Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles AR pistol vs rifle

I see short barreled AR pistols with a stubby stock. Do those stocks stretch out or do you shoot them stubby version?

They look interesting. I'm looking for a 300 BLK with suppressor. A short gun would be handier than a long one with a suppressor.

Educate me.

DF

Its not a stock its an arm brace, having a stock would make it an SBR.

^ that. "Arm Brace", not stock.

Some of the newest arm braces are field-adjustable for length (to fit different length arms of course), but most are a more "set it and leave it" adjustment type. Shockwave 2 and SB3A are a couple that come to mind with quick adjustments.

On my SBR I tend to keep the stock collapsed shorter, which is nice with heavy clothing or just for fast handling. Being a regular stock though, it's quickly adjustable for whatever length I want.

A short 300 Blk AR with a short LOP stock or arm brace is a really handy little tool. Even more handy with some sort of QD suppressor mount. My son and I both hunted with short ARs this fall (one 300 Blk pistol and one 6.5 Grendel SBR), and I really like them in the woods. They are light weight and handy, and the small size is really nice when you get into thick brush or in a tight stand or blind.

I guess there must be some limit on "adjustable" lest it become a stock and a SBR...

Any regulations on that?

Or asked another way. How far can an arm brace be stretched?

DF

DF buy a new unused lower like a spikes never assembled before into anything, buy a decent LPK I buy DD and throw out the trigger put in an SSa-e, buy an SBA3 pistol brace, then buy or build your upper.

The determining factor is not adjustability it’s suitability as an arm brace.

Google “ar15 arm brace” and after reading the words, click on images, and it should be come more clear.

If you buy it and it’s labeled “arm brace” then you’re good to go, as long as the lower you build on either is a new build, or came from an AR pistol.

I read somewhere that the brace cannot exceed 13" LOP, or it would be considered a stock, per the BATF.

The SBA3 fully extended has a LOP of about 12.5"

Have not tried that Brace just watched the video on it seems pretty slick.

I have been using a Maxim CQB Pistol Brace and love it. It is pricey so if your looking to build cheap its not your huckleberry! However it is Stout, Rugged, Durable, and Reliable.

Why do you need to use a new lower?
I can't use one of the lowers I've built into a rifle in the past and repurpose it?

IIRC, that's a specific stipulation in the ordinance.

DF

Not according to BATFE. I’ll find the citation and post it, but a receiver (read AR lower) that has been built into a rifle first is always a rifle. If it was a pistol first, then t remains a pistol lower forever.

Think of the XP-100 and model 7. Same exact receiver.

You can build a rifle on an XP-100 receiver and it’s no problem.

Build a pistol in your M7 receiver and you have to either register it as a short barreled rifle, or live as a felon.

Not my dumb rule. Just reporting on how BATFE interprets the law.

Of course, if only you know it was ever a rifle, it’s a wash.

It’s not illegal to have rifle parts around when all you have is a pistol. If all you have is a rifle and you have a pistol upper, it’s a technical foul.

This is why you should never buy an AR rifle if you ever think you’ll want to build it into a pistol. It’s also why you should have a stripped lower laying around waiting for a pistol build.

Lower Transferred as a rifle must stay a Rifle

Lower Transferred as Other starts as Pistol can be pistol or Rifle

That is is my basic understanding of it. I am sure someone else will be able to give more info on it.

David Walter I believe and I maybe wrong here but the SBR has to stay SBR forever. The Pistol lower can be used as rifle lower.But as we both said a Rifle lower stays a rifle lower.

I’m not sure, but think it can be built back into a rifle.

However, after having it engraved as an SBR, and paying the tax, why would anyone do that?

Not saying anyone would want to. Just saying that's how I believe it is written. I could be wrong.

Yep. It's the best alternative to going the SBR route and without all the baggage.


AR15 10.5 by .com/photos/wareagle700/]X Ring, on [bleep]

An SBR can go back to being a regular rifle if you notify the ATF (but why?).

The rest of what you said is correct.


Either pistol or SBR, there are good reasons to do both, just depends what you're willing to do. I've got both, and really appreciate being able to use a good legit stock on my SBR, but the pistol version is easier to travel with. Of course, I can swap uppers and lowers around so any of my uppers can be either pistols or SBRs. It's good to have options, and the SBR paperwork isn't that big of a deal.

Exactly.
How it's listed on the 4473 is key.

wareagle, very nice looking rig. Question: Have you considered putting a Laws Tactical folding stock adapter on it? Just curious.

Thanks.

I've seen them before, and a friend has one, but never really thought I needed one.

I tried the Laws Tactical folding stock adapter, and for the money, didn't like it.

If you're going to fold, just buy a SIG or an AK variant.

Just my two cents.

Thanks, fellas. They are kinda pricey.

I've handled them. They are solid.

I asked my dealer how he does it.

He said the paperwork will say "lower receiver, multi caliber".

This was concerning the Anderson receivers that I purchased from him.

This is the SBA3 brace, fully extended. About 12.5" LOP.

Nice.

He didn't answer the right question. He told you the receiver's description, but there is a different spot on the form where the choices are Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, or Other. A lower receiver by itself should be transferred as "Other".

I use one on my 300 Blk pistol, and like it. They are expensive, no doubt, but are still the best option for a folding AR. For me, it's the difference between carrying it in a gun case and in an ordinary backpack. When I want to be discreet (travelling) or carry it on my motorcycle, the folder is well worth the cost. If I'm just shooting or walking around the woods, it never gets folded.

I think I've posted pics of it here before, but here's another. This one is a 9" 300 Blk, but my scoped 12.5" Grendel upper on this lower fits in the same pack. A 600+ yard capable firearm that fits in a backpack is interesting to me...

It must be other then.

He said these lowers are not classified as rifle or pistol on his forms.

That IS interesting.

Do you have any pics of just the rifle?

There is some misinformation being passed here.....







That is not true. It is how the weapon is first configured. If you by a lower, assembled or not, and it is first configured as a pistol, it is legally a pistol and can be changed to a rifle and back without issues regardless of what was put on the form.

The lower can be registered as a rifle, pistol, other. Doesn’t matter.

This is how ATF answered this exact question.

Scroll down to page #2.

https://www.typicalshooter.com/atf-putting-a-stock-on-an-ar-15-lower-does-not-make-it-a-rifle/

Assuming you mean the 600+ yard capable setup - don't have a pic of that upper on that lower, but it's this scoped upper (first pic, normally without the light) on the folding pistol lower (second and third pics). Usually I keep the arm brace on the pistol lower set a bit shorter than shown in the pic. Yes, I do like Krylon on some of my rifles.

Hope that helps

12.5" SBR


9" pistol, straight and folded

You like over there between the druggies in Seattle and the Hippies in Bellingham.

Its prudent to have backpack rifle/pistol.

As a side note - both of those guns pictured above killed whitetail over Thanksgiving break. (hunting down south, not in WA) They worked really well for that.

Yondering, what is the length of the 9 inch BO when folded? Does the folding part make the pistol brace longer than 12.5 inches on something like an SBA3? I like the BO in a pistol and have killed deer with it.

Outstanding!

Very cool setup! If you're going with a pistol, that seems like a great option. Any concerns with reliability and what buffer/spring would you use with something like that?

That one is 19" folded, including the flash hider.

The LAW folder is basically a folding spacer between the receiver and buffer tube, so it makes the buffer tube stick out farther, but a pistol brace like I'm using or the SBA3 are adjustable, just slide it on the tube to whatever position you want. The folded section of mine is about 8.5" right now, but can be shorter or longer. If you were using a fixed stock, the LAW folder would make LOP a bit longer.

Nebraska - no reliability issues, it runs great. I'm using a standard carbine spring and buffer.

Thanks I just wondered with the folding piece if it was 13.5 and reclassified as a “stock”.

Thanks for the info guys.