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know what Brainstorm meant. The entire ANF, NC part of the state parts of the NE are as well. Too many doe tags for too long too many greedy slobs bragging about how they and their kids kill a couple does a piece every year and then feed the meat to the dogs or just chuck it.
Last year my son killed a doe and a couple local kids killed one each on my land, but I manage my properties well.
Hardly anyone hunts the northcentral after the first day of Rifle now until the first Saturday. Then it's a ghost town again for the second week. If conditions were favorable the deer herd would be booming in the big woods. If the deer aren't there it's because the habitat isn't there. Moose you are showing your ignorance of the north central part of the state, I.e. potter, Tioga, McKean counties for certain are being timbered at full rate for the last several years creating ideal habitat. It is the numerous anterless tags that have the herd suppressed and the greed of the hunters themselves that are just as happy to kill the first deer they see in the combination season...see brown BANG!
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Could be. I'm a Sullivan county hunter. So northcentral yes but east of where you mention.
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now!
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Joined: Oct 2002
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 7,340
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Give it up already, your arguments make no sense.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Hunter S. Thompson
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Give it up already, your arguments make no sense. Why butt hurt? Why are people not hunting because of low numbers? Don't they still have the social side. I'm guessing they actually want LOTS of deer and the social side is secondary. The only thing that makes no sense is PA's hunting, what a cluster fu*ck.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Feb 2019
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Campfire Member
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Give it up already, your arguments make no sense. I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Those guys can sit home in their dens with their buddies watching football and see as many deer now.
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Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 244
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Feb 2019
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I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Give it up already, your arguments make no sense. Why butt hurt? Why are people not hunting because of low numbers? Don't they still have the social side. I'm guessing they actually want LOTS of deer and the social side is secondary. The only thing that makes no sense is PA's hunting, what a cluster fu*ck. You have that correct a real cluster f'k brought about by the peopl;e we hire to manage the game animals hence shut them down and reform, that is the only way out of it.
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,917
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,917 |
I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! Hillsgrove is where I've hunted since 1991.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 46,745
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 46,745 |
I was born and raised in Sullivan county near Shunk the issue there is not timbeing on private land but getting the State Forest to cut some trees creating habitat. While the PGC sold way too many doe tags for way to long in the area the habitat coupled with that heeds recruitment rates. My hometown area is depressed camps closed up or used for summer trips now all for lack of deer numbers. Drive up Rt 87 around Hillsgrove look at the closed or run and down seedy stores, motels,etc. was not like that when deer numbers were good. My kin still owns farms in the area few have any crops or livestock no reason to grow crops that deer and turkey fed on...hell they come to my place to hunt now! See, I keep reading about so many empty camps because of low deer numbers, but that just doesn't seem to jive with all those that still want the Monday opener. Many have agreed that "Deer season has never been simply about hunting, there has always been a huge social side." So regardless of low numbers of deer, you can still have the HUGE social side, and also do some hunting. Give it up already, your arguments make no sense. Lmao. About as much sense as the PA guys on here.
Camp is where you make it.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,808
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2007
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You have that correct a real cluster f'k brought about by the peopl;e we hire to manage the game animals hence shut them down and reform, that is the only way out of it.
Another bring them down, without any ideas on how to correct the preceived problems. What would you have the new crew do different. Shut Deer season down a few years so the herd can build up? Eliminate Doe tags? How about the decline in Ruffed Grouse numbers? What would be your suggestions to the new directors and what experience do you have so they may think you know what you are talking about? After all you want them to represent you. What experience do you bring to the table so your suggestions also represent me. You can stand outside and almost listen to our Ash tree population crash to the ground from the ash borer that is killing them. They are a valuable part of the GC wooded GLs with regards wildlife habitat. Any suggestions to your new crew to possibly save them from completely dying out in the Pa forests. If they do die out, what will be the effect on various species of wildlife. Surely you have at least a few answers....Don't you????
Last edited by battue; 04/21/19.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,232
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
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You have that correct a real cluster f'k brought about by the peopl;e we hire to manage the game animals hence shut them down and reform, that is the only way out of it.
Another bring them down, without any ideas on how to correct the preceived problems. What would you have the new crew do different. Shut Deer season down a few years so the herd can build up? Eliminate Doe tags? How about the decline in Ruffed Grouse numbers? What would be your suggestions to the new directors and what experience do you have so they may think you know what you are talking about? After all you want them to represent you. What experience do you bring to the table so your suggestions also represent me. Grouse numbers are plummeting all over the NorthEast. Don't know as there's anything the GC or anybody else can do about it. Last article I read about it, NYDEC thinks it's west nile virus that's killing them off.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,808
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2007
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You have that correct a real cluster f'k brought about by the peopl;e we hire to manage the game animals hence shut them down and reform, that is the only way out of it.
Another bring them down, without any ideas on how to correct the preceived problems. What would you have the new crew do different. Shut Deer season down a few years so the herd can build up? Eliminate Doe tags? How about the decline in Ruffed Grouse numbers? What would be your suggestions to the new directors and what experience do you have so they may think you know what you are talking about? After all you want them to represent you. What experience do you bring to the table so your suggestions also represent me. Grouse numbers are plummeting all over the NorthEast. Don't know as there's anything the GC or anybody else can do about it. Last article I read about it, NYDEC thinks it's west nile virus that's killing them off. West Nile is the current reason for blame. The GC here injected Grouse eggs with West Nile and guess what? The chicks had west nile. Well, you inject embryos with an infection and one shouldn't be all that surprised the offspring pops out infected. We have the habitat, but the Grouse are sliding. Our GC doesn't currently know why, but perhaps when they are all fired and out the new crew will. Deer is the problem most here in Pa. have. Yet I have friends who somehow manage to kill a Buck almost every year. It is rare when they don't. They do it on public and private land. Some with a bow, and some with a rifle and I suspect they will do the same if the season starts on Saturday. Somehow they even manage to get one in the middle of the week, regardless of what day the season would open. Something is going on and it isn't fair that others can't do the same. Therefore it is imperative the GC needs a house cleaning.
Last edited by battue; 04/21/19.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 5,449
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 5,449 |
They can watch birds and hug trees the other 51 Sundays. Those hunters are asking for one Sunday a year and that doesn't seem like too much to ask
For what they contribute.
Life can be rough on us dreamers.
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Before I sign on with the revolution, I need some questions answered.
Who gets to pick the people on the new Commission? Will they be fresh out of school or will we raid another agency? Will we get to vote on who fills various positions? Seems as if some think a vote is the fair way. I'm really getting to like Squirrel hunting. Will there be a Squirrel person? Eagles and Hawks? The Legislature thru them under the umbrella of the GC, which seem counterproductive to us hunters. Will the new crew tell the Legislature they can take over the Eagle and Hawks, in that they have a hard enough time with Grouse and Pheasants right now? Do you advocate more or less Game Wardens? Increased penalties for Game Law violations? Should those who are using our GL for bird-watching and not hunting, be required to wear orange during hunting season? Will the GW's enforce it if the catch them not complying.
Re choosing the new Commissioners and biologists: Will PaHick and his gang be on the selection committee? Seems as if they are so intent on change they should have a voice. Will other, as of now, non-committed hunters and those who don't have the time, have a voice of who is on the selection committee. Will we get to vote for who makes up the selection committee? Do you recommend equal representation of gender on the committee? Women in the shooting sports is now one of our largest growing population segments. Race? You know there are others out there other than white males that hunt.
Questions and waiting for answers. Please....
Last edited by battue; 04/21/19.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Jun 2010
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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They can watch birds and hug trees the other 51 Sundays. Those hunters are asking for one Sunday a year and that doesn't seem like too much to ask
For what they contribute. What? No one wants "one Sunday". Everyone who wants Sunday hunting wants all Sundays.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200 |
These threads remind me of some WGFD and MFWP meetings that I have been to.
Some hunters insist that if only more predator control happened, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only the game commission use a lifetime of outdoor knowledge instead of university "knowledge", mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only a 3 point minimum rule be implemented, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that they simply want to hunt and shoot the first buck they see, even if it is a 2X2. They don't care about trophies.
Others insist that if a only unit be made into a draw for non residents, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only does were protected, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only more roads were closed to UTVs, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that more roads be opened up so that they can ride their UTVs around the mountains more.
Luckily, not a one has bitched about lost traditions, that I have heard at least.
I just sit back and listen, happily thinking about the dozens of mule deer bucks I see each season, and the 4x4 bucks I end up taking each season, despite changes in season dates and regs. I am happy knowing that hunters in general know what is best for herds, and for the future of hunting in general.
Life is good...
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,917
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,917 |
Except for one, sounds like a N.M. meeting. Mule deer are struggling in N.M. for sure. Funny that hunters rarely want to discuss drought and the effect on fawn birthrate and recruitment. Easier to blame a person. These threads remind me of some WGFD and MFWP meetings that I have been to.
Some hunters insist that if only more predator control happened, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only the game commission use a lifetime of outdoor knowledge instead of university "knowledge", mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that if only a 3 point minimum rule be implemented, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that they simply want to hunt and shoot the first buck they see, even if it is a 2X2. They don't care about trophies.
Others insist that if a only unit be made into a draw for non residents, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
[b]Others insist that if only does were protected, mule deer wouldn't have their current population probl[/b]em.
Others insist that if only more roads were closed to UTVs, mule deer wouldn't have their current population problem.
Others insist that more roads be opened up so that they can ride their UTVs around the mountains more.
Luckily, not a one has bitched about lost traditions, that I have heard at least.
I just sit back and listen, happily thinking about the dozens of mule deer bucks I see each season, and the 4x4 bucks I end up taking each season, despite changes in season dates and regs. I am happy knowing that hunters in general know what is best for herds, and for the future of hunting in general.
Life is good...
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200 |
Mule deer numbers are down most everywhere from historic highs no doubt, but from historical averages, I am not so sure. Back in the day, bighorns were more numerous than deer, according to some indian and mountain man accounts I have read. Who knows???
Loss of habitat (especially winter habitat) is another big one that hunters talk about, but other hunters insist the amount of farms and crops are the only reason deer survive winter. Then you have those that only care about deer and to hell with elk or antelope and the hunters that like to chase them-as it's all about the deer.
The world keeps turning, and hunters who put their time in keep killing deer...
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,200 |
Please don't get me started on the anti grazing guys...
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