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I read a lot of old historical accounts of life back in the mountain man days and the written diaries of the early settlers along with native American history in sometimes violent settling of the western lands of the future USA.

In a few of the tomes I've read there has been a passing mention of a species of mule deer that was about a third bigger than the size of current day mule deer and double the size of a whitetail. I've also read Indian legends of massive mule deer that were nearly as big as a mature elk.

I'm currently reading the actual diary of Lewis and Clark. Clark mentions the giant mule deer. 8' tall including horns.

Legend or fact?

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They were probably not hunted as hard as they currently are. A mature Northern Mule Deer can get pretty large if left unmolested, I seriously doubt they were shot out or exist out there although ScenarShooter and JGRaider and a few others here are trying very hard to disprove that.

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I would give Lewis & Clark the benefit of any doubt. The big ones are the first to go...and the gene pool is diminished.

An older mule deer buck with 200" of high rack above his ears is an incredibly impressive animal. I don't know how tall they can get at horn height, but they are to me, an awesome critter.


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Morewood;
Top of the morning to you sir, I trust all is well in your world.

While I am far from anything resembling an expert on mulies, they've fascinated me since I saw the first ones when I moved here to BC the first time in '81.

In one of his fine books, John Barsness has a photo of a buck he killed way up the Rockies near the medicine line. It's positively huge in body, way, way bigger than anything I've seen on the hoof in BC, Alberta or Saskatchewan in the last nearly 40 years.

There are, in my experience anyway, quite a bit of difference in both body and antler size even regionally out here, for instance on the drier west side of the valley where we live, a first rack mulie would average 10-15lbs less carcass weight than ones taken from the timber on the wetter east side.

Anyone I've known who killed a really big bodied mulie invariably took it on the east side - or a couple valleys west where it's wetter again.

Just a few random thoughts this morning on your query and not much more. I am hopeful that some true experts chime in this morning - as mentioned Scenar hunts the big prairie strain mulies and JG chases some big bodied desert strains.

All the best to you as we head into warmer weather.

Dwayne

Last edited by BC30cal; 05/28/19. Reason: added for clarity - hopefully

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Don't kid yourself, there are still big deer out there. I shot this one on the way to the range...

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Originally Posted by Morewood
I'm currently reading the actual diary of Lewis and Clark. Clark mentions the giant mule deer. 8' tall including horns.

Legend or fact?



FACT: I have NEVER seen a deer with horns. Antlers YES, horns NO.


James Pepper: There's no law west of Dodge and no God west of the Pecos. Right, Mr. Chisum? John Chisum: Wrong, Mr. Pepper. Because no matter where people go, sooner or later there's the law. And sooner or later they find God's already been there.
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yeah, we leave the more technical aspects to the educated...


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Holy cow! That is a TOAD, Shrapnel. Congratulations! I hope you had that big boy mounted.

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Originally Posted by Owl
Originally Posted by Morewood
I'm currently reading the actual diary of Lewis and Clark. Clark mentions the giant mule deer. 8' tall including horns.

Legend or fact?



FACT: I have NEVER seen a deer with horns. Antlers YES, horns NO.


You are of course absolutely correct. Thank you for your valuable contribution.

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Morewood,

Would appreciate the date of that Lewis & Clark notation. I have read the Journals a few times for mule deer references, and cannot recall running across that.


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Originally Posted by Morewood
Originally Posted by Owl
Originally Posted by Morewood
I'm currently reading the actual diary of Lewis and Clark. Clark mentions the giant mule deer. 8' tall including horns.

Legend or fact?



FACT: I have NEVER seen a deer with horns. Antlers YES, horns NO.


You are of course absolutely correct. Thank you for your valuable contribution.

sheesh


Me and everyone in my circles call so horns too, guess we're just a buncha country bumpkins.... Grin


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Back in the early 80s a friend shot a monster bodied Mule Deer. Its head was leaning against the front of the 8' bed pickup it was in and it's tail end was resting against the tailgate. People who initially saw it thought it was an elk even though the antlers/horns weren't much. It was over 9 years old and shot in the Rocky Mountain Front of MT. It took two strong guys to move it. I have never seen one with a bigger body.

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Hey, what is wrong with you guys?

I know what's wrong with the local population around here...mostly genetic...:)


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Originally Posted by Judman


Me and everyone in my circles call so horns too, guess we're just a buncha country bumpkins.... Grin



Me and my buds do too Jud. smile


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Originally Posted by JGRaider
Originally Posted by Judman


Me and everyone in my circles call so horns too, guess we're just a buncha country bumpkins.... Grin



Me and my buds do too Jud. smile


Johnny, out West we only count one side of the horns, too. Probably because counting past 5 would require a diploma. 😎


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Originally Posted by shrapnel


Don't kid yourself, there are still big deer out there. I shot this one on the way to the range...

[Linked Image]



What did he dress at?


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Originally Posted by Beaver10
Originally Posted by JGRaider
Originally Posted by Judman


Me and everyone in my circles call so horns too, guess we're just a buncha country bumpkins.... Grin



Me and my buds do too Jud. smile


Johnny, out West we only count one side of the horns, too. Probably because counting past 5 would require a diploma. 😎

Is that why WT are counted different than MD and BT? Those eastern boys are edjumukated and us western boys are a bunch of rubes? Ha!


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Originally Posted by Beaver10
Originally Posted by JGRaider
Originally Posted by Judman


Me and everyone in my circles call so horns too, guess we're just a buncha country bumpkins.... Grin



Me and my buds do too Jud. smile


Johnny, out West we only count one side of the horns, too. Probably because counting past 5 would require a diploma. 😎


🤣🤣that’s why we call 6 point elk, 4 point with doubles!!!


Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.

Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Local legend, in parts of NM, claim that the truly old/mature/smart mule deer have a "stone in their heart". I've talked to locals, who swear, they've cut open the heart....and found the stone, inside! Then they saved the stone, and threw the horns away!

Yes.....horns. Anything that grows out of the head, is a horn. Antlers are for making chandeliers and for doggie chew toys!

Western count = 1 side.

Eastern count = both sides.

Texan count = what they would of been next year!


We all learn things differently, just depends where your from.....and the people that taught you!


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Texan count!!! 🤣🤣🤣


Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.

Ain’t easy havin pals.
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