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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040 |
Life Member SCI Life Member DSC Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 9,055
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 9,055 |
15 or so years ago one of my very good and particular clients had an issue with Hart. Kevin has virtually unlimited resources. He would order 5 or 6 rifles at a time and he'd have AT LEAST 10 barrels per gun fitted up in various flavors. Twist rates, throats lengths, neck OD's, etc. He had acquired quite the collection.
We had one that just refused to play nice. Swap the barrel and it'd settle down just fine. Put the old one back on and it would go to hell again. So, he mails it to Hart and asks them (asks, because Kevin is the kind of client a builder dreams for, always courteous, always a pro, and never once balks at a cost so long as he gets what he wants)
Well, Hart tells him to basically suck it. They were rude. [bleep] even.
Apparently, they don't pay attention to Purchase Orders. If they had, they'd of realized this guy had over 300 barrels from them. I am NOT making this up. Kevin is just "one of those guys" and he had the means to do whatever he wants.
And that is exactly what he did.
He took every one of those barrels and hauled them down to a machine shop somewhere in IL where he lives. He paid them the going rate and they cut those barrels into 1" segments on a band saw. He then crated the whole mess up and had it shipped to Hart barrels with a very plainly worded letter encouraging all of them to have intercourse with themselves.
Then he replaced a whole lot with a new company and we did it all over again.
No [bleep]. True story.
Hart barrels. They've never made a mistake. Just ask them, they'll tell you.
Caveat Emptor I love it. Not "Phug you" money, that's "Phug me" money.
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 10,121
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 10,121 |
I have a sporterized M1917 with the original barrel from the 50s that weighs nearly as much as a non-sporterized '03. Even with the barrel cut down and turned to a sporter contour, it is still heavy. It's built like a tank, but I'm not anymore. I guess they were judged by their weight back then.
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,736
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,736 |
Ken, I believe I have asked you before, but here goes. Did you have the action machined or the rings, and who did it?
BTW, that still looks beautiful.
Sean
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040 |
The action was machined for the Talleys rings. Roy Bedeaux in Los Ranchos NM. He is retired now.
Life Member SCI Life Member DSC Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,493
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,493 |
one of the things i have learned over the years is you dont need a smith that advertises and goes to all the trade shows in order to get a first rate job.....for years i couldnt understand the pricing difference thinking i was loosing something by not paying more....most of the smiths i use today arent nationally known and do as good or better than the well known guys
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,040 |
Agreed Gene270. I learned about Roy from a member here on the 'fire and went to see him and his work. To say the least I wanted him to make a rifle for me.
Life Member SCI Life Member DSC Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,739
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,739 |
My only regret is not sending a dummy cartridge with the intended bullet at a OAL that just barely fits the mag well. The throat could be more forgiving.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,932
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,932 |
Regret is not being true with yourself about how you'll use your new custom. Don't buy a heavy contoured pig and expect to lug around mountains. In the same vein, don't take a pencil thin contour to the range and expect to be produced tight shot groups over long shot strings in 90 degrees.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,817
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,817 |
My only regret is not sending a dummy cartridge with the intended bullet at a OAL that just barely fits the mag well. The throat could be more forgiving. Why not one a bit shorter than the mag well? Then you'd have room to grow as the throat erodes.
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263 |
Why not one a bit shorter than the mag well? Then you'd have room to grow as the throat erodes.
This or if in doubt throated to the shortest bullet that will be used. Worst case it could be lengthened later if needed but max mag length you have no room to grow.
"When you disarm the people, you commence to offend them and show that you distrust them either through cowardice or lack of confidence, and both of these opinions generate hatred." Niccolo Machiavelli
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,739
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,739 |
My only regret is not sending a dummy cartridge with the intended bullet at a OAL that just barely fits the mag well. The throat could be more forgiving. Why not one a bit shorter than the mag well? Then you'd have room to grow as the throat erodes. Mathman you pose a good point. I’m likely in a good spot for the long haul.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,225
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,225 |
My only regret is not sending a dummy cartridge with the intended bullet at a OAL that just barely fits the mag well. Sometimes when you do send a dummy cartridge, it isn't used anyway because the smith knows what you want better than you do.
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263 |
Sometimes when you do send a dummy cartridge, it isn't used anyway because the smith knows what you want better than you do. [/quote] I have been known to put magic marker on the dummy's and then look for land marks on the bullets when I meet with the gunsmith. Don't have to say anything but the Smith will know what your looking at.
"When you disarm the people, you commence to offend them and show that you distrust them either through cowardice or lack of confidence, and both of these opinions generate hatred." Niccolo Machiavelli
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 357
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 357 |
My only regrets have been listening to yahoos on hunting forums, whose only experience building rifles amounts to theory based upon Google searches.
Oh and 26" barrels for magnums.
It's really funny when your gun builder makes "suggestions" that actually work! After all, WTF does he know.......
e.g. Back in '04 I called up Charley Sisk and ordered a 300 Win. I wanted a 26" Krieger CM barrel because I knew better. Charley politely said he'd go ahead and order the Krieger, but he's had pretty good luck with (gasp) 24" button rifled stainless Lilja barrels. That rifle has shot one holers for over 14 years from stag in NZ, to elk in BC/Colorado and lion in Zim. Gonna take it to Tajikistan for MP next year. Talk about a work horse......
When I had Patrick Holehan build my 340 Wby he suggested a 24" as he's had better luck/better harmonics than with a 26". I sold my Weaver 340 Wby (26") as I couldn't get it to group as i'd like........
Last edited by Tony_Soprano; 12/11/18.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 7,170
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 7,170 |
I've had rifles which were too heavy, too light, balanced too far forward, balanced too far back. I've had rifles with stocks with combs too high or too low, too much drop or not enough. Grips too open or too close. The sad thing is; I made every one of the damn things myself and couldn't even blame someone else. GD
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,627
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,627 |
A couple of my early ones had shanks that were too long.
Made that mistake on a 25-06 that Riley has killed a ton of stuff with...
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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