spend a lot on it. I've used the PSA uppers before, and weren't impressed there, so I am aware of the problems that the lower priced products can have.

The term "you get what you pay for" seems to apply. Some people are happy with theirs but there's a lot of negativity surrounding BCA barrels.

James many if not all these responses are people that do not own a BCA. They have a lifetime warranty and if you do have a issue sending it in would be a hassle, but I'm sure they will get you fixed and it is a American company. This is on their site...BCA's expectations is that our Barrels, 16 inches or longer, will hold a 1.000" MOA at 100 yards with appropriate ammo and shooting techniques.

I've been very happy with mine, it's never jammed or failed in anyway and is very accurate. But all I can attest to is mine.

Is that kinda like "all day, every day, if I do my part" ?

Surely would like to see some honest 10 shot targets from anyone that has their barrels / rifles...........................just sayin'.

Sounds like all the major gun & barrel manufacturers will soon be out of business.

MM

I'm sure they are talking 3 shot group. There are not target competition rifles.

No you want TWO 10 shot groups....just sayin.

Well any rifle can throw 3 shots close together here and there. Most people are good with that though and don't hold the company to their accuracy guarantee because they never actually test it.

Yeah, I know........................just needling the "all, day every day MOA" crowd.

'Course y'all prolly missed the joke.

MM

I just shot mine and am perfectly fine with it. It's an AR10, on a PSA lower, Cheap scope, and while zeroing it, and trying some Varget I had work-up loads for got nearly half of the groups about an inch and only two groups looked bad at about 2". This is with a horrible PSA trigger, shooting off the back of the pickup. If you want bechrest accuracy spend bigger money (LaRue) but for fun & function I don't see anything wrong with it.

Last night I ordered a 450 Bushmaster
I had not seen this thread I hope I can say good stuff I hope to know soon for my self

Hank

I have 2 BCA uppers, a 9mm and a .223 Wylde, both on 80% lowers that I assembled. Both have Rise armament triggers, Never had a problem with either, both function fine and are accurate enough for my purposes.

What barrel do you have on the Wylde?

A friend has one of their 24” Grendel barrels. It’ll put 3 Hornady factory rounds into an inch, and I’ve done it more than once.
I had told him it’d not be my first pick (the brand and the length), but I can’t cuss it.
Neither of us have ever shot a coyote 10 times, so I can’t help that crowd….

Way to jump in a thread that's 3 years dead.

Wonder if BCA still hires illegal aliens?

Do you really have much doubt????????????

MM

The [bleep] that gets typed and worried about....

You do know that they were busted for it? It wasn't one or two either. It was a big percentage of their work force. Fuqk them.

In spades..........................

MM

Yup.

The most inaccurate AR I've owned/scene happened to be a bear creek barrel ..

.

wanna fuq them on that here in TX you'd have to do it to so many businesses... They aren't cheap to work anymore either. In fact I regularly do jobs less pay than they do when I do side jobs.

Don't like illegals or them working but there are so many bigger fish to fry. Like WHY are the borders wide open?

And to be truthful a lot of illegals work a lot harder than a lot of legal lazy folks in this country.

I do realize bear creek isn't the top of the quality line etc... Not that most people actually need the quality they think they do. But thats besides the point.

You just answered your own question...because business owners, who really run the country, hire them.

What barrel do you have on the Wylde? [/quote

Stainless fluted Wolf.

I didn't look at the year posted, thanks for your input though.

Maybe it's just you.

Lmao I have several other AR' s colt , PSA , S&W .. go troll else where ..

Yes. I’d “fuq” them on that in TX, in NC, in MT, any state in the union. I do not pollute the threads below the Freakshow with politics. But it is very pertinent here.

Your “truth” is a bullchit apologetic trope that simply not true. I would not shed one tear if every company that knowingly hired illegal aliens was fined to the legal limit, and after word got out they lost their market share and went under.

That on this site, on THIS TOPIC someone would defend the practice is disgusting and a sign of the times.


Rant off, and I apologize to the other members for it.

I have 2 224 valkryie ar15 barrels from bear creek, both have been super accurate and print an average of .500" to .600" at 100 yds, nice out to 600 yards.
Lots of issues with them from others as junk, but I'm happy with the ones I got through midsouth supply.

One shot groups with keyholed boolits????????????????

MM

Always nice to get an expert opinion. Thanks.

And to further this some more. I actually did some reading and research. Bear Creek, not defending quality etc..., hired folks that provided ID. It was an issue of the ID being possibly fake. Some ID were fake. Some were real and returned.

So countrary to all the info I see here that they hired illegals it certainly was not the case with the exceptions of illegal ID and thats on the person not the company.

That said I've said all along you don't need brand names, just stuff that works for most of what folks use guns for.

and soon enough we will see how bad the quality of Bear creek is. Upper is on the way just because I was curious.

I"ve shot so many 59 dollar bcg over the years on fun guns, and never had an issue, I suspect will be the same here. Accuracy may not be on par either. Will see. Of course blasphemy I've had non accurate Krieger barrels too. Dont' even. want to talk about Douglas...

Did he say keyholes or one shot groups?

I've played with ARs parts kits etc. since the 70s. You can get some decent stuff with the right ammo from some cheap sources... not all the time. But really who needs much more than 1-2 MOA for most of what they actually do. I desire a lot better. But lets face it, deer hunters use guns 4moa quite a bit years ago and never had issues.

I will report honestly on my bear creek upper as time allows. Even though 24 hour has gone so far downhill I don't visit much anymore.

I bought a BC .300 Blackout upper last summer on a lark. It was less than $300 and at my door in three days so the initial buy and value gets a big thumbs up. Fit perfectly. Loaded up some Hornady 190 gr Sub-X@ 1050 fps. It took about 30 rounds, more lube and a magazine switch from the one that I had to get it running smoothly as it had a few failure to extract or feed but now it's seamless and I find the accuracy perfectly acceptable for what's really a 100 yard rifle as long as I'm shooting subsonics.

I'm no EBR expert by any means and I mostly own it as an FU to our state but I'd say for the money I'm a happy customer.



100 yard target

I had a BCA upper in 350 Legend. It shot patterns not groups. Took 2 hours of lead lapping to get it to shoot a decent group. Pure POS. Never again!

That looks like the Gen 2 side charger. Does the charging handle stay tight? Use thread lock? Thx

as above ymmv.

And as I've said I've had some expensive tubes shoot not great. Ive seen major factory bolt gun barrels shoot bad. I've sent in a 4 inch barrel to TC. they shot a 4 inch group and sent back saying it was fine.

What I'm saying is you can pay and pretty much have known. Like invest a 500 buck barrel and high dollar name upper parts and be 800 plus into an upper that most likely will shoot well. Or if you aren't picky, like my 6.5 Grendel, take a chance, and see. I'd say the odds of a decent shooter is pretty decent, at least 80 plus percent... maybe better.

As to lock tight a charge handle, I've seen a barrel so loose RE the forend you could unscrew the wobbly tube by hand. Denied by a MAJOR MATCH builder.... that produces some heck of a guns. We just snugged it up the right way and called it good.

Just seems like so many complain these days. If its cheap, then expect a bit of work possibly. And less accuracy possibly. If its high dollar then its probably going to be fine.
Probably.

Just have to find out whats important.

No. I'd never use Bear creek to shoot matches. But plinking and shooting pigs doesn't take much. Just used a PSA cheap 200 buck upper about an hour ago to shoot 5 pigs in the back pasture with a thermal. Never missed a hitch.

Like Pugs, I initially got into the "Black Rifle" bidness, "just because", so for a long time, I owned just two in 5.56, a Bushmaster (purchased in 2007) and a Colt about three years ago.
Then Hatari got me into the "thumpers" so I built one using a Davidson Defense upper, a bolt from somewhere else and a lower from Palmetto (?) I also spent the "big bucks" and bought a Wyndham "Thumper" both in 450 BM. Even doing some hand loading for them with those mean looking bullets that look like a Phillips screwdriver head. But they also shoot Hornady factory with accuracy (see below three shot group at 100).
Bottom line is you can build these things for less than 500 bucks and they SHOOT. Besides, spending money on these hideous looking irons is like ordering a Yugo with leather seats..

i have no complaints about my BCA uppers .one a side charging 762x39 giving a 3/4'' grouping at 100 yd the other came as a 308 side charging .as soon as it came that barrel was removed and a wilson combat in 708 was installed. along with a JP trigger and JP enhanced bolt .

SO an quick update.

We now know that the illegal workers was all a lie. Someone put a spin on it.

299 dollar Grendel upper came in. Thats what it was Black Friday. Think I paid a few bucks more.

Put a 4X scope, all I could get to fit with what I had laying around, without ordering rings, new base etc..

First 4 of factory 123 SST were about 1.5 inches. 2 inches low, inch left. I'd only roughly bore sighted.

Next 3 were a random reload N540 with 120 TTSX.. 1 inch group.

Next 3 same random reload N540 with 123 Scenars. 3/4 inch group.

Overall group 10 shots, 2 inches. At 100 yards. 4x off bags, not really taking my time much

One round failed to eject. Stayed in chamber. Brass not sized on the reloads and they showed that they are a bit high pressure. Pulled bolt back and came out. Hopefully didn't bend extractor.

Will clean up the chamber a bit. I'm sure its rough. And since factory worked fine I suspect I need a bit more sizing and back off powder a bit.

Think for a 300 buck upper its a 200 yard gun pretty easy. 300 should be fine from what I say from 10 rounds. Thats about max for hunting anyway IMHO.

Not that I'd put bear creek first, but for a rough and tumble pig gun, not bad at all. And for a beater truck gun I think I might see whats on sale from them next. You just never know. I may run out of lowers before its all said and done.

Nephews son has never shot a deer. So that may be the first thing we try, if we get a chance. If he can hit good we will see. Thinking hard trying the ttsx on the deer.

Seeing that Sea Chest about triggered a nervous tick

We used to load them to about 200 lbs and then have to cross deck them over to the next ride about got my hands working right again finally


Mike

Cool. Got a link?

Standard BCG or side charger. Reason I ask is I have a Gen 2 side charger I’m “fixin” to put together on an Aero Precision lower. Wondering about securing the charge handle.

I don't. Looked it up duck duck go a few weeks ago when everyone was hot on bear creek. Read a couple articles. Wasn't hard to realize it was a raid RE fake ID. They caught more than a few. And a few they did wrong so they had to release.

But if folks going to hold business at fault for being handed false ID I have no clue what the world is coming to. Only way then is hire only people that dont look like immigrants? Dunno.

Standard BCG. Not sure what you mean about securing it. But not wanting it to back out or unscrew? Loctite. Removable kind. I like the regular ones better but thats an individual thing. We ran a side charge handle to practice rapid fire, long story and a rig but screwed in snug it never came loose while cycling the action thousands of times by hand.

Well that’s a resounding no. I’ll dig a little deeper. Everything I’ve seen references an ICE raid and 30 arrests. Not sure how a raid in re fake id’s for illegal aliens is a lie. Spin? Lol

Enough for me to not spend my money on em, but ymmv.

Yes, as in keeping the screw from backing out. Blue Locktite supposedly does the trick. Gen 1 was just a curved finger knob with a screw thru the attachment shaft. Gen 2 has a slide in notch at the front, an L shaped pin IIRC, and a screw thru the rear of the actuator base. Thanks for you’re update.

You must read what I didn't. They raided. Found folks with illegal ID. The owners hired them based on ID. Thats simple enough for me.

But you read into it what you do and I read into it from the owners point of view.

Now if he had no documentation to back it up, IE hired illegal with no ID then its on him and them. I did not see any of that mentioned at all

I read the first link that popped up this morning. It referenced ID issues.

I read the 2nd. Related that 250 employees appx, 30 were detained, checking ID and I9 forms filled out for the employer. Some released when identity was confirmed. Obviously some must have had fake.. fake is common in case folks aren't aware.

at least 220 employees not illegal.... well if that doesn't say enough you just keep on. Whether you buy from them or not, this is news out of proportion.... like normal. Guilty until proven either way...

ICE does not raid a worksite without very firm info.

Rest assured they were employing more than a handful of illegals.

Whether anybody gives a schit or not is on them.

I used thin O ring to secure the rear plug or bolt

I wonder who dropped a dime on them?

Or was it just scrutiny of a firearm manufacturer?

My guess is BATFE may have shared a bit of intel to jab them in the eye when they couldn't find anything that violated their bailiwick.

Lots of time and energy spent on garbage. The fact they employed illegals is just flies on the shidt pile.

If they got any info they were acting on it under Trump.

It’s usually a pissed off former employee but sometimes there is a nexus to the border from a load.

It was rarely reported on but ICE kicked a lot of ass under Trump.

I’ve got a BCA 10” in 300BO that I bought from Midway last year. It’s been 100% reliable and with supersonic ammo and open sights I routinely hover around MOA at 100 yards

I’ve never been overly fond of ARs. I think they’re ugly. They require frequent and tedious cleaning. They’re bulkly…. That said they are a good battle weapon and worth having. I usually buy them when some political BS is brewing. Of my three ARs (DPMs, S&W and now BCA), I can’t tell a bit of difference in quality or craftsmanship. I just can’t see myself splurging on a high end AR when the ones I have are up to my standards.

“ They require frequent and tedious cleaning”

Google filthy 14 sometime

Iron sights and you are hovering around moa. That is damn good. I'd be happy with that. If the BCA is working good for you, that is good. They are generally at the bottom of the barrel. You shouldn't expect the bolt to hold up as well as a good bolt, but those are easy to change out. What sights are you running to attain that type of accuracy with your AR?

By now, you realize everyone's AR's shoot moa or better here. Even with irons now, it can be done... or at least that is what they are telling us. I'm not that good, but I digress.. Such is life..

Too bad no one's ever started a thread on this.

I can start a thread on how I can't shoot moa with my iron sight AR's.. ha ha..

Yes, they were, with FAKE ID. People can be so dumb. Read the articles. The employer did things correct. Now if you can show me otherwise I'll believe, but i'm tired of fake media and idiots that keep pushing it.

Don't you find it just a little bit unusual that such a small company had so many illegals with fake IDs? Like maybe the word got out that they didn't check very closely?

Or they were telling them were to go to get their fake ids?

I've read several articles about the raid but don't remember seeing that BCA was charged or fined for anything. Is that the case? Seems like the Feds woulda jumped at the chance drive a firearms manufacturer out of business.

Once they’re in-country there’s a million ways to legalize. Worked at an armpit company for a few months that had a bunch. All with IDs. Generally you’re without LE help. ICE won’t come. Local LE arrests them where do they put them?? Not the county jail that’s for sure. They have to be stopped BEFORE they cross the border.

Business owners give campaign contributions, illegals don't. That's why they keep crossing the border-employment. Until you go after the employers, nothing will change.

exactly.

But the ones here on the campfire can keep at whatever.

Really makes me no difference but again we are supposed to be conservative constitution following folks that go with innocent until guilty.

But the fire has changed over the years. Too many azzholes ready to jump on a bandwagon.

Personally I could care less about Bear creek except for the people here pushing agendas and lies.

They don't make top end stuff. They make cheap stuff. I'd suppose most of it works well enough and is accurate enough.

I can sure recall when you were surprised if a bolt gun shot MOA or less off the shelf with factory loads.... now you have that being pretty common from cheap off the shelf ARs but it bothers some.

Prove the company was guilty and I'll report that too.

I'm just sick of pushing all the fake news. Hell you would think some of the naysayers believe the scamdemic.

Lol

With all the suppliers of known good & proven AR components, why would any sane, thinking, intelligent & discerning "builder" play Bear Creek roulette.

Yes, no, maybe so, on their quality & reliability.

Not my cup-a-tea even if their schitt was free. I got better things to do & spend my money on, aside from whether they are using illegal labor or not.

If they are, all the more reason to write them off. Fu^ck 'em if they are.

YMMV

Carry on. I dont' know [bleep] about ARs and never have....spend as you see fit.

its just a shame we are here to have different views as not everyone is after the same thing. I know I'm not for each gun, they all have differing jobs...

And a last pass... I've had a crap barrel from Krieger.... so lets get them out of the mix too.. SMDH

Rost, quit being sarcastic, it doesn't become you & we all recognize that you are one of the most knowledgeable posters here.

But the point is that there are enough reports from various sources, to make BC suspect enough, that given today's choices, why take a chance on an product with that kind of rep, when there are plenty more, with more reliable reps?

As for Krieger, sure they may have lemon here or there but attempting to equate that kind of situation with the much more frequent incidences of issue with BC on everyday, basic parts, is a loooooog stretch.

I participate on several forums, not just this one, & the issues & reservations raised here about BC's quality are present on every single one of them..............so again, the question is why intentionally & knowingly deal with a source with that kind of rep?

If you choose to, fine, but don't criticize the rest of us that choose to take a more secure path?

MM

Ok

On one hand, you got rost saying its good chidt maynerd, on the other you got most guys saying it's chidt... I know Jeff has a lot of experience in the ar world, so this here is a conundrum.. "Things that make you go hmmmm"... Jeff, how good is it really???? Sub moa for 10 shots good?

I always love reviews after a couple of magazines worth of ammo. And a sample of one really doesn’t tell much. But I’m not buying anything here so it doesn’t matter. I know what I like and gambling never was my thing.

Roll the dice buddy. Take one for the team...

Ha!

Good friend of mine who actually got me into AR’s and building them always steered me towards known quality. Ya I’ve ventured off and tried some parts that worked and some that didn’t but buying bargain priced guns or parts have never worked out for me.

So my buddy tells me his cousin ordered one of the PSA pistol AR’s and he brought it over cause it was a single shot. Looked at the bolt and while the carrier wasn’t chromed, it looked okay but the bolt had a POS extractor in it, a weak extractor spring, blue insert and an o ring. The ejector was wonky too. Said the whole deal looked chinese.

But the net is full of rave reviews on parts and guns that are just as good as. I just don’t see the need to pee on the fence.

I’ve got a BCA complete upper with a 16” barrel in .223 Wylde. It was the first AR I somewhat put together. It has never failed me and will shoot anything I feed it. On a good day, it may shoot 1.5” MOA with the right ammo, mostly it’s a 2 MOA rifle. Outside of a magazine issue, which was me not getting the mag in all the way, I’ve never had any issues. Would I trust my life in a fire fight with it, probably not. Would I use it to fend off a would be burglar yes. This gun is exactly why I bought it for, plinking at the range. Of all of the ARs I own, I treat it the worst. I don’t care if it breaks, as I will replace what broke with better parts.

Now my son, he has a 7.5” 7.62x39 BCA complete upper. After shoring it 2-5 times the screws in the handguard would back out. I contacted BCA for him and they replaced the screws no questions asked. It fixed the problem.

Now, you want to talk about a POS AR upper, I have one that is a Karri’s Guns. Another member on the forum mentioned them a while back and at the time I was looking for a 7.62x39 upper. I didn’t have the income I do now, so I bought one. That thing would shoot steel cases ammo just fine, put brass cased ammo in it and it became a single shot rifle. I have rebuilt that thing and the only parts that are original are the upper, barrel, and handguard. I put a new gas system in it and replaced the bolt to make it run brass ammo. The rifle now runs great, but I would have been better buying a quality upper from the get go.

Now after 3 plus years of owning and shooting AR’s outside of the military, would I buy another BCA upper, probably not. I sure as heck would not buy anything from Karri’s Guns. PSA is about as low as I would go. I have PSA and Aero lowers and no issues. I’ve put quality LPK’s in all but one of my lowers, you definitely get why you pay for. My next project is in the thinking stage at the moment. I have a “Let’s Go Brandon” lower from PSA, and I’m thinking a 14.5” pinned and welded barrel for it. The lowest priced barrel I’ve even considered is a Ballistic Advantage, but leaning strongly towards other brands at the moment.

no. It won't be sub moa for 10. It will be totally good enough for pigs to 300 though which is about its end for me. Distance wise.

Would I be happy trying to shoot a match with it? No. Never said that. Am I happy so far with it? Yup.

Will I have 100 rounds down it before I fly north? No way. But it shoots better than I need with the first loads. And I doubt I'll find 100 hogs between now and then. Be tiring if I did actually.

And don't worry, if it falls on its face like it has to, I'll report that too.

Says the guy placing in nationals with the cheapest lower of the times and a good barrel....

My BCA upper experience was good. a 16" barreled upper put together like a military M4 with the plastic hand guards. Shot great right off the bat with Hornady Black 123 gr. ELDM and so so with the Hornady SST ammo. 3 inch groups with the Wolf military class FMJ steel cases stuff.
Function flawless right from the start though I did go over it and get rid of any roughness I could find. Even worked just fine with a magazine made for he 6.8 SPC. Shot it probably 600 times so far. I'd say with my reloads it is an honest 3 shot MOA gun. All I need for a deer/hog and plinking.