Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game 357 magnum (rifle) for Bear

I just got a stainless Rossi 92 in 357 magnum that I really like and I'm eager to take it deer hunting. But with our Bear season overlapping with Deer I'm normally hunting both so I'm asking a two part question. First, is it enough out to 125 yards and second, what bullet and what grain?

Dang. I just don't know. Interested to see what others have to say. I'm happy with my 30-06 for bear.

I'm sure someone here has clobbered bear with a 357, or even something smaller!

Regards, Guy

Not something that I'd do, but tell us how it works out.

Good rifle.
I have such a M92 also, but it is much older. Mine has taken deer and hogs. Lots of folks over on Leverguns.com shoot .357 rifles and recommend 158 - 180 grain bullets for big stuff; no hollow points if you need penetration.
That said, my wife shot a deer in the neck just forward of the shoulder with 140 grain JSP at 2200 fps and that left a 6 inch exit hole. Bears need a stronger bullet.


Mine shoots everything from 110 to 180 grain bullets accurately just so long it is fast. Super Vel 38 special 125 grains is the only .38 fast enough to stabilize.
Buffalo Bore 180 grain ammo shoots fine in mine and will shoot through most critters out to your specified range.

I used to hand load , but found that good factory ammo meets all my needs now. FWIW, a loaded .357 Mod 1892 makes a serious self defense weapon. Hollow points are OK then. .

My Taylor's Trapper Skinner 1892 Clone in 357 mag, with 16" barrel has two loads: Hornady 158 grain XTP-FP with 16.2 grains for Lil Gun for 1760 FPS from the rifle, as my general purpose load for both rifle and revolver (about 1250 FPS from my 3" GP100). Or a Rim Rock 170 Grain Cast-GC LBT RNFP with the same 16.2 grains of Lil Gun for 1645 FPS, from my rifle only. Both use Starline Brass, CCI 550 SP mag primers, and COAL 1.580". Either will kill a deer or a small hog inside of 100 yards.

I've gone as high as 17.5 Grain of Lil Gun under the 170 gr Rim Rock for 1806 FPS, but I prefer the lighter load. However, if bear was on the menu I'd use the heavier load.

I hope that will a black bear.

Bear[black?] with a .357 lever gun? Buffalo Bore 180gr Hard cast comes to mind. Oughta work.

^^^This^^^

I’ve seen lots of feral hogs taken with that combo. And they are probably harder to kill & thicker skinned and harder to penetrate than a black bear.

You must just plop down and sit on them big ol' nuts a yours and wait for a bear to wander by! Holy smokes.

My luck I'd have a 357 rifle in my hand when a 500 pound chopping block head bear came down the trail I was parked on! No thanks!

A hunter killed a 679# boar this past season with a 357 magnum handgun in PA. So I am guessing your levergun will work. The question is though, is it optimal?

I would say over bait or bayed by dogs its pretty dam close to optimal. Close range it isn't giving up much to anything. Now if it is spot and stalk where shots might be longer range I would say it is less than optimal for sure.

I do not consider a 357 adequate to hunt bears. Not saying it won't kill one. Bears are an animal that most of us won't shoot often. Bear bones are heavier that deer bones. Bear hide is thicker than deer hide. Bears tend to have a bunch of fat under the skin where I have hunted them. Bear hair mats with fat and blood and stops up wounds. Even well hit bears often dont bleed well. Bears don't have sharp hooves to make easily found tracks. Wounded bears can be unbelievably hard to track if you don't have snow.
A proper 357 bullet will probably penetrate deep enough to cause the bear to die. The problem in the places I hunt are finding the bear. If you are hound hunting and the bears don't run big, probably will work, but the dogs might get scratched up. If you live where bears get big and fat, a bigger gun should be used, in my opinion. You owe it to te bear and yourself to carry a bit more gun, again, in my opinion.

Bfly

Not my first choice, but since they've stopped making 180gr NPs, I'd go for the Swift A-Frames. Spendy though.

I would and have shot black bears with a 357 mag......with hounds treed.....never a shot more than 75 feet.....180 gr. Hornady HP in the head.....

If it were over bait for northern bears I think it would work fine. You would likely get to pick your shot and a good hardcast is going to easily double lung a bear and leave a nice exit to boot. But the OP is in PA where he shouldn't be baiting and if its a bear you stumble over while deer hunting you may only get a very small time window for a shot on bear thats moving and a 357 isn't really optimum for a bad angle shot. Me id rather have a 30.30 with 170's for that kind of shot.

My 158 JSP Lil Gun load was doing 2050 mv in a Marlin. A 357 in a rifle is not the same as a handgun, far more. I would hesitate to drop a bear if I had a good load and could place my shot.

On Bear, I would choose a heavy hard cast bullet, A 41 or 44 using the same would be preferred in a lever, and there are better yet rounds for fast killing power. Black Bears might get big in PA.....but if I were out deer hunting and one came along I would not hesitate....again Right bullet, Right placement as in most hunting.

Study bear anatomy if you need to brush up on where best to hold to take out vitals. Good hunting.

According to Hodgdon 1757 fps is the very best you can get with a 158 grain bullet. I can see .357 as a close in defensive round or a house gun, but why limit yourself to a short range round that doesn't come close to a .30-30? If it is the best rifle you have available I can see using it but otherwise, no. Of course I am biased because I only hunt deer and larger game with .30-06, .270W, or .308W class cartridges. We always have the possibility (probability) of large hogs which I imagine are as hard to kill as black bear.

Think again:

Notes: Marlin Model 1894 .357 Mag. Cowboy Carbine with a 20-inch barrel used to test all loads. Starline cases and CCI 550 Small Pistol Magnum primers used throughout. (Rifle Issue #226 - July, 2006)

145 Winchester Silvertip hollowpoint Hodgdon Lil'Gun 20.0gr, 2,052fps

158 Hornady FP/XTP Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,971fps

158 Hornady HP/XTP Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,987fps

158 Sierra Jacketed Hollow Cavity Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,957fps

158 Nosler hollowpoint Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,988fps

158 Speer Gold Dot hollowpoint Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,929fps

158 Speer jacketed softpoint Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,944fps

158 Speer jacketed hollowpoint Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 1,972fps

156 RCBS 38-150-SWC cast Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 2,018fps

160 Cast Performance flatnose plain base Hodgdon Lil'Gun 19.0gr, 2,021fps

165 Lyman GC 358156 cast Hodgdon Lil'Gun 18.0gr, 1,974fps

173 Lyman 358429 cast Hodgdon Lil'Gun 17.5gr, 1,906fps

180 Cast Performance wide flatnose Hodgdon Lil'Gun 15.0gr, 1,790fps

As I said I can see it as a close in defensive round or a house gun. I wear a .357 magnum revolver when I hunt hogs, the idea being it is more effective if wading into brush looking for a hog that has hiked off after being shot. The reason it is more effective is the fast handling and aiming. .357 magnum has its place and I carry one most days and every day I travel away from home. An S&W 66

WOW by some accounts here I guess bowhunters shouldn't be shooting bears. Evidently there are armor plated bears running around. A .357 coming out of a rifle is going to create a lot more blunt force trauma and destruction to vitals than an arrow is. As I said I wouldn't use it on a spot and stalk hunt. But I haven't a single problem using one on baited or bayed bears. Hell I don't even have an issue with using a .357 out of a pistol. A bad shot is a bad shot no matter what you choose to use. Sure more power more bullet mass may save the day. Then again it may not. Shot placement, make a good shot no matter what you are using. Sometimes less is more, if it means you can shoot it better.

Shadow,
Good point on barrel length. My .1892 .357 has a 20 inch Douglas barrel and back when I reloaded it I had a 140 grain load up to over 2250 fps. It did a job on any thin skinned creature. Probably not ideal for bear tho.
Buffalo Bore works well in my rifle and here is their official velocity for a shorter 18.5 barrel:
18.5-inch Marlin 1894

a. Item 19A/20-180gr. Hard Cast = 1851 fps
b. Item 19B/20-170gr. JHC = 1860 fps
c. Item 19C/20-158gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2153 fps---- Can you believe this?!!!
d. Item 19D/20-125gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2298 fps---- Or this?!!!



Item 19A - Exterior Ballistics Charts for several different Muzzle Velocities

I don't think it is enough, no, and by a substantial margin, but if I were to do it, I'd use the 180 grain partitions ... I have 4 boxes left.

Tom

In a revolver for deer and hogs I always felt the 357 was marginal, the 41 Mag. was a real step up and out of the marginal category and the 45 Colt and 44 Mag. was another step up that was noticeable. I used a 45 Colt and Corbon ammo on one six foot N. Mexico bear. Bear was treed and at the first shot visibly shuddered all over, it kept climbing so I kept shooting but probably unnecessary. Took maybe 10 seconds to fall out of the tree completely immobile.

Sure the 357 will kill black bear but not my first choice, but it was the first choice of my guide as she liked the lighter recoil and carry weight of the 357. The loads that equal or exceed 35 Remington ballistics will be fine at closer ranges with the right bullet.

Shoot a hard cast lead bullet or minimally expanding jacketed bullet, keep the shots within 100 yards and don't take any marginal shots. It's not a dead right there type of rig but I am confident it would do the trick. I had a Contender in 357 mag that shot 180gr bullets at 1650fps out of an 8" barrel with MP300 - that thing was stout and I have no doubt it would do the trick.

Folks in the know on heavy hard cast bullets understand the penetration they offer......

Others might be surprised at just how much they will dig. In the end, shot placement matters as does placement. If not confident, chose something else.

Agree w/comment above, don't expect a DRT unless you have a CNS hit, but I agree it will do the deed.

That would be a negative on both as PA doesn't allow baiting or hounds for bear.

Using a 180 cast flat nose (or heavier), I'd have no problems or fears using a 357 lever gun for deer, hogs, bears, elk, moose. Until you've seen it in action, you don't know what the hell you are talking about, and you should likely abstain from offering an ignorant opinion.

Of course, feel free to look like an idiot.

Places I hunt 100 yards would be a very long shot. I shot my last Bear at 20 yards.

I’m actually thinking I’d NOT want a hard cast bullet at 125 yards out of the levergun in question. I’d be picky on my shots and aim For vitals with any controlled expansion bullet. Getting through black bear vitals is easy if you can shoot, they aren’t made of much as far as armor goes. Save the hard cast for self defense!

this......................

I never said it was. I stated that under those two circumstances I would be totally comfortable killing a bear. I also stated if it were spot and stalk then I would not be comfortable with that. I will include what I call chance hunting as well with spot and stalk.

The 357 would work. Would it be my first choice, if I had other options, nope.

Food for thought. Yup .357 will kill a bear.

https://youtu.be/mV_hIBczcpo

I have other options. But I don't always feel like deer hunting with a bear rifle. But a lot of the time I spend deer hunting bear is also open so I always have that consideration.

I have never shot a bear with the 357. I have shot a few deer with it and they died. I was using 158gr XTP’s and was not impressed with their performance at 50 and 100 yards. That being said, I think 100 yards was to far for the 357. Keep the shot close and in the heart/lung area it will work.

Are we still talking rifles here?

Yes sir the 1894 marlin and Ruger 77/357

Considering the trophy a pa black is I personally don’t risk it and save all marginal calibers for after bear is closed hear lots of stories of people hitting bears and not finding them or making one shot with good caliber and standing in amazement only to have bear get up and still get away

OK thanks.

I shoot deer and hogs with 2 357 rifles with 158 gr xtp. hor.deer 10 to 80 yards hogs 10 to what ever, our stuff is not big 275 hog 140 is a big body buck no problem I would feel good at 150 yards with my guns with my handloads that is all I ever shot them for 300lb bear any thing diff no

Agreed! Shot placement is the key! If I can’t make a good shot, I just don’t take the shot.
And didn’t a famous grizzly guide here on the 24 Hour🔥 kill a big ass brown bear in AK last year while guiding fly fishermen with Buffalo Bore ammo and a lowly 9mm pistol, if my memory serves me correctly? As I recall, he didn’t recommend it, but it worked. 🤠

180 hard cast or a jsp with the hottest book load you can find should work.
Out to 125 or 150? IDK.
As already said, be picky and stingy with what you pull the trigger on.

How do you hunt? From a tree stand?

It's easy to pick a good shot from a tree stand. You usually have all the time in the world and some shooting lanes.

The OP was seeking comment and opinion and the comments didn't sound ignorant to me. The gist of the comments is that , yes the .357 rifle will work but it has range and power issues vs. a .30-06 class big game rifle. Most 150-165 grain .30-06 loads produce velocity at over 300 yards that the .357 magnum delivers at the muzzle. It seems that most hunters owning a more capable rifle would use it for big game. Some folks like to use as least effective a weapon as is legal, such as archery. More power to them, but when you seek opinion and get one that is different from yours it doesn't automatically mean the giver is ignorant or an idiot. Most big game hunters that might encounter a bear would use a rifle that produces considerably more energy than a .357 magnum. I wouldn't quit hunting if all I had was a .357 lever rifle and I really don't want to be shot with one, but it has a lot more limitations than the more commonly used big game calibers.

I'd do it.
My daughter shot a buck this past season with a Ruger 77/.357 using 158 XTP FP over 17.5 grn of Lil-gun (1850 fps). Quartering shot and it punched a nice hole all the way through the on-side shoulder and out the back ribs on the other side. That said, I'm keeping an eye out for a doner 77/.44 mag to turn into a .41 Mag. for Dad.

Henry makes a nice lever 41 Magnum - https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/01/jon-wayne-taylor/gun-review-henry-big-boy-steel-41-magnum/

No. I gave up the trees after a bad fall. I sit on the ground and still hunt.

I've killed a bunch of deer with my Marlin .357. Worked about as well as my .30-30 at typical woods ranges. None went over 60 yards with double lung shots and shoulder shots dropped immediately with complete pass through using 158 gr. sp Winchester factory loads and 158 gr. Speer sp over 15 gr's 2400 and 19 grs lil gun. Killed one with a double lung shot at just over 200 yards with the 158 Win factory load and it still was a complete pass through. Deer went down after 40 yard run. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it killing a bear.

Good stuff. Thanks

Put the .357 back in the safe and use a decent caliber you owe it to the bear rather than to use something that is "nearly" a deer caliber at best.

I say "ignorant" because, just like you, many guys seem to think that a 357 rifle is, as you state, a "least effective" choice. My point was, and is, that it is faaaar from that. So just like them, you make assumptions based on zero experience, and those assumptions are flat-out wrong.

I am not talking about people seeking opinions being ignorant. You should learn how to read for meaning. I am talking about guys, just like you, that form an opinion based on nothing, and then push that opinion as factual. That's what makes you look like an idiot, because that's what idiots do: they form opinions based on no facts, and then push those opinions as if they have validity.

You seemed to want to turn my reply into an attack on Moosemike. Why would I do that? He is just asking questions. I am attacking all those guys who voice beliefs that have zero factual basis. They are literally misleading the questioner, just as you are.

The 357 out of a rifle, loaded to the top, with the right bullet, is not your j-frame with 125 jhps. It is not "least effective" or "minimal" in any way. It is a hammer that penetrates some feet of tissue and makes a good wound channel. What it doesn't do is transmit high-velocity trauma to soft tissue, but it makes better wound channels than 25 caliber bullets at moderate rifle velocities. We aren't talking about shooting rimfires at big game, here. We are talking about a 1"-1.5" permanent channel for some feet when using the right bullet. I've killed moose and elk with that.

But please, feel free to keep on showing your ass. And remember, opinions aren't facts. Stop confusing the two.

Please list with detail the experiences you've had with the .357 mag out of a rifle being inadequate.

Pretty sure between my brother and I, plus both our daughters, we haven't caught a bullet yet in whitetails.

The OP is asking about using it on bears in PA. There's very little chance at a long shot. We really don't have spot and stalk opportunities for bears. Though we can't hunt over bait, the shot ranges are about the same.
My son's bear was shot at 10-15 yards from him while he was still hunting.

Same thing really. You still pick up the muzzle when the animal's eyes are blocked and pick your shot through an opening. Personally, I've never shot anything with a 357 rifle, only handguns, but you are an experienced hunter who knows how to pick a shot. You could get it done with a .22.

Please tell me exactly what I owe to the Bear. What, in your estimation is the minimum cartridge "I owe to the Bear"?

m mike don't bother with theses fellers they will find fault in what ever you do . pick your shots and hunt fugg em

The late Bob Milek killed a pile of mule deer, antelope, mountain lion and black bear with several 357 mag revolvers. He was definitely a forerunner in the handgun hunting world as well as a fine writer. This was back in the 60s and 70s with inferior bullet technology as compared today. 125 yards however may be pushing it a bit especially if using open sights.

Well, all I can say is I'm sorry for any offense, and I won't trouble you by conversing with you again. God bless you.

It might be pushing the cartridge but it won't be pushing the iron sights.

Correct!

This cow elk was shot through the chest organs at a distance of approx 50 feet with the first bullet. Second bullet bullet struck a little further back and tore across the diaphragm and punched a good sized hole through the liver. The animal galloped away as if unhurt but collapsed after a run of about 100 yards. My 357 MAG revolver made meat!

I feel that 357 MAG firearms are strictly a close range hunting tool. If you want more reach, buy a .308 or 300 Savage rifle. Or a 30-06 if you can master the recoil. All of these rifles have downed much game within my extended hunting family.

Sherwood

A .357 revolver is nowhere near the ballistic equal of a .357 rifle/carbine. The same loads that will propel a 158 gr. bullet roughly 1300 fps out the muzzle of a 6" revolver will do roughly 1800 fps. from a 20" carbine.

Love this, Nice wheel gun.

Just got an original in 38-40. Would that be a better choice?

I've heard of the 38-55 and the 32-40, but the 38-40 is new to me. How does it compare to the 38-55?

Think .40 S&W.

Seriously? The .38-40 and .44-40 are simply legendary chamberings.

Bear are cupcakes. If you can't kill a black bear with a .357 Rifle you need to either work on your hunting or your shooting. I've shot several deer with a .357 carbine and haven't been able to catch a bullet yet, and deer are built a lot more sturdy then a black bear.

I'll be using a #46 longbow and wooden arrows this spring, .357 is cheating.

this. 357 suck on bear

I'll put you both down as votes for the .38-40 then...

Never seen it used; but I have seen the results of 357

A 357 Mag will punch through the vitals just as effectively as an arrow or countless calibers. Don't bow to the "must be bigger" nonsense. If you own it, shoot it. Look at Grizzly Ammo loads also. The Punch load is impressive. They are machined from brass and will whistle through a black bear or penetrate a skull in a more hairy situation. Good luck!

Sorry. Just a brain fart. You didn't write it, but in my mind you were talking about model 94, and hadn't considered pistol rounds.

No biggie.

I would like to know all the naysayers - have you fired a 357 in a rifle?

Blowing up 2 liter bottles at 150 yds - like any other hi-vel round...and seeing how fast 158s @2050 mv gets there.....and the impact.

A 357 in a RIFLE as others above stated, kills like a 30/30. HOW MANY ANIMALS have 30/30s dumped over the past century? Bear included? How fast are common 30/30 loads clocking? Hmm. Much less bark and recoil......but don't be fooled by it's size.

Tell me how many animals ran off from a 357 rifle? I see...

Folks who don't know...........simply don't know.

This has been an entertaining thread if nothing else.
Here’s your Sign.....😎

Archery deer season & fall bear season run concurrently here.

Last fall, I was bear hunting with my Remchester 1895 in 30-06 on a Saturday & had an opportunity where I could have arrowed a decent buck !

Sunday, I had the rifle & crossbow in my ground blind, contingencies covered.

Bear came out & I used the crossbow anyway. Ran 25 yards, death moaned & piled up.

They really are not hard to kill.

Yes, I've owned (and shot) 2 Marlin 1894s, 1 TC Carbine, and a Winchester Highwall which was one of the test platforms when Remington and S&W were developing the .357 magnum cartridge back in the 1920s. (A gun I would buy back if the current owner would give me a decent price on it.)

I think it is only fair to ask you the same question. Have YOU owned, or even merely just fired, a .357 in a rifle?

Tom

Nope! But I have owned and fired it in Pistol form and know it will humanly kill a bear.

The only times I hunted Bear with a 357 in the past was with an 8" Dan Wesson.

I hunted black bear with a .375 H&H.

There's a few on here that probably think that's what I should be using.

The .375 H&H will work on both deer and bear.

What WON'T it work on Ken?

I have one in the house. It is my Dr's recommendation that I no longer shoot it however.

Use the same amount of powder as a .357

Tanks.

You’re welcome.

Anytime.

Really ? a 375 HH won't stop a TANK !

Nope,a .375 H&H won't stop a tank.

Now a .460 Wby....

How many of the responders know about the large number of 700 pound plus black bears taken in Pennsylvania?

I'd get a bigger gun. I'd hate to loose the chance of a lifetime for "not enough gun."

700lb or not the .357 will kill it.

Large number? It's usually one, maybe two a year.

I might add that we had a 600+ pound Bear taken in PA this past season with a .357...……...Handgun!!!

Hard to stop a hard cast 180 out of a .357. Sixgun or rifle...

Well! How did the hunt go? Just curious how the 357 rifle worked if you had an opportunity.

A stout load of H-110, behind a HDY .357"/180 gr. XTP, will give you ~ 1800 fps/MV from a Carbine.

Aperture sighted, zeroed at 100 yards (+0.5" @ 25), the drop at 125 yards is 2", w/ ~ 835 ft-lbs of energy (better than .357 Mag. pistol at point-blank).

Call it a 200 yd cartridge if you can hit.




GR