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I've run the numbers, and it all depends on how you define "better".

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Gosh there is an amazing amount of stupid in this thread.....

Shockingly Trithtan is part of the stupid side who repeats [bleep] he's heard on these very forums....

Laughing....



- Greg

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Originally Posted by 16bore
Originally Posted by smokepole
Originally Posted by 16bore
Someone please explain what "better" bullet selection means?

You need it explained?

It has to do with both size and BC. For example if you think you need a stout, heavier bullet for big animals the biggest Partition you can shoot in your .270 is 160 grains; the biggest for the .280 is 175 grains. The heaviest TTSX Barnes lists for the .270 is 130 grains; for the .280 it's 150.

For Berger bullets the highest BC you can get in .270 is .662, for the .280 it's .755.

And so on and so forth.


Sure, if a guy is chasing BC. But a 140 gr .277 NAB beats a 140 gr. 284 NAB in that department.

Both still Accubombs.


For non-loonies, there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the bullets available for the .270 and a .280.

For most, I suspect the local gun shop has a wider selection of loaded ammo for the .270.


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No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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All I could ever find for my 280 was 140 grain Remington Core-Lokts. But the gun liked them and I never shot it enough to worry about Dies.

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Originally Posted by GregW
Gosh there is an amazing amount of stupid in this thread.....

Shockingly Trithtan is part of the stupid side who repeats [bleep] he's heard on these very forums....

Laughing....



laugh laugh

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Originally Posted by Reloder28
Originally Posted by Coyote_Hunter
.270 Win, .280 Rem, .280AI. Pretty much peas in a pod.



Uhhhh, No.



Uhhhh, yeah, they are. Different, yes, but not by much. If I wasn't comfortable one would do the job, neither of the others would be my choice.


Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
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Originally Posted by GregW
Gosh there is an amazing amount of stupid in this thread.....

Shockingly Trithtan is part of the stupid side who repeats [bleep] he's heard on these very forums....

Laughing....



Ignorance is bliss😊

Especially considering your post matches your definition to a T

Gosh?!?!?


Trystan


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Originally Posted by smokepole


And you're still way behind. Try to keep up.


With a short chubby little crybaby like you......LOL

Why don't you post a picture of yourself so the campfire can see what a washed up lazy [bleep] looks like that sits around posting all day long. Good God how I wish I could be a lazy little [bleep] and keep up with your post count but I actually have a real life that doesn't involve the internet 24/7

How about..............I don't keep up with you!!!

What a concept 😁😁😁




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Matt, the cartridge you should be looking at is the 7MM Mauser AI. 😜


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Originally Posted by Trystan
Originally Posted by GregW
Gosh there is an amazing amount of stupid in this thread.....

Shockingly Trithtan is part of the stupid side who repeats [bleep] he's heard on these very forums....

Laughing....



Ignorance is bliss😊

Especially considering your post matches your definition to a T

Gosh?!?!?


Trystan



Weren't there some targets or video of you shooting 2 inch groups consistently at 600 yards with your Tikka that somehow never materialized after you ran your yap too much?

Pretty sure Brad's sign line is "cartridges are more alike than different" but you thought it sounded good too....

Laughing. It's a little too obvious you are trying too hard FYI...


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Originally Posted by Trystan
Originally Posted by smokepole


And you're still way behind. Try to keep up.


With a short chubby little crybaby like you......LOL

Why don't you post a picture of yourself so the campfire can see what a washed up lazy [bleep] looks like that sits around posting all day long. Good God how I wish I could be a lazy little [bleep] and keep up with your post count but I actually have a real life that doesn't involve the internet 24/7



I don't know Trystan, first you tell me you've been following my posts, and now you're asking me to post photos of myself??

I sense a bit of an obsession here and it's making me uncomfortable (#metoo!!). And I hate to disappoint you but I'm neither short nor chubby.

I think maybe you should follow someone else's posts for a while, can't we just be friends?



A wise man is frequently humbled.

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Originally Posted by 16bore

Run the 277 140 NAB vs the 280AI 160 AB and see what all the fuss is....


I did just for fun, only ran it to 600 yards though. I picked 600 yards because that is going to be beyond the range that the majority of game will be taken by most hunters. Honestly, I knew the .280 AI was going to win.

.270 Win 140 grain Accubond MV 3018 FPS per Nosler data.
JBM Ballistic Data set at 4000 ft elevation, 40 degree temp.

MPBR 370 yds 1788 ft-lbs energy.
600 yds, -11.1 MOA drop, 3.6 MOA wind, 2051 FPS, 1308 ft-lbs energy.

.280 AI 160 grain Accubond MV 3045 FPS per Nosler Data.
JBM Ballistic Data set at 4000 ft elevation, 40 degree temp.

MPBR 375 yds 2137 ft-lbs energy.
600 yds, -10.6 MOA drop, 3.3 MOA wind, 2130 FPS, 1612 ft-lbs energy.

.280 AI MPBR +5 yds, +349 ft-lbs energy.
.280 AI @ 600 yds, +0.5 MOA drop (3.141"), -0.3 MOA wind (1.8846"), +79 FPS, +304 ft-lbs energy (not +204 as I previously posted).

While the .280 AI wins on paper, I can't hold less than 2" of wind at 600 yards and I'm pretty sure what ever I hit at that range can't tell the difference of 204 ft-lbs energy. While I said I wanted a 1:8 twist .270, there isn't anything I couldn't do with the standard 1:10 twist.

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Originally Posted by Trystan

...
... Then there's the argument that the 280 has 175 grain bullets but the argument doesn't hold much water with me because when I think about 175 grain bullets the 7 mag is the logical answer.

In comparing the 270 130 tsx to a 280 150 tsx I would take a 130 pushed at 3150 over a 150 pushed at 3000 every day of the week and so would most hunters who understand how Barnes bullets works.
...
Concerning long range hunting IMO the 7mm bullets are stuck in a rut! There big enough for deer but fail in comparison to 30 cal bullets when hunting elk sized game. The 6.5s have deer covered by a mile with far less recoil and are more efficient. A 300 win mag is a better caliber for elk than a 280AI
...
Trystan


Never found a need for heavier than 160's in my 7mm Mag. Hunted elk with it exclusively for 20+ years, have taken more elk with it than all other cartridges combined and never found it wanting. Last elk I took was with my buddy's 7mm RM at 411 yards, 4 steps and down. If the bullets are “stuck in a rut” I never noticed.

Run the ballistics on a 130g TTSX (B.C. .392) @ 3135fps vs a 150g TTSX (B.C. .450) @ 3001 fps and tell us gain which one you would choose. Using Federals ballistic calculator (see their web page) and all defaults unrelated to the specific bullets, at 500 yards the .280 has higher velocity, more energy and 2” less wind drift with only 2.3” more drop.

When it comes to long range B.C.s, the 129g .277” LRX comes in at .463, the .284” 145g @ .486 and the 168g @ .550. The heaviest .30 caliber LRX is 200g and comes in at .546. The winner is the .284” range.

Like Nosler LRAB bullets? The only .277” is the 150g with a B.C. of .591. Compare that to the.284” 168g @ .616 or the 175g @ .648. Inn 30 you have to go to 210g to beat the .284” 175g bullet.

Berger bullets? Neither the .277” or .308’ can match the .284” for highest B.C. values.

Hornady ELD-X bullets? Same story.

Not knocking the 300WM as an elk cartridge – mine has worked just fine but no better than my 7mm RM. Will probably be taking it again this year. The .284” bullets are stuck in a rut when it comes to high B.C. bullet selection? Hadn’t noticed.




Last edited by Coyote_Hunter; 08/20/18.

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No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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Originally Posted by taylorce1
Originally Posted by 16bore

Run the 277 140 NAB vs the 280AI 160 AB and see what all the fuss is....


I did just for fun, only ran it to 600 yards though. I picked 600 yards because that is going to be beyond the range that the majority of game will be taken by most hunters. Honestly, I knew the .280 AI was going to win.

.270 Win 140 grain Accubond MV 3018 FPS per Nosler data.
JBM Ballistic Data set at 4000 ft elevation, 40 degree temp.

MPBR 370 yds 1788 ft-lbs energy.
600 yds, -11.1 MOA drop, 3.6 MOA wind, 2051 FPS, 1308 ft-lbs energy.

.280 AI 160 grain Accubond MV 3045 FPS per Nosler Data.
JBM Ballistic Data set at 4000 ft elevation, 40 degree temp.

MPBR 375 yds 2137 ft-lbs energy.
600 yds, -10.6 MOA drop, 3.3 MOA wind, 2130 FPS, 1612 ft-lbs energy.

.280 AI MPBR +5 yds, +349 ft-lbs energy.
.280 AI @ 600 yds, +0.5 MOA drop (3.141"), -0.3 MOA wind (1.8846"), +79 FPS, +204 ft-lbs energy.

While the .280 AI wins on paper, I can't hold less than 2" of wind at 600 yards and I'm pretty sure what ever I hit at that range can't tell the difference of 204 ft-lbs energy. While I said I wanted a 1:8 twist .270, there isn't anything I couldn't do with the standard 1:10 twist.


That's a cool post Taylor. My little brother is going on his first elk with me this Fall. He's got a little Ruger 270 Winchester and just started loading his own ammo this year. Being his looney big brother I told him to buy some H4831SC and give the new 140 Tipped TBBC's a try. Well, he did a little bit of basic load work and started punch decent groups at a 100 yards under an 1".. Well, Saturday we had a chance to shoot at 250 yards and he proceeded to shoot three groups of 3 at 250 with not one of them going over 2". Plus he has one of the fixed 6X's on the rifle. He asked me if I'd hunt with that and I gave him a resounding "Hell YES".. That was shooting out of the back of the truck over my MR pack. I put the Magnetospeed on the muzzle just to get an idea of speed and it ran 2910 for a 3 shot average.. I told him that I'd hunt nearly anything with that combo. Maybe not a LR sorta set up, it'll crush anything out to 400 and that is still a fairly long shot for me in the field.

He still wants a 7mm or 300 magnum, just cause he is like the rest of us and wants it, but after a fairly decent amount of elk and deer, I don't know of too much that'll change the outcome of most of our hunting scenarios even with a little more speed or bullet weight.

Good luck, can't wait to get it out in the field.. Looking forward to posting a picture or two of the lad with his first elk and his 270...


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Originally Posted by smokepole
Originally Posted by Trystan
Originally Posted by smokepole


And you're still way behind. Try to keep up.


With a short chubby little crybaby like you......LOL

Why don't you post a picture of yourself so the campfire can see what a washed up lazy [bleep] looks like that sits around posting all day long. Good God how I wish I could be a lazy little [bleep] and keep up with your post count but I actually have a real life that doesn't involve the internet 24/7



I don't know Trystan, first you tell me you've been following my posts, and now you're asking me to post photos of myself??

I sense a bit of an obsession here and it's making me uncomfortable (#metoo!!). And I hate to disappoint you but I'm neither short nor chubby.

I think maybe you should follow someone else's posts for a while, can't we just be friends?



Sure, we can be friends! Here's some friendly advice.......get outside and stop posting 16 hours a day on an internet forum. Guns and Hunting are a great part of life but there's a world of other interesting things to do. Id recommend horseback riding into a number of different wilderness areas and camping at a high mountain lake. Bring a fishing pole and grub you can cook over a campfire. Who knows.......since were friends now maybe I'll take you sometime. We can sit around a real campfire and discuss how much smarter you are than everyone else.

Best wishes pard





Trystan


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Originally Posted by GregW
Originally Posted by Trystan
Originally Posted by GregW
Gosh there is an amazing amount of stupid in this thread.....

Shockingly Trithtan is part of the stupid side who repeats [bleep] he's heard on these very forums....

Laughing....



Ignorance is bliss😊

Especially considering your post matches your definition to a T

Gosh?!?!?


Trystan



Weren't there some targets or video of you shooting 2 inch groups consistently at 600 yards with your Tikka that somehow never materialized after you ran your yap too much?

Pretty sure Brad's sign line is "cartridges are more alike than different" but you thought it sounded good too....

Laughing. It's a little too obvious you are trying too hard FYI...



Do you always whine this much first thing in the morning?!?!? 😁😁😁

Relaxs Greg.....everything is going to be Ok





Trystan

Last edited by Trystan; 08/20/18.

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Originally Posted by beretzs
That's a cool post Taylor. My little brother is going on his first elk with me this Fall. He's got a little Ruger 270 Winchester and just started loading his own ammo this year. Being his looney big brother I told him to buy some H4831SC and give the new 140 Tipped TBBC's a try. Well, he did a little bit of basic load work and started punch decent groups at a 100 yards under an 1".. Well, Saturday we had a chance to shoot at 250 yards and he proceeded to shoot three groups of 3 at 250 with not one of them going over 2". Plus he has one of the fixed 6X's on the rifle. He asked me if I'd hunt with that and I gave him a resounding "Hell YES".. That was shooting out of the back of the truck over my MR pack. I put the Magnetospeed on the muzzle just to get an idea of speed and it ran 2910 for a 3 shot average.. I told him that I'd hunt nearly anything with that combo. Maybe not a LR sorta set up, it'll crush anything out to 400 and that is still a fairly long shot for me in the field.

He still wants a 7mm or 300 magnum, just cause he is like the rest of us and wants it, but after a fairly decent amount of elk and deer, I don't know of too much that'll change the outcome of most of our hunting scenarios even with a little more speed or bullet weight.

Good luck, can't wait to get it out in the field.. Looking forward to posting a picture or two of the lad with his first elk and his 270...


Tell him to stick with the .270 Win and buy a .375 H&H or Ruger. Then he can save all that money for hunting the world, and not to worry chasing the holy grail rifle. Worst thing in the world you could do to him is get him started reloading, those damn manuals got me chasing the perfect cartridge and playing with a few wildcats. I went to the 6.5X55, 6.5-06, 7-08, .280 Rem, .280 GNR, and 7mm Rem Mag looking for a better mouse trap than the .270. I still have the .270 in a couple rifles and not one single 6.5 or 7mm left in my safe.

I hope your brother lets the air out of a big one this fall!

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Originally Posted by beretzs

That's a cool post Taylor. My little brother is going on his first elk with me this Fall. He's got a little Ruger 270 Winchester and just started loading his own ammo this year. Being his looney big brother I told him to buy some H4831SC and give the new 140 Tipped TBBC's a try. Well, he did a little bit of basic load work and started punch decent groups at a 100 yards under an 1".. Well, Saturday we had a chance to shoot at 250 yards and he proceeded to shoot three groups of 3 at 250 with not one of them going over 2". Plus he has one of the fixed 6X's on the rifle. He asked me if I'd hunt with that and I gave him a resounding "Hell YES".. That was shooting out of the back of the truck over my MR pack. I put the Magnetospeed on the muzzle just to get an idea of speed and it ran 2910 for a 3 shot average.. I told him that I'd hunt nearly anything with that combo. Maybe not a LR sorta set up, it'll crush anything out to 400 and that is still a fairly long shot for me in the field.

He still wants a 7mm or 300 magnum, just cause he is like the rest of us and wants it, but after a fairly decent amount of elk and deer, I don't know of too much that'll change the outcome of most of our hunting scenarios even with a little more speed or bullet weight.

Good luck, can't wait to get it out in the field.. Looking forward to posting a picture or two of the lad with his first elk and his 270...


Your little brother is good to go for elk. But you already knew that. smile


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Originally Posted by lawnchair_hunter

g) for my comparisons, the 280 ai had significantly more power at 500 yards than 270wsm.


You lost me on this one, what is significantly more power and what was the bullet and MV that you were comparing?

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Originally Posted by Trystan
Here's some friendly advice.......get outside and stop posting 16 hours a day on an internet forum. Guns and Hunting are a great part of life but there's a world of other interesting things to do. Id recommend horseback riding into a number of different wilderness areas and camping at a high mountain lake. Bring a fishing pole and grub you can cook over a campfire. Who knows.......since were friends now maybe I'll take you sometime. We can sit around a real campfire and discuss how much smarter you are than everyone else.

Best wishes pard

Trystan


Great advice Trystan!! But I can't "Stop posting 16 hours a day" because I've never done it. Responding to your drivel took up about ten minutes if that. Yesterday I took the dog to the lake for his swim, loaded up my backpack with a good load and did a hike, and spent most of the day sorting through and packing my gear for a backpack elk hunt that I'll do in early September.

That'll be a solo hunt in a wilderness area, where are you hunting elk this year???



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