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#13260016 11/06/18
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Reba Offline OP
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I have a friend that really wants a 16 ga, but can not afford a Sweet 16.

He would settle for an O/U or semi auto.

Any suggestions?


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About a decade ago Remington made some 16 ga. 870 express shotguns. When Remington discontinued them the local Gander Mountain discounted the ones they had to get rid of them. I picked one up new for $170. Try looking for one of these, but beware. My came with a modified choke tube, and I was able to find a full, but never have found and I/C.


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The new Sweet 16 is somewhat affordable. Has he looked at them? There's a new Franchi o/u on the market this fall as well.


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I would tell him to save another year and get the real deal. Nothing else compares.


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Which "Sweet 16" are you talking about? The original John Browning design or the new abomination under that name? If the former then there aren't many options as the old A-5s tend to run $450-$800 depending on condition, features, and seller. The "new" A-5 is not something I am interested in and have had only a very cursory look at. The only other semi-autos I am familiar with are the Remington Model 11 (a version of the A-5), the Remington 1100, and the Winchester 1400. Other than maybe the 1100 they should run less than a comparable A-5. The Winchester and 1100 were built on 12 ga frames so would be roughly the weight of a 12 ga and the M-11 is virtually indistinguishable from the A-5.

There are mighty few 16 ga O/Us and I can't think of an O/U I would recommend that regularly falls in that price range. I have a Citori that I picked up back in 1987 and there have been a dearth of options other than that. Baikal had one I believe but they were pretty rough. Huglu/CZ might have also had one but I'm not sure. One might find one of these on the used rack but I don't think much of them.

Your buddy's options are pretty limited in 16 ga and are even more limited if restricted to just semiautos and O/Us.

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Not much new out there on a small frame. Unless you spend big bucks. Maybe an older 870 or Ithaca 37 ? The Cz Bobwhite looks ok. I have a Rem Model 11 , 870, and a Nice Spanish made Noble SxS.

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Originally Posted by woodmaster81
Which "Sweet 16" are you talking about? The original John Browning design or the new abomination under that name? If the former then there aren't many options as the old A-5s tend to run $450-$800 depending on condition, features, and seller. The "new" A-5 is not something I am interested in and have had only a very cursory look at. The only other semi-autos I am familiar with are the Remington Model 11 (a version of the A-5), the Remington 1100, and the Winchester 1400. Other than maybe the 1100 they should run less than a comparable A-5. The Winchester and 1100 were built on 12 ga frames so would be roughly the weight of a 12 ga and the M-11 is virtually indistinguishable from the A-5.

There are mighty few 16 ga O/Us and I can't think of an O/U I would recommend that regularly falls in that price range. I have a Citori that I picked up back in 1987 and there have been a dearth of options other than that. Baikal had one I believe but they were pretty rough. Huglu/CZ might have also had one but I'm not sure. One might find one of these on the used rack but I don't think much of them.

Your buddy's options are pretty limited in 16 ga and are even more limited if restricted to just semiautos and O/Us.



Belgium Sweet 16. Vent Rib, Modified. When you find one under $1,000 please let me know

Thanks


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The new sweet 16 = 1,499 MSRP.

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Not an O/U or semi, but I am a big fan of the Winchester Model 12 in 16 gauge. A 28" modified flat fore end variation is as good of an upland shotgun as you will find in my opinion. Well made, light weight and great handling with no noticeable difference in range compared to a 12 gauge. Also, m12s pattern really well with modern shotshells and are cost effective.

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Originally Posted by DesertMuleDeer
Not an O/U or semi, but I am a big fan of the Winchester Model 12 in 16 gauge. A 28" modified flat fore end variation is as good of an upland shotgun as you will find in my opinion. Well made, light weight and great handling with no noticeable difference in range compared to a 12 gauge. Also, m12s pattern really well with modern shotshells and are cost effective.


Find one with a solid rib and you will be set for anything. I had one in the late seventies and only sold it to pay bills after a car wreck. The 16ga. model 12's and other vintage pumps are almost as light as a 20 but hit like a 12. When you go back to a 12 after a 16 the gun and shells seem bloated ...

Last edited by 30Gibbs; 11/07/18.
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You might check out the Remington 11-48. They're the streamlined receiver recoil operated semi auto. They don't seem to get the love from collectors that the Sweet 16 does. I bet you can find one for around $300.


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If they made the Model 12 16Ga again today, there wouldn't be enough knowledgeable re shotguns to keep it in production. They would rather buy some Turkish trash because it would be an O/U or SxS.

Last edited by battue; 11/07/18.

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When I was 12 or 13 I begged my folks for a model 12 16 ga. with a 28 " mod. barrel for Christmas.. Needless to say it did not happen.. In a few years I bought a 12ga.. I have often thought if I would have received the 16, if I would have followed the 12 ga. trail... Never really owned a 16 ga.. I had a 16 in a m.12 with a solid rib on lay away at Cabelas... Then decided I didn't want to enter into another shotgun gauge so late in life and I let it go.. Probably a big mistake.. But if I had a love for the 16 I would certainly be looking for an old model 12...


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I see 16’s here and there. About as common as a box of 16 ga shells laugh

I picked up a nice little Spanish SxS in 16 just this year. A Model 12 would be sweet. Almost as sweet as an A5!


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Originally Posted by Reba

Belgium Sweet 16. Vent Rib, Modified. When you find one under $1,000 please let me know

Thanks



If you are in the Central Coast region of California it isn't surprising that you find prices higher than most of the rest of the country. The Internet gun sites are not much better though one can find some decent deals on the auction house sites.

You could try any smaller gun shop or gun show in MN, IA, western WI, or probably the Dakotas and probably find something that meets your description for under $1000. They don't grow on trees but they are not as rare as hen's teeth either. When I was "collecting" A-5s I bought most of my better condition guns out of Arizona. Prices were a lot more reasonable than here as there was a lot less demand for shotguns there. All the retiree's probably helped as it brought guns there where there was less demand.

I was just at a Cabela's last night and saw a 16 ga A-5 for $650. It had a solid rib rather than ventilated, Full choke rather than Mod, and may not have been a Sweet 16 (I didn't take it down to look for the differences) but for the price one could have the choke reamed out and be well under $1000. For a max of 8 oz, I do not think the price premium asked between the standard and Sweet 16 is worth it, especially when one could get within a few ounces with some alterations.

If one is looking for a shooter and not a "collectible" then picking up a plain barrel A-5 with a Poly-Choke and having it threaded for choke tubes and adding a vent rib should get one a gun under $1000. One probably could get the whole works reblued and still be under that mark with some shopping around. Refinishing the wood would bring things over a grand unless one did the work themselves. This is just a suggestion to provoke thought in other possibilities. Sometimes function/appearance trumps originality.

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With a single barrel, a VR may have some application on a Waterfowl gun, but on a field shotgun VR's are highly overrated. Essentially being more metal to carry around. But they usually look nice.


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Originally Posted by Reba
I have a friend that really wants a 16 ga, but can not afford a Sweet 16.

He would settle for an O/U or semi auto.

Any suggestions?


Speaking of Model 12 16ga's. Solid seller from the fire. Price is a little high, but he said "Let's get this sold." Then again it sounds clean enough to warrant extra. And when it comes to Model 12 16's, the only thing that out handles a 28inch is a 26inch being as there is about 6 inches of receiver sighting plane. I already have two or it probably wouldn't still be here.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...inchester-m-12-16-gauge-mod#Post13254607

Last edited by battue; 11/08/18.

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Then again if one can put off instant gratification and really wants a SxS, and be willing to save up awhile. This would be a great one. There was one local awhile back for $3800. A lifetime shotgun and not something one will likely grow tired of and trade off for something else they will tire of.

https://www.shootinguk.co.uk/reviews/shotgun/beretta-486-parallelo


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My Dickinson 16 SxS has become my most used shotgun. No, it doesn't match my Beretta O/U for quality, but it ain't junk either. Not all Turk guns are the same, there are several makers building guns to importers specs. You get whatever the importer asked for.

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Dickinson is a nice shotgun as was the Kimber Turkish made true sidekick SxS. The kimber is no long made and you can hardly give them away. Unless Dickinson takes off, you will have the same issue. And as of yet they haven’t. Then perhaps there becomes a parts issue down the line.

Beretta has been around for 480 years and it doesn’t look like the are going away soon along with having a repair facility in the USA. Spend your money and take your chances. As of now, it’s not a fair bet, Berrtta vs Dickinson.


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