Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Brand new barrel process

I'm gonna post this as an inquisitive post just to try and see what everyone is doing.......I dont really want this to turn in to a who is right and who is wrong thread.

When you get a new custom barrel on a rifle what is your process of beginning to shoot the rifle (breaking it in if you wanna call it that).

I figure a good many of you here are dead set on highly accurate rifles and not just some redneck shooting in the woods 75-100 yards.

I find my BTO measurement to the lands with bullet of choice...
Run my 10-12 shot string over MagnetoSpeed to find max pressure and my flat spots in velocity....
Pick my powder charge accordingly...

Load a couple hundred and go shoot it. The shoot/clean, shoot/clean “break in” routine is a waste of time with the custom barrels of today IMO.

Follow the manufacturers breakin process...

Some guys will tell you that you are only breaking in the throat (machined) area but a couple other things to consider...

For instance- I would use the SAME bullets to break in that you are going to shoot in competition / hunting - Jack materials vary and have impacts to how much it’s going to foul, and clean... don’t use one bullet to break in and a different bullet to shoot.

After that do a ladder test to see where you have flat spots (a group of elevation )

Exactly this.

at risk of sounding stupid...BTO?

When you running he string over the magnetospeed i assume you are incrementally increasing in powder with each shot?

...base to ogive...

Yes, incremental increases.

This^^^

I accomplish barrel break-in by zeroing the sights, be that a scope or fixed sights.

I break in a barrel only after deep meditation .
Clean - meditate - shoot - meditate repeat , ten shots takes five days .

Give it a good cleaning and shoot it all the info. out there doesn't proves any process means anything .
After a day of shooting clean it .

If anybody read the benchrest guys story of shooting in the concrete plant with absolutely NO WIND you should come to the conclusion that we/ shooters get way too wrapped up in way too many details that don't matter .

A guy here or elsewhere online bought a CVA 33-30 break barrel and wanted recommdations on breaking in the barrel - benchrest style - got all kinds of good answers .

I make sure mine is clean prior to firing the first shot. There’s always the potential for some crud to be left in the bore from the chambering process. After that I shoot it. That’s it...

John

Depending on what the smith asked, and the customer asked for the throat length may be setup for long or short bullets... longer is typically the safe side.

So the BTO is something you the customer can ask the smith to setup for you so the base of the bullet is just above the neck should junction.

However with most hunting bullets - they are to long anyway so you have to seat the below that...

But it’s a good exercise to look at - don’t forget you have a magazine OAL issue to worry about as well.

Bartlien,
The age old question, “Breaking in the New Barrel”. Opinions very a lot here, and this is a very subjective topic. For the most part, the only thing you are breaking in, is the throat area of the barrel. The nicer the finish that the Finish Reamer or Throating Reamer leaves, the faster the throat will break in.

Shoot one round and clean for the first two rounds individually. Look to see what the barrel is telling you. If I’m getting little to no copper out of it, I sit down and shoot the gun. Say 4 – 5 round groups and then clean. If the barrel cleans easily and shoots well, we consider it done.

If the barrel shows some copper or is taking a little longer to clean after the first two, shoot a group of 3 rounds and clean. Then a group of 5 and clean.

After you shoot the 3rd group and 5th group, watch how long it takes to clean. Also notice your group sizes. If the group sizes are good and the cleaning is getting easier or is staying the same, then shoot 4 – 5 round groups.

If fouling appears to be heavy and taking a while to clean, notice your group sizes. If group sizes are good and not going sour, you don’t have a fouling problem. Some barrels will clean easier than others. Some barrels may take a little longer to break in. Remember the throat. Fouling can start all the way from here. We have noticed sometimes that even up to approximately 100 rounds, a barrel can show signs of a lot of copper, but it still shoots really well and then for no apparent reason, you will notice little to no copper and it will clean really easy.

This is meant as guide lines only. There is no hard and fast rule for breaking in a barrel.

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Krieger,

With any premium barrel that has been finish lapped -- such as your Krieger Barrel --, the lay or direction of the finish is in the direction of the bullet travel, so fouling is minimal compared to a barrel with internal tooling marks. This is true of any properly finish-lapped barrel regardless of how it is rifled. If it is not finish-lapped, there will be reamer marks left in the bore that are directly across the direction of the bullet travel. This occurs even in a button-rifled barrel as the button cannot completely iron out these reamer marks.

Because the lay of the finish is in the direction of the bullet travel, very little is done to the bore during break-in, but the throat is another story. When your barrel is chambered, by necessity there are reamer marks left in the throat that are across the lands, i.e. across the direction of the bullet travel. In a new barrel they are very distinct; much like the teeth on a very fine file.

When the bullet is forced into the throat, copper dust is removed from the jacket material and released into the gas which at this temperature and pressure is actually a plasma. The copper dust is vaporized in this plasma and is carried down the barrel. As the gas expands and cools, the copper comes out of suspension and is deposited in the bore. This makes it appear as if the source of the fouling is the bore when it is actually for the most part the new throat.

If this copper is allowed to stay in the bore, and subsequent bullets and deposits are fired over it, copper which adheres well to itself, will build up quickly and may be difficult to remove later. So when we break in a barrel, our goal is to get the throat “polished without allowing copper to build up in the bore. This is the reasoning for the fire-one-shot-and-clean procedure.

Every barrel will vary slightly in how many rounds they take to break in For example a chrome moly barrel may take longer to break in than stainless steel because it is more abrasion resistant even though it is a similar hardness. Also chrome moly has a little more of an affinity for copper than stainless steel so it will usually show a little more color if you are using a chemical cleaner. Rim Fire barrels can take an extremely long time to break in, sometimes requiring several hundred rounds or more. But cleaning can be lengthened to every 25-50 rounds. The break-in procedure and the cleaning procedure are really the same except for the frequency. Remember the goal is to get or keep the barrel clean while breaking in the throat with bullets being fired over it.

Finally, the best way to tell if the barrel is broken in is to observe the patches; i.e. when the fouling is reduced. This is better than some set number of cycles of shoot and clean as many owners report practically no fouling after the first few shots, and more break-in would be pointless. Conversely, if more is required, a set number would not address that either. Besides, cleaning is not a completely benign procedure so it should be done carefully and no more than necessary.
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Lilja,
We recommend that your new Lilja rifle barrel be properly broken-in to obtain the best accuracy. A proper break-in will help ensure that your barrel will clean easily in the future and that you will achieve maximum accuracy potential. Please follow these important instructions.

We are concerned with two types of fouling: copper fouling, which is caused by bullet jacket material being left in the barrel, and powder fouling. During the first few rounds a lot of copper fouling will be left in the barrel. It is important to remove this fouling completely, after each shot, to help prevent a build-up later on. Powder fouling is ongoing, but easy to remove. Do not use moly-coated bullets during the break-in procedure.
Break-in Procedure

For an effective break-in the barrel should be cleaned after every shot for the first 10-12 rounds or until copper fouling stops. Our procedure is to push a cotton patch that is wet with solvent through the barrel. This will remove much of the powder fouling and wet the inside of the barrel with solvent. Next, wet a bronze brush (not a nylon brush) with solvent and stroke the barrel 5-10 times. Follow this by another wet patch and then one dry patch. Now soak the barrel with a strong copper removing solvent until all of the blue mess is removed from the barrel. The copper fouling will be heavy for a few rounds and then taper off quickly in just one or two shots. Once it has stopped or diminished significantly it is time to start shooting 5 shot groups, cleaning after each one. After 25-30 rounds clean at a normal interval of 10-25 rounds. Your barrel is now broken-in.
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dave

How should I break-in my new Shilen barrel?
Break-in procedures are as diverse as cleaning techniques. Shilen, Inc. introduced a break-in procedure mostly because customers seemed to think that we should have one. By and large, we don't think breaking-in a new barrel is a big deal. All our stainless steel barrels have been hand lapped as part of their production, as well as any chrome moly barrel we install. Hand lapping a barrel polishes the interior of the barrel and eliminates sharp edges or burrs that could cause jacket deformity. This, in fact, is what you are doing when you break-in a new barrel through firing and cleaning.
Here is our standard recommendation: Clean after each shot for the first 5 shots. The remainder of the break-in is to clean every 5 shots for the next 50 shots. During this time, don't just shoot bullets down the barrel during this 50 shot procedure. This is a great time to begin load development. Zero the scope over the first 5 shots, and start shooting for accuracy with 5-shot groups for the next 50 shots. Same thing applies to fire forming cases for improved or wildcat cartridges. Just firing rounds down a barrel to form brass without any regard to their accuracy is a mistake. It is a waste of time and barrel life.
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Proof
Barrel break-in is performed in order to smooth out any
micro-roughness in the bore that may occur after initial projectiles
leave an uneven, and possibly excessive, distribution of copper
in the bore, which is why it is sometimes necessary to use
copper solvent. However, it’s not necessary to remove every
trace of copper. Don’t overthink barrel break-in.
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Hawk Hill
The following steps are our suggested procedure for breaking in your new barrel.

1. Shoot 5 individual shots, cleaning after each shot by running a patch wet with solvent till clean. Use a quality solvent.

2. Fire a 3-shot group cleaning after third shot. Repeat this 3-shot/cleaning process two more times.

-This should have your Hawk Hill barrel broke in well. If you need further instructions or have any questions please contact us.
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BENCHMARK BARRELS

Recommended Barrel Break-in Procedure:
-Shoot and clean after each shot for 8 rounds - clean with a proven copper solvent*
-After the first 8 rounds, clean after every 3-5 shot group for 4 groups - clean with a proven copper solvent*
-Follow your normal cleaning regimen after the break-in process.
* We find Bore Tech Eliminator to be an excellent choice, but most copper solvents are sufficient. FOLLOW THE MANUFACTURERS RECOMMENDED PROCEDURE FOR USE OF THEIR PRODUCT!!
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Pac-Nor
For best results, of course, it is necessary to 'season' it and use proper cleaning equipment. We like the Dewey coated rods, a good bore guide, copper/bronze brushes and cotton flannel patches, the appropriate size to keep that jag and rod in the middle of the bore. You will need a good bore solvent, like KG 3, Shooters Choice or CR-10 to loosen the fouling, followed by a scrubbing with Holland's Witches Brew or KG 2. After cleaning, nullify the solvents with rubbing alcohol and patch dry. Finish with Tetra Gun Oil, KG 4 or Holland's Bbl Break-in Fluid. Never shoot a dry bore as this will greatly promote copper fouling.

Chris recommends:
Shoot one, clean, for first ten rounds; shoot three, clean, for next thirty rounds; shoot five, clean, while working up load. Allow bbl to cool to the touch before testing a new load to avoid unnecessary throat erosion.

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That about cover it?
dave

I do it because I spend a lot of money and time getting a rifle set up like I like with a new barrel and it's a small investment to ensure it's taken care of. Maybe it helps, maybe it doesn't, but it sure doesn't hurt. The barrel makers mostly say do it, pretty much all the better gunsmiths say do it, and most of the best benchrest shooters say they do it, so I do it. It doesn't take much time and gives me a chance to chronograph some loads and get my scope zeroed. Unless someone can give me a reason why it's bad to break in a barrel I'll continue to do it. Saying "it's not needed" isn't good enough, give me a reason why it's not good for my barrel.

Barrel makers say it's good.
Top gunsmiths say it's good.
Top benchrest shooters say it's good.

Drunk guys making youtube videos throwing rifles against rocks say it's bad.

Which one do I trust?

Clean...one shot...clean...one shot.

Clean...three shots...clean...three shots.

Clean...5 shots...clean...five shots.

Clean...10 shots...clean...10shots.

Clean...10 shots.

Clean (only fouling) 20 shots.

Clean (only fouling) 20 shots.

Copper Equilibrium realized.

ONLY CLEAN FOULING.

Same. If it's a good shooting barrel and a keeper, I will strip it clean and DBC it after initial load work up.

^^^^^^
Yup

It's already a 'custom' barrel. If the maker didn't lap the barrel before shipping, or did a pi$$-poor job of it (besides looking for another barrel maker) you might want to do a little break-in. But, every 'custom ' barrel I've gotten from a variety of vendors has never needed anything more than what Josh stated.

Clean shoot repeat till cleaning is needed.

I didn’t say “break in” itself isn’t needed, i just totally skip all the feel good rod and patch pushing. I consider that first 200ish rounds my “break in” and will usually shoot that in a 1-2 outings off the couch. Brass is fire formed, the barrel should be settled in and past any “speeding up”. Only then do I really pin my chrono numbers down and true the ballistics up.

Past that, I let the barrels tell me when and if it needs a cleaning. I’ve gone to Hawk Hills on about everything and a number of those went the life of the barrel with never having a rod/patch pushed through them.

Load & shoot

I rarely EVER clean my barrels. All of my stuff shoots under 1 moa.

Clean it after it arrives from gunsmith....then shoot the [bleep] out of it!!

I have a Krieger right now that shoots best only after it has about 75 rounds through it.

The only break in I do is to clean new barrels with Kroil. Why Kroil? Because it can get between the barrel and any fine steel particles left in the barrel and lift them out.

You need to shoot some of the challenges in the AR threads. for long range just under 1 MOA doesn't really say much at least to me.
But for most purposes these days its more than enough.

I'm not saying lots of cleaning is needed though.

Over many years of competitive shooting, and I"m guessing not all that many folks shoot or shot 10-20K rounds a year, the barrels we didn't break in were harder to clean and needed cleaning more often. Accuracy was pretty typical though for the most part, not a lot of difference that I could tell, though I felt that the barrels we broke in often shot rounder groups. They certainly cleaned easier. And tended to be taken to a longer life.

And for the minor work involved in breaking in a tube, vs the cost, its just to easy to do some form of break in.

That's as big a waste time, effort, and bullets as barrel cleaning is.

Actually for long range work its not a waste at all. But then again not everyone needs the long range accuracy or shoots as many rounds. IE I can go 500 rounds or so without cleaning and no effect or not much. Whats anyones elses definition of how long between cleaning?

If it were only needing service rifle match winning accuracy out to only 600 then I could shoot a barrel dead likely, without cleaning. But at some point you clean depending on your needs.

As to large group shots like the challenge, yes you are right and no you are not. If not shooting at least 10 or 20 shot groups at some point, you never know what the gun does as it warms.
OTOH if you shoot 1 shot groups on the same target 10 or so days in a row you have done the same thing. Essentially the same with 3 or 5 shot groups but they have to be on the same target.

I"m not saying this even tells what the gun does, but it certainly tells what the shooter/gun combo are capable of. VS saying I shot this one group one time.... like the group I shot once, new Kreiger after break in, lol, at 600, 5 shots just around 1.250 inches... thats just a good group for sure, but the gun was not capable of repeating it.

But then again around a campfire face to face we would all have a super time discussing, and cussing.

Putting that first round where it needs to go is the most important in matches and in game shooting for sure.

Back to cleaning... I have no clue how many rounds our hunting 308 has since cleaning... I think its about 40 right now... simply don't need to shoot it now that we know what it does and have data. But were I shooting 1000 in a match, then it would get cleaned after a couple of matches or when I noticed the Rock tube accuracy start to get weird. IE groups climbing or falling would be an indicator of a bit of powder/carbon fouling that needed to go very likely.

Do you honestly think myself, or any other experienced big game hunter(who doesn't partake in that stupid challenge here) doesn't know you need to shoot multiple, repeatable groups before trusting that particular load to ethically take the animals you're hunting? That's a pretty egotistical stance. I've been hunting big game animals for 47 years now and to this day I have never shot 10 times, or even close to that, in succession, at big/medium game animal.

But but but 30 years ago I did such and such....

Careful, you’re going to set the idiot from Orygun into a tail spin.

I have over the last month chambered 3 rifles with Bartlein barrels:


With a month, they will be sighted in, fill a doe tag, and be put in storage.

There is no time for a break in.

+1

dave

If you need to ask someone a question about barrels,or cite someone else about barrels,rest fhuqking ASSURED that you "know" nothing about barrels. Hint. Congratulations?!?

I VERY much enjoy the notion,that Windowlickers are soothed in Pogo Sticking something to and fro within a bore,because they are "ahead" of the curve and the last thing I'd wanna do is steal that "thunder". Hint. LAUGHING!

Personally,I only have boolits enter bores,barring a Saltwater Immersion(it happens). New bores are cleaned sterile initially,to pave the path for moly introduction,excepting Rimfires of course. That fhuqks alotta folks up,because it deeply compromises more than a few Myths and Wives Tales. Hint.

Delving deeper...I've long believed it prudent to prove wares in advance of their Utility Christening. Mainly because it is both warm and fuzzy. I'd MUCH rather weed out wares well prior to crunch time,rather than have it cost me an opportunity. Do so for more than a few decades and trends more than appear and malady is easily circumvented from inception,which don't hurt Production. Hint.

Bores take a far better lick,than most would surmise. If it ain't broke,I'm in no hurry to fix it...but only have a couple few hunnert spouts to reflect upon. Hint.

Zero retention and tracking matter wayyyyyyyyyy more than Pogo Sticking every will and Windowlickers are in the greatest of hurries to overlook same and/or make "excuses" for it. That "approach" is simply funnier than fhuq! Hint.

To the point.

Warm And Fuzzy Round One RINK

Reality ain't for everyone and you Delusional DUMB Fhuqks are a hoot!






Re-to the point.

Warm And Fuzzy Round Two RINK

You gals be SURE to "convince" yourselves you got it going on and PLEASE keep extolling your Clueless Fhuqking Bullschit aloud,with all the High Pitched Nasal Whining you can muster and copious conviction. Your Safe Queen Chronicles are simply fhuqking fascinating!

Bless your hearts for trying!

Hint.

LAUGHING!.......................

Exactly!


X-VERMINATOR

+1

dave

Bless your heart for trying to win a match.
How many is that now anyway?

Clean and shoot after finding chamber data needed for bullet seating. Clean my barrels a whole lot less than I did forty years ago and see no negatives with it.

I did it once, but don't believe it is needed because it makes no difference after your barrel is cleaned say 10 times during several hundred rounds and multiple sessions. Or cleaned once after each of 10 shots.

If you do the shoot one and clean thing, I suggest laying out the first patch of each cleaning next to the first patch of the previous. You will be able to tell a progression of cleaner first patches for about 8 or 10 cleanings.

That's why I only did it once.

I guess I won't buy any Lilja barrels after reading his break-in suggestions! If you pay attention, you can tell when a barrel is ready to be shot and shot. I would guess on average it takes most of my barrels 5 or 6 shots and they are pretty much go to go. I believe there is some good utility in cleaning after after each of the first 3 shots at least. Beyond that, it's a each barrel that tells its own story.

I read your first post and was going to add pretty much what you said here. Strange!

I notice between 80-100 rounds things start to really calm down. But it makes sense to get all your brass fire formed in the initial volley.

Might need to narrow that down a little for us.

This pretty much is it.

Shoot the damn thing and clean, if the groups start to open up. Most of this break in crap is just that-crap.

I’d add that when I receive a rifle with new barrel I shoot TCE degreaser down the barrel and patch it clean. Then use a very lightly oiled patch. I do this to make certain a chip of steal from the chambering process isn’t missed, as it can cause serious problems if fired with chips in it. 99% of the time it’s spotless but missing a chip is easy to do.

Big Stick, Good morning little buddy. I hope you are well. Let me get this straight. A member has a question about something which he doesn't know. He posts such question on a forum, designed for such inquiries, to obtain the missing knowledge. And the above is the first sentence of your response. I'm telling you Big Stick, your grasp of the obvious is exceeded only by your extreme good looks. I hope you have a great day.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

I clean it before I shoot it. Then I shoot it once and patch it out. I continue to shoot it once and patch it out until one shot shows no copper fouling. This is usually 6 to 8 shots. Then I use it for what I bought it for.

I clean a new barrel then put 20 through it fast enough to warm it up good clean it again hot and I'm good to begin break in with 100-200 rounds treating the barrel just like I would any other.

I just shoot the s hit out of it and it usually works pretty good!

More barrels are f ucked up by unnecessary cleaning than by bullets going through the bore!!

From Gale McMillan;

https://yarchive.net/gun/barrel/break_in.html

...make sure to read all the posts.