Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Barrel Life and the 6.5 Creedmore

It seems the 6.5 Creedmore is the perfect cartridge in all but one catagory: barrel life. It shoots like a laser, has excellent range and accuracy, relatively slow compared to many cartridges and is probably more efficient than most. However, what causes it to have limited barrel life? My recollection is that certain very high pressure cartridges like 220 Swift wear out barrels quickly whereas the old .308 or 7.62 X 51 mm or 5.56 have long barrel lives. The .243 has a reputation for less than stellar barrel life. I recall Mule Deer indicating something about shoulder angle directing gases being a contributing factor.

Not that I give a rat's patootie about Creedmoors, but where do you get the "short barrel life" from?

I can tell you after competing many years in Highpower rifle competition and NRA Long range there's a finite number of accurate rounds to be fired in any caliber, be it 308,223, 300 win mag or 6.5x284... Bet dollars to donuts in a comp gun the 6.5 CM would give at least 2000 accurate rds down range, which is more than I could say for the 243 or the 6.5x284...In a hunting rifle what would you consider an appropriate round count? For me, 2K is great, 4K better and if 5K is reached I would say I had gotten my moneys worth....

I expect very good barrel life out of my 6.5 Creedmoor.

Watching my 26 Nosler thru the Hawkeye, I'm guessing 1,000 to 1,200 for that one.

The 6.5 CM should double or even triple that number with care and not letting it get too hot.

DF

My Google first hand experience says 3K rounds. That 26 nosler sounds like it has a similar life as the .257 bee. I just had a new barrel put on mine. I would shoot that thing HOT! That won't happen with my new .257 barrel though. That's one reason I bought a creedmoor.

It'a a CREEDMOOR for Heaven's sake, the barrel will last forever and become more and more accurate as it ages.

Borchardt,

I almost posted something about the spelling, but apparently 6.5 Creedmoor critics (who have generally never even fired one) will also never learn to spell.

Have also seen Creedmoore, and even Creadmore.

After the way I performed with mine at the latest Metallic Silhouette match, I think Cried More might be appropriate. GD

I prefer Criedmore, but I'm just a bitter .260 Remington Lover.

How about Crede Moire? Kinda Frenchy-looking, for the folks in Quebec. I wanted to try German, but my keyboard lacks umlauts.

If subjects like popular cartridges ruin your day, maybe something like "Imapussmoor" is more appropriate.

Creedmoor is the Chuck Norris of cartridges, it grows new rifling as needed.

Gosh, sorry about the spelling. Guess I was wrong about it and the internet fiction about 6.5 Creedmoor's barrel life.

On barrel life - I get the impression that it's just popular to talk about barrel life these days, and a lot of the comments come from people who'll never shoot a barrel out. If you aren't someone who'll shoot a couple thousand rounds a year from that one rifle, it's probably not worth worrying about.

on your next barrel, consider the 6.5x47 Lapua as they fit better in magazine length, which translates to your being able to chase the lands!

My question may be simply academic since most people rarely shoot a hunting rifle to the point where accuracy falls off due to throat erosion, etc. However, some rifles are different such as AR's and so on that are used for multigun, classes and so on. My AR is approaching 10,000 rounds but my M70 .243 has close to 700 but used exclusively for hunting and practice for hunting.

Your 243 will eat a barrel faster than a 6.5 Creedmoor.

Rebarreling costs are insignificant to the costs of the bullets, powder, primers , casings in quantities sufficient to wear the barrel out for it to need replacement.. I'd lay odds most barrels that are replaced have nothing to do with being worn out. MB

Magnum Bob,

Which is exactly why every rifle manufacturer I've contacted won't rebarrel their rifles to anything other than the original chambering. They don't charge near as much as even a very "affordable" gunsmith for the service--but they also know that if they did offer rebarreling to another cartridge, rifle loonies would be sending in rifles every time they got bored!

If you're shooting enough to shoot a barrel out then a rebarrel is really not high on your list of expenses.

-Jake

I have heard High Power shooters say 3,500 to 3,800 for the 260 Remington so the Needmoor should get close to 4,000 due to shoulder geometry and a half grain less capacity.
But just a guess.

I'd be willing to bet this guesstimate is a whole lot closer to reality than the OP's shot in the dark.

Everyone compares barrel life to 308. Everything I read says 308 is good for 5000 rounds of match grade accuracy and double that for hunting accuracy. Supposedly the 6.5 should be good for about 1/2 that.

I never see anyone say anything about 270 barrel. With similar bore diameters, and much more powder in a 270 I'd THINK a 270 should wear out sooner. But I've never seen any numbers on that.

Why 1/2 the 308 barrel life?

JMR40,

Good point about the .270. I have shot several .270 barrels out, with NO competition shooting, which obviously would decrease barrel life. In fact I shot out the barrel of my very first .270 (a Remington 700 ADL purchased new in 1974) because it shot so well I was FASCINATED by whacking away with various loads. Plus, I still had it after purchasing my first chronograph five years later, so had to shoot it quite a bit more to see what happened with various loads.

Have yet to shoot out a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel, mostly because I keep trying more of them to see if my initial results (with a Ruger 77 Hawkeye purchased in 2010) were aberrations. It's very first 5-shot group at 100 yards, with Hornady 140-grain factory ammo, measured around .6 inch. I somewhat foolishly sold that rifle a year or two later, because of figuring (1) I'd covered handloading the 6.5 Creedmoor for all time, and (2) I didn't know it would become SO popular.

Have now owned six 6.5 Creedmoors, and extensively shot four others, both factory and semi-custom, such as H-S Precision. The WORST any of them shot was 5 shots in an inch at 100 yards, and my present rifle (a Bergara B-14 Ridge) is pretty much a one-holer with factory ammo. Haven't handloaded for it yet.

But when and if I do shoot out a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel, I would expect it to last at least 3500-4000 rounds in normal hunting use, where the barrel is rarely heated up much.

That Bergara Ridge will be my next 6.5CM.

You must ice box it after every shot ?????
I looked at my friends Browning 26Nosler and it has some fairly serious firecracking in the throat and he has only 150 rounds through it, I'm betting his wont make the 500 round mark

I used to keep a wet towel in my ice cooler to drape over the barrel between shot strings on my .257 bee. Ended up rebarreling and will keep the new barrel cool without having to cool it with a towel.

Bought a 6.5 CM for play time.

PRS shooters could answer this question.

Shilen barrel and I let it cool, don’t burn it up.

I’m guessing about barrel life, extrapolating forward from observed changes at 500 rounds.

As long as it’s shooting sub MOA, who cares what it looks like thru the scope. The scope just helps to keep score.

When it finally goes South at the range, the scope will likely tell why. Then it’s new barrel time.

DF

Nosler reports most of their customers have gotten 1000 rounds or a little more from Nosler rifles before accuracy starts to drop off, and one guy got 1500. I've put 300-some rounds through my 26 Nosler Liberty rifle, and while there's some erosion just in front of the neck portion of the chamber, it's not into the lands yet, and the rifle shoots very well. But on warm days I cool off the barrel with ice-water when it starts to get hot.

I take several rifles to the range, stack hot rifles in vertical position with open bolt. Heat rises and the barrels cool while I'm shooting another rifle.

That works well for me without having to use ice water.

DF

I also like to bring at least 3-4 rifles, if not more, and prop them up with the bolts open. A drum fan helps too.

I have a magnetic gun rack that sticks to my truck fender. I stack hot guns there with open bolt. After I've shot a couple of others, I can start over with the rotation.

Just gotta keep good records as you go.

DF

Anyone that actually will shoot out a barrel and not just have mental masterbation about it... isn’t worried about shooting out a barrel.

I have been using a 12v high volume air inflator like for air mattresses and a short section of rubber tubing to force air from the chamber through the barrel. Works faster than convection in a vertical rifle.

Dirtfarmer,

I generally take 4-6 rifles to the range, and MOST of the year do exactly as you describe--lean them muzzle-up with the action open to let the warm air from inside the barrel rise. Since both the ranges I shoot at are covered, with nice rifle racks, this works MOST of the year in Montana.

But it does not work ALL the year. Generally any time from June through mid-October even our days can get pretty warm, and if I am going to get all my testing done without sitting around waiting for barrels to cool in the shade, ice-water cools them down instantly. Since I'm usually testing handloads for articles, I want the barrel temperature to be as consistent as possible. Have yet to see the ice-water do them any harm.

Have also used a couple gas-flow gadgets that cool down barrels, mostly because people send them to me to test. They work, but not nearly as fast as ice-water.

PS--I am not all that worried about barrel life, as plenty of people are making new barrels pretty much constantly. Instead, I want to get my work done in as little time as possible. I am generally alone at the range, not there to relax and BS with buddies.

Interesting topic for sure. I am slowly working on burning out the barrel on one of my 6.5 creedmoor rifles. The other one, I save for hunting (Tikka T3x Superlite). The rifle that I have been shooting more has been my savage 12fv cabela's exclusive. I really don't care if I toast the barrel on that rifle, as the whole rifle can be bought, at certain times of the year, for $319.00...When I first started loading for the rifle (back in august of last year, I made a note of the OAL for the 140 grain Hornady ELD match bullet. It measured 2.840" OAL to the lands. I loaded them at .020" off the lands and have shot that same OAL for the last 8 months. Here's one of the first targets I shot with said rifle with both factory ammo and my first handloads, where I was working up a load:

This gives you a little comparison of how 1 type of factory ammo does compared to a non fine tuned handload. Both loads use the same 140gr ELD match bullet. The charge wt the rifle dotes on is 41.5 grains of H4350, and that is what I've stuck with for the last 8 months.

Here's how the rifle shot with a fairly new barrel (after 150 rounds downrange) that was starting to break in:

The throat was still very fresh, with no signs of errosion.

Now, when I measure OAL, the lands are at 2.865". So, in 1000 rounds down the tube, the throat errosion is .025". To me, that is not much at all. The other night, I loaded some ammo to 2.845" just to check accuracy. I may even have to re-adjust for optimum powder charge as well. I plan on shooting those loads this weekend to make a comparison. But as of right now, at 1,040 rounds down the barrel of my 6.5 creedmoor, I don't see any loss of accuracy. Here's one of the last groups I shot with said rifle when it was right at the 1,000 round mark:


I'll continue to keep track of how this rifle does and make note of when accuracy finally starts dropping off. Could be interesting...

My Bergara is the Woodsman, accuracy has been outstanding.Would really love to have a couple of wind free hours with it. Having the prettiest wood I have seen on a factory rifle in a long time is a bonus. I'll likely be ready for something else before I shoot 3500 rounds through it.

Just don't back the truck up too.

No, gotta leave it where you park it.

I have a better bench, this one is easier to set up. I even redesigned this one. Have a better version.

DF

.....word.....

It’s a consumable. Just as are bullets, powder, etc.

Think the quality/hardeness of the blank plays just as much of a roll in life as does strings of fire, powder used etc. I scoped 2 barrels last week from the same maker that I had loose off actions, a 6.5 CM with right at 2200 and a 6.5x47L with 3400. Both still shoot sub MOA easily with good ES/SDs and all I’ve ever done is adjust the COAL to keep the bullets on the lands and the powder to keep me in my “window”. I’ve chased out on the Lapua as far as I am comfortable with, and looking in the bore I saw minimal firecracking in front of the throat. With 2” of shank I’ve got plenty room for a set back and I’ll keep running it till it starts giving me a reason not to. I’ve got others from other makers that I’ve schit canned or run solely as practice barrels with less rounds through them and far worse looking bores.

i have Remington 700 Varmint 223 Rem. 8-9,000 rounds dog towns lots of heat over a few years and target shooting

Remington 700 Custom Lilja barrel 257 Weatherby Mag. about 1200 rounds it was fast 100 gr bullet 4,000 fps /Ohler used

My Bergara is the Woodsman, accuracy has been outstanding.Would really love to have a couple of wind free hours with it. Having the prettiest wood I have seen on a factory rifle in a long time is a bonus. I'll likely be ready for something else before I shoot 3500 rounds through it.


That's gotta be about the best piece of wood ever put on a Bergara...

DF

Improved version. And, long enough for the free standing Magnetospeed, no barrel contact.

And, with this version, one's arm doesn't get into the tailgate cable...

I shot a .270 until I couldn't seat a 130-grain bullet long enough to reach the rifling. Took 32 years. I have no idea of the round count, but it was my main hunting rifle most of that time. Despite the worn throat, the last three-shot group was 3/4". I sent it back to the factory for a new barrel because I was restoring the rifle to as-new condition so I could pass it down. Given how walnut and blue is no longer favored, I doubt it will ever need another.

DF, is that a #1 Protektor?

I'm guessing the life would be almost the same as a 6.5x55 Swede unless of course, the campfire knows of some reason why not?

No, it's a Wichita Arms BR 1000 rest. My wife is from Wichita and I visited Wichita Arms while up there visiting her folks around 40+ yrs ago.

It wasn't a big place, but interesting. It is a good, solid cast iron rest. I see they're now in Mulberry KS, which is in SE KS, Crawford Co, which is on the MO line, a good ways from Wichita.

Those are Protektor front and rear bags.

The orange aluminum rest I rigged to hold the Magnetospeed is Hoppe's

DF

Thanks DF. I am very familiar with both rests, as I have and use both. I recently bought a protector #1 front bag, but was wondering about the #2 protektor front bag, as i place the front bag closer to the front action screw, than you do. Im thinking yours is a #1 protektor, as it is narrower than the #2.

Not sure, will check.

You're probably right.

DF

No number on the pad. It’s about 2” wide at the top, less down in the recess.

DF

Thanks DF. The one I use on my Wichita Arms, is a number 3 I think. I lay a piece of leather over it because my rifles float around in it. I just bought a number 1 Protektor for my Hoppes rest, but I think I'll replace the #3 with a #2. Should make for a more stable set-up. Oh, since this is a 6.5 creed thread:


I developed a load for this Tikka T3x Superlite, I'm not going to try and burn the barrel out on this one. That's what the el cheapo savage is for.... . The Tikka has 100 rounds downrange now, and shoots like this:


I'll be curious to compare how the Tikka barrel does for wear vs. the Savage barrel....Time and rounds downrange will tell....

It makes sense that some steels will wear better than others.

I just wonder if rough factory barrels will wear faster than slicker custom barrels. Never heard that mentioned.

Some say SS barrels wear better than chrome moly barrels.

And, how barrels are handled has to be a factor.

How bad does a barrel have to be, to be considered finished?. What's the "cut off" point?

It's not a simple question, not a simple answer.

DF

Stainless steel has less contaminates in it which can start to pit. It also machines a little smoother but I am not sure if this is why they last longer or it is the metallurgy of the steel, probably both. Micro lands wear faster than larger bore groove combinations. Polygonal barrels are said to wear longer because there are no acute angles to erode. I am betting a poly barrel Creedmoor could get close to 5,000 rounds. David Tubb was shooting poly barrels for at least one season but I haven't seen any info on round counts with them.

6.5x55 may last longer even though it holds more powder 3-4 grains but is usually loaded to lower pressures. Heat which goes with pressure is what erodes the barrel.

I am stealing that.

You are right buddy. Exactly what i was thinking..

Shooter behavior matters too - I have a buddy who can’t stop if he’s hitting what he wants... he’ll shoot until you can’t touch the barrel.

Anytime you touch a barrel and your hand jerks away from heat it means the barrel is over 180 degrees on the surface - and you should stop shooting because you are burning up the throat.

It also matters how hot you load..

I figured 1000 rds of creedmoor is about $390 for components, including 100 pieces of brass.

If you shoot three times that much, treat yourself to a new barrel, you deserve it!

Good brass life I guess

It may be true that more Creedmoor barrels are wearing out. Not because they are barrel burners but because they are fun to shoot and folks are shooting them more and more often. Hard to wear out a 300 Win Mag barrel when you can only stand to shoot it 1/2 dozen times before you are beat up from recoil. I know when I go out with my Creedmoor I average around 40 shots per session and tend to go out at least once per week. With my 30-06 I would only take it out a handfull of times per year.

On average how fast do you guys shoot. Typically I like 2 minutes between shots starting after the first round with sporter weight barrels and cartridges 22-250 and up. My 223 barrels get much less respect and though I have put some throat erosion on several 223 rifles I have yet to shoot one "out" of being able fulfill it's purpose. I think I am getting ready to go through a 7-08 phase so the Creedmoor will have to wait it's turn. I shoot no less than 200 rounds a week ( not on the same rifle generally) so I do put wear and tear on barrels. And average shoot for groups for me takes 20 minutes or a bit more for 10 shots.

I haven't read the whole thread, but isn't one of the sacred 'fire responses that "They make new barrels every day"?

You will never get everything that you want.

When I was in the military, a barrel was called a WRA - weapons replaceable assembly. It was expected to wear out and need replacement. While you and your rifle are not in the military, barrels are still WRAs. Like any mechanical device, the parts wear out. It would be best to chase after the R&D people, but they will probably tell you that better, stronger and longer lasting barrels can be made with today's technology, but are cost prohibitive.

My next project after the shoulder heals. Thanks for the inspiration.

I think the Creedmoor barrel will last a lot better than some of the other 6.5s. I have torched two 6.5-284 barrels in the past 7-8 years. One has about 750-800 and the other 1000 ish. R17 was the culprit in my opinion. I try not to use R17 in high volume stuff anymore. Most guys will never wear a barrel out, If you really do, just put another one on it. Only time it is a big issue is if you are shooting matches regularly and wear one out mid season when you don't have time to fit another one.

I like it. Does the wind shake the truck a lot? Seems it would be a bit of a project to keep the crosshairs on the target in Wyoming or Texas lately as windy as it's been.

Yep.”it ain’t even broke in yet!”

Been shooting PRS and NRL matches for 10+ yrs now. Mostly 6.5x47, little yet older brother to the 6.5 CM. I retired my first Krieger barrel at 3500 rounds when I was having trouble keeping 5 shots in 1 moa.

Alan

Bitte sehr, mein Herr. Hier ihre 6,5 Crüüdmoor.