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How do you explain the atrocities in the OT?

Yep.....

I no longer respond nor even read posts by Starman. Rimfire and DBT just joined that club.

Simple trolls..... probably young ones.

The contradictions are there. The atrocities are there. The problems with the bible, and other holy books, Qur'an, Gita, etc, are real problems. Which includes the contradictions between holy books, with each set of believers disagreeing on the nature of God and theology in general.

many christians remain divided on that, not all read scripture as meaning ordinary sinners will be tormented for ever in the Lake.
but all so typical of of so many christians, you think your interpretation is superior and trumps others.

the 2nd death is very specific to human sinners, whereas the devil , false profit and beast face a very different fate
not described as death.

Rev.20:10
And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet
had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever".





Yes, an everlasting destruction , not torment....God destroys the wicked sinner[ once and for all] in a final act of annihilation.
otherwise known as = 2nd death. ....a final irreversible death sentence/termination/destruction one cannot be redeemed from.



How do you equate death (being destoyed-turned to spent ash) as a form of etenal 'burning' torment?
Do you know the difference between executing someone and specific intentional eternal torture?

Malachi 4:1

"Surely the day is coming; it will burn like a furnace. All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and the day that is coming
will set them on fire," says the LORD Almighty. " Not a root or a branch will be left to them."

Wow imagine that ...God says there will be nothing remaining of the transgressor.

how does one torture and torment forever what has been totally destroyed and amounts to nothing?

If one has been turned to spent ash of no worth or value, then what actually remains that can continue to burn for eternity?
its easy to see that there is an actual end to the burning/consumption process for sinners.

However, nowhere does it say the devil , false profit and Beast will be turned to ASH, because their fate ( Rev20:10) is described
as different and very specific (ie; tormented forever).

Not much forgiveness there...

might not be all that much about forgiveness? i don't know.

if, i say if, we're in the fifth great period of time, the other four already past...

then we'll probably be melted back into the urth.

well, some might escape?

the urth begins again.

a new day.

creation.

TF49 Sorry you can't take a good debate. I'm 66 and doc. gives me less than a year to go.I'll know the answer pretty soon.

AFAIC for myself id just as soon you go to hell. Im still rooting for you to see the light and be saved because of Him. He doesnt want the devil to win and get you and subject you to the misery all of us deserve.

The docs may say youre gonna die, but its your choice. He says you can live forever and never truly die.

Whats it cost you to ask Christ to come into your heart and make you a believer? Nothing ventured, nothing gained. You dont have to give up smoking, drinking or cussin and you prolly already gave up the good stuff.

All you then gotta do is ask Him to forgive your sorry sinning hide and mean you are sorry for having done it your way as us believers have done.

You take that step and what have you lost- nothing.

Good fortune and God bless as your needs may be.

jaguartx Not gonna happen. EVERYBODY dies. I'll feel just like I did before I was born.(nothing)

jag, i can sense that you truly believe that the greek & egyptian ideology did not dilute or change the hebrew theology.

others disagree. but the many who walk among us buy into the greek & egyptian dilution. the age of the intellect, the ego, and reasoning.

and perhaps they are correct. possibly overall it would be better for the rank & file if it turned out they are correct.

in the final summation, those who helped gain success are rewarded, those who didn't help such achievement are punished?

Satan after being cast out, still has certain limited access to heavenly realms, he wasn't totally exiled.
however I don't know of Satan just strolling in whenever he wanted unrestricted, but he did come when
summoned by GOD on occasion. [as in Job 1]

God also set the strict parameters of what Satan could apply to Job, and Satan fully obeyed-adhered to such conditions-restrictions set by God.

Imagine that ..Satan doing exactly what God asked of him...do you know of any christian that can fully obey God to the letter....???



Just remember, its not the devil , but the christian God that has dominion and controls and sets the fiery conditions in hell that they fear so much.

some of the metaphysical folks who dwell on urth believe or project the possibility that god runs about 10 or 11 dimensions.

satan runs some 6 or 7 dimensions, or at least can move through them with abandon and purpose.

mere humans are entrapped in 4 dimensions: height, width, length and time.

and then the games begin. and folks working & paying taxes to gov't.

i am glad we can discuss such esoteric things with abandon.

Though some days it's fun to point out how absurd their assertions are.

That's a bad attitude. It is not for you to judge what misery you deserve. It is true that we cannot be saved by our own merit and we are charged with doing the best we can to follow God's laws. We are bound to fail and God knows this and is of infinite mercy. We are his children after all. Effort counts, bigly! End of sermon. I generally hate sermons.

TF49 sees himself as a victim [he made that very clear earlier on] , he imagines that people are 'stomping' on his free-will ability to believe what he wants.

yet nobody has asked him nor forced him, to do anything he doesn't want to do.

yet at the same time he will devalue another christians approach to their personal faith. telling them; "what you believe doesnt matter"

he also cheapens the discussion of GOD and spiritual matters to he deemed a a mere .'contest' or competition, ...but get this -- he then calls others
childish and immature.

but he tells folks and wants folks to believe he holds the "truth' ...and that he is here to "help" guide people to God...

i didnt. Dont shoot the messenger.

I think you're confusing beliefs with truths.

shooting feral dogs, along georgia dirt type backroads help to save the fawn populations.

beyond that, the messenger has been shot dead more than once already.

it seems there's tons of faulty lights shining into the dark, poorly.

some lights have beams that illuminate locally, others afar.

all in a mass means that something gets illuminated.

Yes...the bible tells us that God created evil. And the book of Job has Satan and God having a friendly wager, like good buddies. Satan only acting according to the directions of God.