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I think right now he just wants to get thru this midterm and then the gloves can come off. IMO. Dave

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Originally Posted by RickyD
I don't get scared either, I get ready, and I am.

I do disagree with you, so tell me, what is the political solution for the dems usurping the Presidents control over the alpha depts and those departments agreeing to be told what to do by demoncraps from Congress and ignoring the President?


He can order all those Department Heads to come to his office and once there, he can fire them face to face.

Now..... what’s holding him back?

He’s the original “ you’re fired “ guy isn’t he?


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Good point, but I bet he'll have to fire until he gets to interns before he'll find someone that will do it. Deep State, you know.


We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?

Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
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Not a word of this on the evening news.


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Originally Posted by curdog4570


If Civil Law breaks down,.


When the DOJ purposefully defies a lawful congressional order to release documents, hasn't civil law broken down? When agency executives puposefully defy a president's orders to release documents, hasn't civil law broken down? If not, what does it take to move your meter into the "civil law has broken down" range?

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I had a conversation yesterday with a friend of mine who happens to work for a governmental three letter law-enforcement agency. We were discussing this very topic which we had both read about online, so I bluntly asked him, "The President of the United States orders the FBI to release the documents, can they refuse?"

His answer?

Absolutely not. He said there are checks and balances in the federal government, but none that apply to that particular order. He said that [whomever] in the FBI is willfully disregarding his orders to release the information is blatantly insubordinate, and is subject to immediate termination without recourse. He said, in that particular case, the order goes from the President, to AG Sessions, to AAG Rosenstein, then on down the food chain.
Someone's going to be fired.

So this should get interesting..

Last edited by J23; 09/20/18.

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Hillary and later Al Gore quipped about the topic asking "who's the controlling authority?" Just what is the down side? Who is there to punish the agencies for ignoring presidential or congressional orders? Congress is culpable in this as they have abdicated their authority in order to avoid any flack from the people allowing these agencies to govern and tax at will. they can just shrug their shoulders and say hey it's not our fault.

We allow this crap by continuing to vote the miscreants back into office time and again so they can continue to get rich and ignore the oath they all took.

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Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
Originally Posted by curdog4570


If Civil Law breaks down,.
m

When the DOJ purposefully defies a lawful congressional order to release documents, hasn't civil law broken down? When agency executives puposefully defy a president's orders to release documents, hasn't civil law broken down? If not, what does it take to move your meter into the "civil law has broken down" range?


If Trump fires the Agency Heads and they refuse to vacate their offices AND he can’t get the Secret Service to remove them forcibly, then Civil Law will have broken down.

All we have right now is a POTUS who chooses not to exercise his authority..... which is probably a wise course of action. I just wish he would stop playing the victim card on Twitter.


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Hanging on with everything they have got until November. Hopefully the Republicans can hold on or gain a couple seats.


A true sportsman counts his achievements in proportion to the effort involved and fairness of the sport. - S. Pope
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Gene,

With the shambles the DOJ and intelligence agencies are in, as well as the sanctuary cities/states only following what laws they want to follow, and the selective prosecution of some, and obvious non prosecution of others, the Constitution, and rule of law our country is founded and based on is in crisis.

When people pick and choose which laws they follow, who draws the line on which laws are followed and enforced?

That's the problem. It affects all of us.


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Am I the only one that thinks the way things are being played out now look worse for the Democrats than the Republicans? If Trump started firing people wholesale prior to November I think there is a pretty good chance that Democrat turnout would be way up from normal. Right now all of the law and order types and those who take their oath to the Constitution are mad.

I think it is bad news for the Democrats the more they openly defy him. The only Democrats it fires up are the hardcore progressive and such. More moderate Democrats will not like the way it looks. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see more Democrats going Independent.

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Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Brennan on CNN siding with the gang of 8, and telling the intelligence agencies NOT to release the papers.

Big surprise there... wink



So now Rosey has defied a presidental legal order and his firing is justified.

Who will pull the trigger, Trump or Sessions.



You and I both know that answer..................Sessions.

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Lil' Jeff is a Swamp Critter and Trump should have never listened to the advisor that recommended him. I had a bad feeling about him when he went weak and recused himself.

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Originally Posted by K22
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Brennan on CNN siding with the gang of 8, and telling the intelligence agencies NOT to release the papers.

Big surprise there... wink



So now Rosey has defied a presidental legal order and his firing is justified.

Who will pull the trigger, Trump or Sessions.



You and I both know that answer..................Sessions.



BS.

He's not made any kind of showing yet. At all.

You guys are getting fed BS in a dark room.

I don't know how clear it needs to be made for you. It's a case of "Are you gonna believe me, or your lyin' eyes?"

For sure, my eyes aren't lyin'. He has done nothing. Nothing. He has sat idle while Rome burns.


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Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Originally Posted by K22
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Brennan on CNN siding with the gang of 8, and telling the intelligence agencies NOT to release the papers.

Big surprise there... wink



So now Rosey has defied a presidental legal order and his firing is justified.

Who will pull the trigger, Trump or Sessions.



You and I both know that answer..................Sessions.



BS.

He's not made any kind of showing yet. At all.

You guys are getting fed BS in a dark room.

I don't know how clear it needs to be made for you. It's a case of "Are you gonna believe me, or your lyin' eyes?"

For sure, my eyes aren't lyin'. He has done nothing. Nothing. He has sat idle while Rome burns.



And exactly how do you know he has done nothing???

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Originally Posted by K22
And exactly how do you know he has done nothing???


Because I see what he hasn't done.


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Are you sure you are not being shown what has been done?

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Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Gene,

With the shambles the DOJ and intelligence agencies are in, as well as the sanctuary cities/states only following what laws they want to follow, and the selective prosecution of some, and obvious non prosecution of others, the Constitution, and rule of law our country is founded and based on is in crisis.

When people pick and choose which laws they follow, who draws the line on which laws are followed and enforced?

That's the problem. It affects all of us.


Barry, I’ve never said it wasn’t a problem. Of course it is and it’s a problem for all of us.

Rather than focus on the problem, I’ve learned to seek out what, or who, is preventing a solution. In this instance, it is US, the whole of the citizenry, who is preventing a solution.

About half of US elected a POTUS who promised to solve the problem of “ Rule by Bureaucrat”....... some even expected him to do it. The other half is not a monolithic bloc, they are made up of disparate groups, some of which would like to see the Swamp drained, but not ALL of the Swamp.

Reagan fired the Air Traffic Controllers, using the authority of the Presidency, and the country survived, but that is one small segment of the Federal Bureaucracy . I think Trump is smart enough to see that firing Agency Heads would not solve the problem. He would have to wipe out the whole organizational chart for all the alphabet agencies. The result would be chaos on a grand scale.

The R establishment is not going to allow him to solve his immediate problem by firing Sessions, Rosenstein, and Wray if they don’t promptly declassify the documents. They see it as a wedge issue working in their favor for the mid terms.

Those who keep talking about the Constitution and the finer points of Constitutional Law are missing the point....... it is a political problem and will only respond to a political solution.

The political will is not there yet. It will take a mid term landslide for the R side for that political will to emerge.

If the Republicans gain in the Senate and hold the house, and IF Trump were content with one term, he could bring about some big changes in the Bureaucracy over the next two years.

You can’t make sweeping changes that will be unpopular with half your constituency if your reelection is a consideration.


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