Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters "Cheap" binoculars

The older gold ring Leupold binoculars with the individual eye adjustments have been and still are my favorite. I am in no way any kind of expert on binoculars such as John is and I sure enjoyed his post. Thank you John. I do have a question you may know the answer to. Recently I bought a pair of Burris 8X32 Signature Series from a Fire member. I really like these binoculars and wondered if these were actually made by Pentax and have you ever tried a pair?
Thanks

IMHO, as far as an overall package, the Meostar HD is hard to beat......exceptional build quality, superb glass, great company/warranty backing it up. You'll tear up a Swaro EL waaay before these things fall apart. As far as pure optics, the Tract Toric is very hard to beat. Great build, outstanding glass, a very smooth operator.

I don't know about newer brands, but definitely give the Meopta Meostar HD a serious look.

K22,

The new Burris Signature HD binoculars are made by Kamakura Optical, a very good Japanese factory. I have an 8x42 and am very impressed, both with the optics and light weight. made possible with modern synthetics.

In general, most Asian optics sellers such as Pentax do not "make" anything themselves. Instead they contract with actual manufacturers like Kamakura Optical and Light Optical, both Japanase, or plants in other Asian countries, whether China or elsewhere. That's also true of many other optics sellers around the world, including Bushnell. In fact, that's how Bushnell got started: Dave Bushnell went to Japan and contracted with Light Optical to make riflescopes resembling the then American-made Weavers.

JG, one hard secret to budget glass is get the lower power bino rather than the high power glass. Low power binos don't magnify glass impurity and often is difficult to see much difference over higher powered binos costing 10 times as much. It's the reason the 6 power yosimites work so well. The poor fella that had so much trouble with the budget binos absolutely insisted on high magnification which totally screwed him from the start!

I realize you likely understand this concept very well and so does JB but it wasn't mentioned in the MDs writeup. Since it is a key factor to getting a budget bino that works well I feel it's worth mentioning.

Trystan

On a mostly related note, how do these companies that are contracting out manufacturing do development and testing? I understand these manufacturing plants can make whatever you spec, but how do the companies come up with their spec, do testing, engineering? Do they have facilities for testing and design work or are they badging designs the manufacturer already offers?

I believe the Zeiss Conquest HD bino is made by Kamakura.

JG and mathman, thanks for the input. I'll look a little closer at the Meoptas.

There were several inferences that were directed at me that I feel were wrong:
1) I have no experience with looking through mid tier non Alpha Binoculars. I have had about 10 years of experience working with customers to get them the best binoculars that they can afford. That means I sell and recommend to customers many, many, many more Vortex Diamondbacks than Swarovski EL Fieldpros. I use a whole plethora of tests and methods to find the best binocular for each specific client. This is using index points on our binocular testing cart, the 26 meter dollar test, investigation of CA using a high powered flashlight, looking at imperfections of the glass by looking through the objectives, taking the client outside to look at nearby and distant index points in different light and weather conditions and more. Vortex Diamondbacks, Burris Signature HDs or Nikon Monarch 3s are really a very good starting point for many people looking at binoculars with a budget. However, at this price point binoculars are much more individuals and there are good ones and bad ones. Top glass like Swarovski ELs have very little variability in the manufacture and while each pair should be carefully examined they generally have few flaws or imperfections

2) Zeiss Terra EDs are not Alpha binoculars. Zeiss Terra HDs use German optical components but they do not compare to the German made Conquest HD, HT or SF binoculars. They perform about like Diamondbacks.

3) Zeiss, Leica or Swarovski will take a great deal of attention if something is not right with a brand new binocular. but other companies like Nikon or Vortex will tell us just to give the customer another pair of binoculars from our inventory. They will not go into great detail asking us what was the serial number and problems with the binocular. A lot of people will dump on Leica but you just have to talk to the right person in customer service and they will handle issues promptly and effectively.

4) You do notice the difference of the very best flagship binoculars when you are spotting animals at a great distance. Most binoculars can give you a decent idea of game animals when you are 500 to 1200 yards. But flagship alphas that are used right operate at a different level in identifying game like bears, goats and sheep from great distances 1 mile to 5 miles away. Alpha spotters are more important than Alpha binoculars but I would argue that you use your binoculars more.

5) Most assistant guides and packers that work in Alaska are not from Alaska do not have the financial capital to buy flagship binoculars. They are generally good at what they do but I would not count on the quality of an assistant guides gear on a hunt that you pay much money for. We offer a significant outfitter discount and outfitters come in and buy their assistant guides binoculars that are to be used in bulk. We see many of these same binoculars in for repairs or returned for higher quality binoculars.

6)There are fanboys and fangirls for each brand. Nobody who really gets into optics should assume that a binocular made by a particular brand is better than another binocular of another brand no matter what the brand. Your experience with binoculars is an individual thing. Some people are blessed with a resting pulse rate of under 50, extremely good eyes and great health and are able to use less expensive binoculars better than somebody with eye problems, less optimal health and a caffeine addiction. Your health makes a difference in how well you can spot animals. Its another reason to go to the gym, get your eyes checked and to practice binocular use like you do with shooting your hunting rifle and its small caliber companion. Not everything in optics is necessary a rule but more a series of guidelines. I apologize if I seem to be pedantic. I am not. I appreciate everybody who likes the outdoors and want to help them enjoy the outdoors.

7)This has been a very good thread but another thing that might be lost on folks is that if you live in the hinterlands you might have to buy up because its a terrible pain to return anything up here or out where you live. You try to buy the best and most dependable optics that you can. This is why the old 10X40 Zeiss Roof Prisms with rubber coatings and the gold ring Leupold Binoculars( that Leupold has said are too expensive for them to produce in the present )are so highly praised. They were very good and very dependable. Really good fitted boots are the most important gear item that you can have but optics are a close second.

Zeiss Conquest HD binoculars are made in Germany.

Excellent post, I agree completely. Here in Canada, guides buy their own gear, (as opposed to the outfitter buying it for them) and luckily the three Alpa companies offer us a pretty good discount. When I first started guiding back in the early 80s I used mid grade optics, but soon found out I could actually save money by buying the best. I realize not everyone uses their glass as much as a guide so for some its not worth it. I do know if you hunt in Yukon or northern BC, there is a very good chance your guide will have top shelf optics.

kabuko,

You are a real piece of work. Where did I ever say that Zeiss Terras are "alpha" glass?

The "alpha" brand binocular that did not compare well with my Chinese-built binocular was European-made.

For myself I have found like many other have said, I have to look through each pair myself. Many supposed "Alpha" bino's often don't appear to be as good as some cheaper brands. Given available money that is something I consider. The age old question, how good is good enough, given the money to be spent. I don't often use bino's when I hunt, normally in tight dense woods where 50 yards is about as long a shot that is presented. I have a pair of Minox 6.5X32IF that have served me well. Many don't like the Independent focus, but for me it is set and forget from about 20 yards to infinity. I'm sure there are better ones, but these seem good enough. If my hunting changes I would consider a better pair. I have also found that most anything over 10 power is not very practical without a tripod.

How do the "cheap" binoculars compare when it come to eye strain when used for extended periods, specifically when used with a tripod? I've been hearing a lot about how using a tripod with 10x and up can be a "game changer" when glassing and have been looking at the 15x range binoculars. Any opinions of the Nikon Monarch 5 16x56's?

Interesting thread, but I have a favor to ask. Mostly the only actual brand names mentioned here are the big three European ones while the Asian glass is referred to only by that generic name, Asian. One post mentioned Burris HD's but that's about all I've seen as far as actual brand names the glass from various factories is sold under.

So, unless it's verboten could you be more specific about exactly which brand names and hopefully specific models of Asian glass compare favorably with the best Zeiss/Swaro/Leica's? I understand the various makers with non-Asian names have many or all of their binoculars made by Asian factories but that still leaves potential buyers guessing as to exactly which ones you're talking about. I know Nikon makes some great binoculars (I've owned several of theirs) but they and Pentax are the only Japanese names I'd know of, and don't know any Chinese or Philipine brand names at all.


On a slight tangent, this is partly why I bought my Leica Trinovids back in 2000, an 8x42 and an 8x32 which have given years of great service. Had tried a bunch of different models by Burris (their old 7x35 porro from the early 90's was terrific for the price range, I'm pretty sure that was made by Pentax) and a bunch of Nikons and Swarovskis, but figured at that time that the only way to be assured of getting the absolute top of the heap at the time was to go with the prestige name.

I understand what you're saying about how the "cheap" binoculars have gotten a lot better and quite possibly have left my 18 year old Trinovids in the dust of time but without specific names and models one is still left wondering exactly which "Asian" glass to look for. If there are too many to list then even a random list of the better ones would be helpful.

Its really the big four rather than the big three when it comes to alpha binoculars. Nikon SE Edges are alpha flagship binoculars and compare to ELs, Ultravids or SFs. They are priced accordingly.

Don't know if that's addressed to my post but yes, Nikon is a brand name to recognize. I've had two of their Superior E series although that was back in the late 90's. At that time they were optically excellent binoculars but didn't have some features that were important to me as a hunter taking them out in wet weather or where they could be bumped around a lot.

But to summarize my post, what would be very helpful is to list some specific brand names and models to look for when trying to get near top dog quality without spending top dog prices.

Vortex Vipers are a good deal and a winner when you are either active or former military and buy them through GovX or Experticity. You get 35-40% off of retail prices.

Zeiss Conquest HDs sometimes go on sale for about 550.00 on Experticity.

Guides or Retail Pro Staff can get Leupolds for 50% cost on line through their prostaff program the BX4-Guide Pros are excellent binoculars for that price. Cameraland NY offers a huge number of MIC mid tier binoculars and deals in German Minox, Czech Meopta, Athlon, Pentax, Japanese Kowa and Bushnell. Doug or Neil will find you the best binocular for the dollar and I feel that they represent the best optics department in the US and probably the world. SWFA is also a good group to work with but they are not as first name person level. I have purchased stuff from the Samplelist was not disappointed.

However for most MIC, I would go to Doug.

That being said I have observed people getting amazing deals on top shelf binoculars if you ask for 10% off. Sometimes a manager or store manager will bend and it is amazing what people will do to get that kind of bump in sales when sales are slow in the off season.

I would like to see a chart ranking the different glass but this would be difficult to do. It would take a panel of several people due to eyesight variations and subjectivity and then all the models would get changed before the evaluation is complete.

The Nikons did very well on color transmission which is critical for birding. Some of even the Alpha glass will have a slight blue or other colored tinge in certain light situations.