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Hey Gang,
Any of you Lab guys care to give some insight into the difference between the two? I am posng this question relative to upland and waterfowl hunting. I have had a Golden and a Boykin, both of which were great dogs. Doves and ducks would be the main quarry. Of course it would need to fit in well within a family setting as well.
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I have never personally owned the breed. However I have hunted over more than a few. I like the Brit's better. Smaller and tougher from what I have seen in general. Both are capable retrievers provided from good breeding.
Eat Fish, Wear Grundens, Drink Alaskan.
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I had "American" labs back when I had them, a buddy currently has "British" labs.
The most marked difference I see is in their behavior. My buddy's dogs appear to be much more laid back and quiet while American dogs were much noisier and rambunctious. Much of this may be due to American dogs often being kenneled outside compared to the Brit dogs I've seen. When the dog is next to you, it is much easier to correct it for excessive barking or jumping.
On the same line, the Brits seem to respond better to a gentler touch when training. If one is used to training Goldens, then I think they have the correct mindset for Brits. American lines have developed to handle a lot of pressure when training. That can be handy when one makes a mistake but the dogs seem to test the handler more often. One type is not better than the other, it just means one needs to pick a line that best meets the handler's personality and style.
Body wise, the Brit lines seem shorter and stockier. That makes sense as the breed is used more as a retriever than flusher like here in the States. American lines run more of a gamut of body types of which I preferred the taller and ranger body.
Needless to say, these are some very general observations between the two versions. One still needs to research the breeder to determine if their pup will likely be a good match for you.
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I had "American" labs back when I had them, a buddy currently has "British" labs.
The most marked difference I see is in their behavior. My buddy's dogs appear to be much more laid back and quiet while American dogs were much noisier and rambunctious. Much of this may be due to American dogs often being kenneled outside compared to the Brit dogs I've seen. When the dog is next to you, it is much easier to correct it for excessive barking or jumping.
On the same line, the Brits seem to respond better to a gentler touch when training. If one is used to training Goldens, then I think they have the correct mindset for Brits. American lines have developed to handle a lot of pressure when training. That can be handy when one makes a mistake but the dogs seem to test the handler more often. One type is not better than the other, it just means one needs to pick a line that best meets the handler's personality and style.
Body wise, the Brit lines seem shorter and stockier. That makes sense as the breed is used more as a retriever than flusher like here in the States. American lines run more of a gamut of body types of which I preferred the taller and ranger body.
Needless to say, these are some very general observations between the two versions. One still needs to research the breeder to determine if their pup will likely be a good match for you.
Very well said....
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+2 on woodmaster81's summary. Make sure you confirm strong hunting bloodlines. There's a lot of Labs out there.
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Our Lab is of the American taller and thinner type. So far we are very happy with her both in the field and at home, plenty of bottom to hunt all day and a very good off switch in the house. She has been pretty easy to train, very biddable and eager to please. A natural retriever ( always to hand with little or no training) and is absolute hell on a running or low flying cripple. The only aggravation in the field so far is that she's pretty hard headed when on a ground track, hard to stop her with a snoot full of bird scent and she occasionally re visits the scene of a flush or where a bird fell and needs to be recalled. We're going to work on this during the off season, all in all I'm extremely happy with her for a first year dog.
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I like the build of the American labs. I am on my third one. Two of them were from very successful field trial blood lines. The reason I went this route is because I wanted one with speed for upland hunting. Light and lean works best when covering ground in the fall. They have a lot of drive, one has a better off switch than the other. My youngest is turning 1 year old this weekend and his DNA is really waking up... he was a bit slow to reach most of the landmarks a guy would train for. Not slow or lazy, just comes around a little later than others I have had or been around. They really have drive and can retrieve all day. They do great in the water as well.
I would agree with some of the posters above as well... I think these field trial blood lines are a bit harder to train. it is their hard headedness and determination. Its a benefit for the dog when hunting to have that stubbornness to not quit and the persistence to fight through challenges, but be prepared for it when it comes to training. It requires a lot of repetition in a lot of scenerios. Not necessarily harder, but different. The dogs really want to please.
Last edited by Oakster; 02/21/19.
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British lines will have FAR less genetic issues.
HIPS!!!
Epstein didn't kill himself.
"Play Cinnamon Girl you Sonuvabitch!"
Biden didn't win the election.
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British lines will have FAR less genetic issues.
HIPS!!! I’d wager the opposite true. American hunting stock are breed for health and athleticism. I’ve seen more half crippled Labs from “British (Show dog)” lines than any other dog breed. This is not to say there aren’t well bred dogs in the British tradition. There just seem to be lots more hacks breeding Labs in the British (show) style. Likewise, this isn’t to say there aren’t plenty of bubba-ed up Labs bred from hunting and field trial lines. Get a quality dog from a real real breeder. It can take some effort to find the good ones. Red flags would be prioritizing superficial traits like novel coloring, etc. The Lab I have now was so well breed, it’s as if she was almost born trained. She was super easy to train. She’s from American hunting and Field trial stock. This dog has insane energy, but what’s most profound is she can turn it off. Her self control is otherworldly.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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I had "American" labs back when I had them, a buddy currently has "British" labs.
The most marked difference I see is in their behavior. My buddy's dogs appear to be much more laid back and quiet while American dogs were much noisier and rambunctious. Much of this may be due to American dogs often being kenneled outside compared to the Brit dogs I've seen. When the dog is next to you, it is much easier to correct it for excessive barking or jumping.
On the same line, the Brits seem to respond better to a gentler touch when training. If one is used to training Goldens, then I think they have the correct mindset for Brits. American lines have developed to handle a lot of pressure when training. That can be handy when one makes a mistake but the dogs seem to test the handler more often. One type is not better than the other, it just means one needs to pick a line that best meets the handler's personality and style.
Body wise, the Brit lines seem shorter and stockier. That makes sense as the breed is used more as a retriever than flusher like here in the States. American lines run more of a gamut of body types of which I preferred the taller and ranger body.
Needless to say, these are some very general observations between the two versions. One still needs to research the breeder to determine if their pup will likely be a good match for you.
This idea about the hard temperament of American Hunting stock is dated. The force fetch has fallen out of fashion. You’ll find in the newest generations of American Labs, a dog bred to hunt hard with athleticism, instinct, drive and discipline, and a dog bred to be a companion and live inside with it’s people.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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The Lab I have now was so well breed, it’s as if she was almost born trained. She was super easy to train. She’s from American hunting and Field trial stock.
This dog has insane energy, but what’s most profound is she can turn it off. Her self control is otherworldly.
Both of these apply to our Remi. All I really had to do was introduce her to birds and teach her to stay close. She's literally done the rest herself. Currently she is sleeping between my two youngest boys, spends most of her time lounging in our camper but in an instant is ready to go hunt hard all day or train for a few hours.
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I have bred and trained AMERICAN LABS since the 80's. These are Field Trial level dogs that have a lot of drive and look good. British dogs seem to have shorter legs and a more barrel shaped chest - because of this body trait, it is hard to keep weight off them in older years and that leads to hip and joint issues. Different strokes...
"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die, I want to go where they went" Will Rogers
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I had "American" labs back when I had them, a buddy currently has "British" labs.
The most marked difference I see is in their behavior. My buddy's dogs appear to be much more laid back and quiet while American dogs were much noisier and rambunctious. Much of this may be due to American dogs often being kenneled outside compared to the Brit dogs I've seen. When the dog is next to you, it is much easier to correct it for excessive barking or jumping.
On the same line, the Brits seem to respond better to a gentler touch when training. If one is used to training Goldens, then I think they have the correct mindset for Brits. American lines have developed to handle a lot of pressure when training. That can be handy when one makes a mistake but the dogs seem to test the handler more often. One type is not better than the other, it just means one needs to pick a line that best meets the handler's personality and style.
Body wise, the Brit lines seem shorter and stockier. That makes sense as the breed is used more as a retriever than flusher like here in the States. American lines run more of a gamut of body types of which I preferred the taller and ranger body.
Needless to say, these are some very general observations between the two versions. One still needs to research the breeder to determine if their pup will likely be a good match for you.
+3 on this. We had a yellow lab and we saw the parents before we bought her. The mother was quite a bit smaller than the father. The breeder said the mother was an English lab and the father was an American lab. I thought she was pulling my leg. Turns out she was right. That was the best dog we ever had. Lived to be 16 years old.
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I have bred and trained AMERICAN LABS since the 80's. These are Field Trial level dogs that have a lot of drive and look good. British dogs seem to have shorter legs and a more barrel shaped chest - because of this body trait, it is hard to keep weight off them in older years and that leads to hip and joint issues. Different strokes... I don't care what hunting breed you have, feed them right and exercise them daily and you will not have a fat dog. Walking a dog is not exercise, except for maybe the person walking them.
Eat Fish, Wear Grundens, Drink Alaskan.
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Good buddy has had two British labs. Best labs I’ve seen by far.
Ol Tank was stove up from getting run over. He’d still get it done in the field. Great flushing dog and of course an outstanding retriever. Hunted with him just the second part of his life. New pup is about 2 years old now and looks to be everything Tank was.
I’ve never been a big lab fan. These two have changed my mind.
A bit smaller, less leg, more muscle, bit more head. Not as spastic as a lot of labs I’ve been around. Like the coat on his two better as well. Tighter and a bit more slick.
“Life is life and fun is fun, but it's all so quiet when the goldfish die.”
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Good buddy has had two British labs. Best labs I’ve seen by far.
Ol Tank was stove up from getting run over. He’d still get it done in the field. Great flushing dog and of course an outstanding retriever. Hunted with him just the second part of his life. New pup is about 2 years old now and looks to be everything Tank was.
I’ve never been a big lab fan. These two have changed my mind.
A bit smaller, less leg, more muscle, bit more head. Not as spastic as a lot of labs I’ve been around. Like the coat on his two better as well. Tighter and a bit more slick.
Which one would Kelly own? I am thinking British.
Eat Fish, Wear Grundens, Drink Alaskan.
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I have had both types. Generally the American Labs I had were taller, heavier and harder headed. The one British I had was large for his breed but still smaller that the Americans. He was a very sensitive dog, almost too sensitive unless treated very gentle. Check your breeder and get to know their bloodlines and see both in field before you decide. The Brit I had was more affectionate and a better family dog than the American Labs I had but the Brit came from a much better bloodline than the Americans I had so it probably is just more of a bloodline thing than a breed thing. Generally less health issues from top quality breeders whichever breed but as of right now, probably fewer problems with the British lines since they are newer in the states and the bloodlines have not become as corrupted as some of the American lines, IMO.
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British lines will have FAR less genetic issues.
HIPS!!! I’d wager the opposite true. American hunting stock are breed for health and athleticism. I’ve seen more half crippled Labs from “British (Show dog)” lines than any other dog breed. This is not to say there aren’t well bred dogs in the British tradition. There just seem to be lots more hacks breeding Labs in the British (show) style. Likewise, this isn’t to say there aren’t plenty of bubba-ed up Labs bred from hunting and field trial lines. Get a quality dog from a real real breeder. It can take some effort to find the good ones. Red flags would be prioritizing superficial traits like novel coloring, etc. The Lab I have now was so well breed, it’s as if she was almost born trained. She was super easy to train. She’s from American hunting and Field trial stock. This dog has insane energy, but what’s most profound is she can turn it off. Her self control is otherworldly. Yours reads as anecdotal. European lines across the breeds are held to a higher / purer to standard than here (AKC). They have been doing it far longer...
Epstein didn't kill himself.
"Play Cinnamon Girl you Sonuvabitch!"
Biden didn't win the election.
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I've had them both and appreciate the temperament and compactness of a British. Lost Katie about 3 years ago at the age of 13 and my wife still won't let another one into her heart.
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Woodmaster and Kingston nailed it.
In addition, for upland if there any serious topography involved (think chukar) you'll want a slimmer, more athletic, longer legged Lab.
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