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Originally Posted by troutfisher13111
How do Charlie's blades stack up against Gene's?


Outta my knife pile... I’ve the most Winston’s. Several May’s. And a few Ingram’s.

I like Winston’s knives the most. I’d say may and Ingram’s are neck in neck. 6 of one / half dozen of the other. Both use same steels and materials.

I don’t have one, but from looking at pics. May has the Scandi market cornered.


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Al Warren in Roseville,CA, He's in the knife makers guild and makes most of his knives of s30v. I go through around 30-40 elk per year and nothing I have used holds an edge or re-sharpens like his knives. I own 4 and have another on order. Their for using not just for lookin at.

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Originally Posted by NMHTR32
Al Warren in Roseville,CA, He's in the knife makers guild and makes most of his knives of s30v. I go through around 30-40 elk per year and nothing I have used holds an edge or re-sharpens like his knives. I own 4 and have another on order. Their for using not just for lookin at.


Curious he only runs his S30V at Rc58. Most makers have settled on 60-61 Rc for their S30V knives.


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Originally Posted by MOGC
Originally Posted by NMHTR32
Al Warren in Roseville,CA, He's in the knife makers guild and makes most of his knives of s30v. I go through around 30-40 elk per year and nothing I have used holds an edge or re-sharpens like his knives. I own 4 and have another on order. Their for using not just for lookin at.


Curious he only runs his S30V at Rc58. Most makers have settled on 60-61 Rc for their S30V knives.


Easier sharpening.


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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Originally Posted by MOGC
Originally Posted by NMHTR32
Al Warren in Roseville,CA, He's in the knife makers guild and makes most of his knives of s30v. I go through around 30-40 elk per year and nothing I have used holds an edge or re-sharpens like his knives. I own 4 and have another on order. Their for using not just for lookin at.


Curious he only runs his S30V at Rc58. Most makers have settled on 60-61 Rc for their S30V knives.


Easier sharpening.


And less edge holding ability.


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And less edge holding ability.

But enough to do multiple animals, depending on how you use a blade.


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Originally Posted by MOGC
Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Originally Posted by MOGC
Originally Posted by NMHTR32
Al Warren in Roseville,CA, He's in the knife makers guild and makes most of his knives of s30v. I go through around 30-40 elk per year and nothing I have used holds an edge or re-sharpens like his knives. I own 4 and have another on order. Their for using not just for lookin at.


Curious he only runs his S30V at Rc58. Most makers have settled on 60-61 Rc for their S30V knives.


Easier sharpening.


And less edge holding ability.


MRK sorta beat me to it. S30V at RC58 is still better than a lot of other steels at high RC's. The lower RC will also be less likely to chip. So it is all trade offs depending what your wants and needs are.


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I remember back in 1992 talking to Phill Wilson at his little storefront about RC and how so many knife makers get it wrong. They think because a steel is able to get a specific high RC that is where they should be treating for. When in all actuality their blades would perform at a much better level with a lower RC or Differential.

Then a few years later I have the exact same conversation with Phil Wilson. Phil told me and I do not remember if it was S30V or S90V that he could get it a few points higher but the trade offs were not worth it.


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What Rc does Phil Wilson run his S30V at?


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I know I have one marked 59 and two marked 60


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I am just guessing but would say his range is 59-61???


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58 would not scare me in the least


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I believe and I could be wrong it's been a while but when he was using S60V I believe he was getting 62.


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Originally Posted by MOGC
What Rc does Phil Wilson run his S30V at?


59-61, and this is what people gloss over: DEPENDING ON THE SERVICE.

Super thin filets, with lots of flex to the bottom. Hunter/Skinners optimized for edge holding to the top.

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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
I believe and I could be wrong it's been a while but when he was using S60V I believe he was getting 62.


Phil's earliest 440V was to 57ish. After he built his new ovens he pushed the crap out of it and was able to kiss 60ish. I was working with it hard at the time as were lots of heat treat nuts. I could hit 60, but it was WAY too brittle. When Spyderco picked it up they found the same. I spent a lot of time talking to Sal, Phil and others and EVERYONE was convinced the sweet spot was 57ish.

Then...Crucible introduced 420V (S90V) and it became a moot point...


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I've always felt that when the top knife makers settled on a specific Rc level and heat treat for a given steel it was for a good reason. Never could understand why a guy like Chris Reeves would use a heat treat level 3 or 4 points lower than everyone else for the same steels. Yeah, I get the easier touch up aspect. But a $400 plus knife should be a premium performer and the steel can't do that at such lower levels. And quite frankly, it's hard to understand an outdoorsy hands on kind of guy that can't sharpen a knife.


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The tactical knife makers do not want their blades to break when used like a crow bar, so to some makers
premium performance means will bend before chip or break.

There are a ton of guys out there who can not sharpen a blade.


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Can't imagine using a Sebenza for a crow bar. But I get what you're saying. Flip side of that is guys who understand such things aren't interested in paying custom knife prices for a butter knife soft blade.


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Originally Posted by MOGC
Can't imagine using a Sebenza for a crow bar. But I get what you're saying. Flip side of that is guys who understand such things aren't interested in paying custom knife prices for a butter knife soft blade.


I wouldn't call RC58 butter knife soft blade. There are many things to consider when buying a knife. If you can't live with RC58 or whatever than the knife isn't right for you. But it may very well be right for someone else. Obviously more outdoorsmen than not can't sharpen a blade, Looking at all the different knife sharpening systems out there proves that. But my comment of easier sharpening wasn't really targeted at that. More on the lines of a guy that does actually know how to sharpen a knife will be able to do so a little easier. To me the RC is just one part of the equation.


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Sebenza's used to run about 57 on the scale. Too weak in my opinion. But hey, people love them and if it works for them good deal.


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