Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Deer Hunting Nosler Ballistic tip or Hornady SST?

It has come down to these two bullets from my 7mm-08 for this coming deer season. 140 grain BT or 139 grain SST. I know we are splitting hairs here, but its what I do. My deer run large and always under 100 yards so glint edge accuracy is secondary to lethal effect and an exit. Of those two, I've only used the SST and it was an older, softer version that stopped in the deer. For those of you who have seen the results of those two bullets, which one would you choose? They are both within a few dollars a box from one another. Thanks.

In another post you mentioned being happy with the terminal effect of the plain 139 grain Interlock, but you commented on the lead tips getting bashed in the magazine. If as you say your shots are 100 yards and shorter and gilt edged accuracy isn't a big deal, what real difference could a dinged bullet tip make?

I really like the 140 gr NBT out of my 7-08 but with that said I use the 150 gr NBT cause it shoots just a tad better, but either one of the bullets you mention will do for your intended purpose. I would use whatever my rifle liked the best and not worry one minute!

Ballistic Tip would be your choice between those two items.

SST's are crap

Ballistic Tip... but on WT deer it really doesn’t matter.

BT would be my choice but probably in 120 gr.

Hornady Inter-lok's shoot better in my rifle than SST or Nosler Ballistic Tip. The Inter-lok I used to harvest last year's whitetail passed from between the last two ribs on the near side to just under the skin on the off side on a raking shot. The hydrostatic shock was devastating and the perfectly mushroomed bullet retained 66% of its original weight . So Inter-loks will be my choice again this year for obvious reasons.

If an exit is that important to you, the NBT wins. Both are fantastic and wicked killers of deer.

I have to disagree. A good friend of mine has killed 14 deer with 14 shots with the 129gr SST and his trusty 6.5x284. His DRT ratio is 12 out of 14 with the other two just doing death spins.

That is about as good as it gets.

I agree with seattlesetters. I thought SST's were too soft for years because the early ones were.

But two falls ago several other people and I used .308 factory loads with 150-grain SST's to take 30 deer and pigs in Texas. The bucks and boars ran up to 200 pounds (actually weighed, not guesstimated) and ALL the bullets exited, despite the maximum range being around 150 yards on any of the shots. This included the biggest buck, taken with a quartering-on shot, and the biggest boar, take with a shot through both shoulders. And kills were quick.

I would have expected to recover at least a few bullets using 150 Ballistics Tips under the same circumstances--or 150-grain Interlock Spire Points, for that matter. But Hornady has adjusted them, like Nosler did when the first Ballistic Tips proved to be too soft.

A buddy of mine used several of the factory loaded SSTs in his Creedmoor for the first 4-5 years he hunted with it. He was very impressed.

Not sure why he moved from those bullets to loading the ELD-X.

Never once complained about the SSTin his Creedmoor and probably killed a dozen deer in that time span.

He did try some in a 243, said he felt they were a fuzz tough. Bullet sized entry and exits. Deer seemed to travel a bit too much for his liking. He is too used to Gamekings in a 243 that seem to drop most deer right where they were standing at the shot.

I did load some 165 SSTs in a 308 for a co worker to kill hogs with, he had no complaints.

Wouldn't mind trying some in 154 or 162 grain in 7 WSM.

Did the early SST's have the InterLock ring?

BT all day.



P

BT for the win

Ballistic tip, hands down

I had a 140 SST from the Hornaday Magnum factory load in 270 Win. tear up a lot of meat so I sectioned one to see what it looked like. The Interlock was barely a scratch and the jacket was almost the same as the original or varmint ballistic tips, thin and not much taper. No wonder it acted like an early ballistic tip. I have not sectioned a newer one for comparison and lost the original long ago.

I keep intending to give the re-vamped version a try as they have a good BC, but I have been satisfied with the interlocks across the board. I also stocked up on BTs from the shooters pro shop to the point that I won't be hunting long enough to use them all.

I have some 129 6.5 SSTs that I might give a try if I get them loaded soon.

NBT...no contest.

Never had a problem using SST's in my .243 & 25-06, & at Superformance velocities.

Did they improve them across the board or just some of them ? I'm looking at the 6.5 123gr SST for a Grendel and the reviews are all over the map, from "explosive fragmentation on entry" to "reliably exits".

If it were me it would be the most accurate. I shoot a 120 grain Ballistic Tip in a 7x57 Mauser and have gotten expansion and exit at 150 yds. I regularly shoot a 140 grain SST in a 270 WSM and have shot many deer at 200-250 yds with expansion and exit.

I've also used 130 grain Ballistic Tip in the 270 WSM. It expanded more violently at the above ranges and really blasted holes in the deer I've shot. They were all dead right there with that bullet.

Both bullets should work fine, pick the most accurate of the two.


Dan

I picked up a box of the 140 grain Ballistic Tips this morning and see that the mv is listed about 200 fps slower than the 139 grain Superformance SST's. All things being equal with less velocity, penetration should be more than with the SST's and maybe recoil a pound or two less. If I want to hot rod that 7mm-08 with a Superformance load, I might as well use my 7 RM. I've read that a lot of you guys have had good things to say about the BT's and never a discouraging word which hasn't always been the case with the SST's. Right or wrong I equate the distance that a deer runs or doesn't run after the shot with the lethality of the bullet. I don't shoot shoulders or cns normally so I haven't had drt heart lung experiences, but if a deer runs 70 or 100 yards before going down, that isn't as good as one that drops at half that distance.

Mathman, true enough about the battered tip on a lead head Interlock probably not making any difference at the distance that I shoot, but that deer still ran 50 yards and if there is something out there that would open even faster with a plastic tip, I'm going to give it a try. Deer are only 12" wide through the brisket. Hornady does put that 139 grain Interlock into their whitetail series, so to be sure they work pretty well. My last rifle deer was at 20 yards and the one before that 65. Post rut hunting here in November and the big guys are hanging out in the cover.

Man, I hate to get off topic but if you’re shooting factory ammo you should at least run a box each of Browning BXR 144gr and Winchester Deer Season XP 140gr through your rifle to see if it like ‘em. I’ve tried both in four different rifles and they’ve been very accurate.

Killed a few deer with the Winchester 125 and Browning 129 in a 6.5 Creedmoor and they knock the living crap out of everything I’ve hit (and my buddies, too). Spectacular DRTs and exits100% of the time from 40 - 280 yards.

They destroy innards like nothing I’ve ever seen and they’re affordable, as well.

140 grain Interlocks all day for me in the .270. Since 2009 I have never lost an animal or seen one run more than 25 yards. Usually, DRT. It looks like a freaking grenade goes off in the boiler room and less of a chance of a issue if I accidentally hit a shoulder. My shots typically range from 100 to 350 yards on average.

I had bad luck with them as well years ago. Do you think they behave like an Interlock now?

A buddy of mine used the SST bullet on a springbok cull hunt. These animals are small and from his account the pile of springbok he killed the bullets fragmented and didnt exit a single 90 pound animal

TXhunter80,

In my experience over the past couple years, both the SST's and ELD-X's perform similarly to Interlock Spire Points of the same weight/diameter, when started at the same muzzle velocities.

I've only used SST's in my .243. They're easily the most effective, quickest killing deer bullets I've used in that cartridge. Have never tried ballistic tips though so maybe they'd be even better. I know they've been more impressive to me than 100 gr. core-lokt, 100 gr. interlock, 100 gr. power shok and 85 gr Sierra BTHP. I had one close range {maybe 30 yards} front on shot on an exceptionally huge old doe. The bullet blew the top of her heart off, turned her lungs to jelly, blew a silver dollar sized hole through her liver and was lost in the gut pile after making a nasty, stinking mess of them. Seemed like plenty of penetration to me with exceptional mayhem along the way.

I have ran both NBT's and SST's in my 7-08. The SST's might be a little more accurate but they tended to be highly explosive at times when hitting bone. 140 gr NBT's are what I am using in that right now and they seem to drop deer harder.

My experience with SSTs have been in 140 and 150 grain 270s, 165 grain 30 cal and 170 grain 8mms
Some of the 270s and some of the 8MMs came apart badly and shed their jackets in deer and antelope. 270s were used on deer and antelope shot from both 270 Winchesters and 270 Short Mag. In 2 cases I found an empty jacket even though there was an exist wound, so that means part of the cores exited anyway. All the 270 kills total 8 animals. All kills were dramatic, but I really do not like having bullets come apart when I can get others that don't.

The 8MMs were used on deer, antelope and elk ,all from my short barreled 8X57 carbine. 4 deer all with good results and exits. 3 antelope all with good results with 2 exits and the one recovered bullet was pretty good, weighing 135 grains after it stopped. The elk were not as encouraging. 3 shots 2 at one elk and one at another. None exited. One bullet was well expanded and looked perfect, but the other 2 came apart leaving only lead frags and empty jackets. So I believe it's a good deer bullet, but a bit less then I want to for elk. I am going to the 180 grain GMX or the 200 grain Nosler Partitions in this rifle for elk hunting.

Oddly, the two 165 grain 30 cal SSTs I have seen used were one deer and one antelope, and they both worked very well. Shot from a 26" 308 Savage M110. Choreographed at 2722 FPS before the hunts. Deer was at about 60 yards and the antelope at 171 yards. Both left exits about the size of a Quarter, and not a lot of blood-shot tissue.

So I am not ready to condemn the lot of them. They have all been super accurate, but the inner-lock ring is about the size of a human hair. If they were to double the jacket thickness in the shank and base I am sure it would help a lot.

The early Ballistic Tips with the solid bases and thin jackets were some of the very worst "game bullets" I ever saw used, or used myself, EVER, ANYWHERE, or at ANY TIME up to that point in the early 90s. The only ones I have seen used that are as bad (even worse in many cases) were Burgers. Early Ballistic tips I used or was an eye witness to their use were 257" 120 grain,(2 of them) 130 grain 270s,(3 of them) 180 grain 30 cal (3 of them) and 210 grain 338. (1 of them) ALL sucked.

The new Nosler B.T. HUNTING bullet get far better reviews.

The jacket thickness is now about the same as the jackets were on the 1970s and earlier Remington Core-Lokts in 270 and 7mm, and I have used a bunch of those old Remington bullets with 100% success. I have 150 grain Nosler B.T. HUNTING bullets loaded right now in some 300 Savage ammo as well as the ammo I am going to use next in my M-1 Garand. My M-1 chronographs at 2775 FPS and the Savage M99 measures 2534 FPS. I am hoping for excellent results, but personally I have not killed any game with these yet, so I am only guessing as to what they will do, and simply going on the reviews I have read as well as a few conversations with other hunters who seem to like them a lot.

My friend Roger killed a cow elk with a 180 grain Nosler BT Hunting last year. That is the only "Ballistic Tip Hunting" kill I have personal knowledge of so far. It was a 4 year old cow (according to the warden,) and the bullet worked well. Good wound channel and the exit was about the size of a silver dollar. No jacket frags or lead pieces in the meat on the off side. He used a 30-06 and killed the elk at about 275 yards with a broad side shot tucked tight behind the shoulder, but the exit was through the heavy muscles on the other shoulder. It hit a rib but no heavy bone. Overall I though the bullet did well.

Lastly my nephew has used the 270s in both 140 and 150 grain to kill elk and so far he's been satisfied. I asked him to save the bullets for me if he recovered any, but he forgot on one elk and he said the rest exited.

So none of this info is specific to the OPs question, but it may be helpful in seeing a pattern.

szihn- just a reminder that you were going to try to video your 20 minute deer and 35 minute elk cutting and wrapping this year. Thanks.

What ever shoots better in your rifle.
My 270 likes the 140SST and I will be using them next month on Oregon mulies.

I had forgotten whttail. Thanks.
I'll ask my friend if he can come over with his video camera and shoot the vid.

The 140 gr NBT has worked well in my 7-08 on numerous deer and feral hogs. Never tried the SST.

About 18 yrs ago, or so, I used the Hornady LM 139SST in a little 7mm08. It clocked right at 3100fps, was "sticky" in extraction and very accurate. I shot a Texas Dall exotic sheep at 200yds, He ran downhill 75 yds and rolled over. the bullet had fragmented, tore everything up and fragments were against the opposite ribcage. I felt it was too soft for cow elk. I have shot a lot of them in other calibers, but not on game. I am glad to hear that they have toughened them up some. That old Light Magnum ammo was some funny stuff! Hot but usually accurate.

Jim,

Yeah, that definitely sounds like EARLY performance from SST's!

The 150-grain .308's we used on 30 Texas deer and pigs may be even tougher than Interlock Spire Points. Would have expected to recover at least a few Spire Points on the same sort of shots.

The 120 BT is wicked out of my 280 AI

I have only killed ~ 3 dozen animals and from my anecdotal biased memory comes this personal rating:

1) Nosler Ballistic Tips... the best
2) Hornady SST.... no complaints
3) Nosler accubond.... good enough
4) Berger VLD hunting.... I should not have to shoot a doe 5 times with a 7mmRM to get it to fall down.
5) Barnes TSX.... I go through a whole box and never got a group, just Copper fouling [no animals died]


I was on rec.guns on usenet in 1994 and could already see with the very intelligent scientists and engineers posters there that there would never be consensus on terminal ballistics. Just arguing between differing opinions. I think this is due to limited data and the out of control variable of shot placement. There is no hope for the current low IQ gun forum WWW contributors to do any better. If you read or post about terminal ballistics, maintain a sense of humor. Everyone but you is nuts.

Clark,
Great post.
I sure don't have the experience quite a few here have.
But I have seen a couple deer and elk die. Along with a pile of cow and hogs. (Domestic)

My experiences have been better, worse, and the same as other posters.
As you state, placement is a very variable, variable.
Identical hits can even be different due to angle or bullet path.

I find it amusing how so many put their manhood on the line in these conversations.

Really. We had a Ford car. 1. It was a pain, more high dollar problems than all the
cars I have owned, combined. But we did like it.
Honestly have had good service from every other brand we owned.

Never been a Ford fan, that one confirmed it.

The point.

That T-bird confirmed my (personal) bias.
I don't care to own another Ford. (Right price, I would go around again)

For the Ford fans.
Sorry, but those are facts Jack.

However, I don't believe for one second that every Ford is junk.
Or that other 93 T-birds weren't flawless.


Why is this all so dam hard for some to understand.

Clark,

What muzzle velocity'range with the 7mm Bergers?

I haven't tried the VLD at 7 mag speeds. What do you think happened there?

The deer and pigs shot at my camp with VLD's out of a 308 Win. fall down quickly.

Very high. I run belted mags to never reload again at 75 kpsi and 3.34" OAL, and the doe was very close.
If that had been a Nos Bal Tip, I could have put my fist in the exit hole.

How was the internal damage?

Pencil holes

That sounds really strange for a hunting VLD. The entrance holes are typically quite small however.

I guess I have been lucky with the SST's. I have only used the .308 150 grainer but it has killed well and when run through the ribs it doesn't tear up any meat.

rickt300,

As I have noted elsewhere, SST's today are VERY different than the originals.

Clark,

That does not add up--unless, perhaps, you used one of the target bullets introduced AFTER the original Berger "Match" bullets were rebranded as Hunting VLD's.

At that point, the trend toward ever-faster rifling twists in target rifles had resulted in the original "Match" bullets sometimes acting wonky when shot out of hot barrels. Consequently, the TARGET bullet was toughened up--but the HUNTING bullets remained the same as the "Match" bullets--which were very thin-jacketed, with almost pure lead cores.

To many hunters, it's counter-intuitive for the hunting bullet to be "softer" than the target bullet, but that's what happened.

Another note: When Berger first introduced the hunting line, they advised them to be started at no more than 3200 fps. I found that advice to be spot-on, and in fact generally run them at 2800-3000, where expansion and penetration has been fine out to 550-600 yards.

MD Thanks for the reminder as I was going to load some up faster, now I will go to a heavier bullet to get them around 3,100 fps.
I think some people look at the caliber sized entrance hole and conclude the bullets penciled through. Maybe they don't even gut their own deer?
The hollow point can get clogged and the nose bent but even so the jacket usually still ruptures.

I was told 3,200 max for the VLD by Berger when I was working up loads for my 26 Nosler. I called them and told the tech I could push a 140 VLD a LOT faster than their top load. That's when he told me their top recommended velocity was 3,200.

140 VLD's work great in my 6.5-284 at around 3K over RL-17, great WT killers. Again, gotta balance bullet construction parameters with velocity and game being hunted.

I had way too much terminal performance inconsistency some years ago with the SST. I haven't tried the newer ones.

The NBT is a much better choice, IMO. But, back in the day, same with the NBT. I had quit them because they blew up stuff. New ones are great.

Both are accurate. From JB's statement, maybe I need to try the newer SST's as I did the newer NBT's.

Now, are the newer SST's as good as the current NBT's? That would be my question, as I really like NBT's.

DF

I've hit over 10 deer with 140gr SST out of my 260rem from 25-150 yards. Shoulders, ribs, neck...NEVER had an exit. All deer were DRT or ran 80 yards max and watched them all keel over, but NEVER an exit. Yes they worked, but I prefer an exit with a good blood trail for that time I place the bullet in a less than ideal spot. Making a switch this year to Barnes. 165gr SST out a 300WM are different story.....big exit, but lots of meat damage. Again, making a change to Barnes.

That sounds a bit more expansive than the current NBT's.

I would like to hear terminal performance comparisons between current SST's and current NBT's.

DF

Neither. Both the BT and the SST grenade and make a mess of your meat. Hornady claims the SST is just an Interlock with a plastic tip. Yet the Interlocks have always treated me well. That plastic tip supposed to initiate expansion faster, but it over does it.

If I were you, I'd use the Interbond, Accubond, or just the Interlock. You could also try the E-Tip and the GMX. I have no experience with those, so I cant comment on them.

That's not true as a blanket statement.

I think some of these reports are on the old version of the BT & SST. At least with the newer BT I have yet to not get an exit. Their performance is very close to an Accubond or interbond. Have not tried the updated SSTs due to the performance of the early versions.

If the SST's have changed, you can't prove it by me. I also tried the Remington Accutips, which are just an SST with a Tan tip. Same results, and it's not like I'm the only one saying this.



You are welcome to believe what you want, but do not call me a liar. My friends and I have been through this from every angle. Tried these aforementioned bullets in a cornucopia of calibers, from mild to monster. They are fragile grenades, and it only takes a rib to set off the charge.

I will admit, I haven't tried any BT in the past few years. So I will do so again, if it is true they have changed the structural integrity.

I would also like to say, I'm not trying to offend anyone. I'm the new guy here, so I would like to fit in, and stay awhile.

I have used BOTH for a while. The NBT since the 80's with stellar results in .270Win. Started using the SST's in the same caliber a couple of years ago, just because I got a deal on them... they work just fine also. I do not think it really matters much. What ever you like and your gun shoots well.

I did not call you anything. I disputed your blanket statement because I have personal experience with counterexamples to your assertion.

At my deer camp my friend, his sons and I have used SST's and Ballistic Tips from a variety of cartridges including 243 Winchester, 308 Winchester and 260 Remington. From things I had read, including here, I was a little worried about the 95 grain SST out of the 243. Several deer later those worries are gone. It has been a very good bullet for us in that application. The 95 grain .243", 120 grain .264" and 150 and 165 grain .308" Ballistic Tips have been excellent killers. I shot a large buck for this area, just under 200 pounds, with the 150 Bal Tip. He was quartered away with the bullet going into the chest and out of the opposite shoulder. Complete penetration with no evidence of the bullet grenading.

I have no experience with the SST, but I know a lot about the 7MM and 30cal. BT. However, what I have witnessed is limited to 150gr. 7mm BT and 180gr. 30 cal BT both and great elk killers. Have seen them in action way too many times to have any doubts. Pretty good on deer too. Not that it matters because it's not relevant to this discussion, I'm a hardcore Partition user. Please don't try to straighten me out because I'm too old to change.

I'm with you on this, something is off some where. I used to load 210 VLD's in a .300 RUM Sendero. The entrance hole was a pencil, but the insides looked like you tossed a hand grenade in a deli counter.

We have more in common than you think. I'm also a hardcore Partition user. 160's in the 7's, 200's in the .30's, and 250's in the .33's. IMO, the Partition is one of, if not THE greatest hunting bullet in existence. It is what all others are compared to.

7point62mag,

Yes, something is "off" somewhere, and that is your experience with more recent Ballistic Tips and SST's--which as you admit is zero. Both have changed since first introduced--and Ballistic Tips also vary considerably in construction according to caliber and weight.

My experience with Berger Hunting VLD's goes back a dozen years, and that is how they work in calibers from 6mm up. But the design has not changed.

My comment about the VLD was seperate from what I was saying about the BT and SST. Berger's are made to "grenade" by design, and they do work great if you don't hit a shoulder first.

Next, I have experience with recent SST's, even the flavor sold under Remington's colors. It was the Nosler BT that I havent used recently. But since I posted in here, I've sent an email to a fella I correspond with at Noser to see what, if anything, they have changed.

It feels like you are trying to turn this into an argument. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

I actually don’t believe the Berger bullets were designed to do anything on game, as they were designed strictly as a target bullet .... to fly straight and long were the only parameters. Long range target shooters liked the accuracy and ballistics so much that they started shooting game with them because they could make more precise hits them at longer ranges than were thought prudent with older hunting bullet designs like the Nosler Partition. These types of shots also typically were at undisturbed animals which gave them time to dial up their scopes and place very precise shots into broadside targets.

These target shooters quickly found that their Berger target bullets “grenaded” on game and were effective as long as you put them into soft tissue to reach the lungs. This was a by-product of trial and error, not design.

You are completely correct. It's actually been so long, I forgot about that. That was back when I was bitching at people for using Matchkings and A-Max bullets on game.

Berger has a 185 now, designed for hunting (so they say). When I talked to them a couple weeks ago, they told me the Classic Hunter bullets will perform the same on game at 50 yards as it will at 1000. I still won't use them on game, for the exact reason you mentioned (that I forgot about). I'm 38, but maybe my soul is older, because I prefer bullets that stay intact. Bullets that can break a shoulder and still make it to the other side.

This seems almost a silly dispute as darn near anything that goes bang will kill a deer. The only question in my mind is dropping them quickly versus meat damage. This is a moot point with behind the shoulder shots. For me it will come down to which ever is cheaper and shoots better in my rifles.

[s][/s]I always get a kick out of guys claiming Nosler BT's blow up. For starters they are probably one of the toughest cup and core bullets out there. Very stout jackets on many models. Second the old ballistic tips that were fragile where produced around 30 years ago. I still have some and they work just fine on deer.
Never used the Hornady SST, but have loaded them for friends that used them with great results.
Either bullet will work just fine on deer. I like the BT better because for me they have required less effort to get to shoot and I have had very good results with them. Even on elk at 300 RUM velocity levels.

It wasn't a "claim" sir. It's a usage report from my usage. My friends and I tried them in a .243, .264, 7 RM, 7 STW, .308, .300 WM, and .338 WM.

I also tried the 180 BT (blue tip) in my .325 WSM. Now that one performed well, oddly enough. However, I did find the 220gr Power Point to be more effective. Especially when going THROUGH the shoulders. Shoot, talking about it made me realize how much I loved that rifle. I've definitely got to pick up another 325 some day.

As I stated earlier, haven't tried the Nosler BT's recently (the SST I have). I'm curious how they will perform now. I may just give them a go in my son's 7mm-08 this season.

Exactly. For your use, I'd pick "neither" as an option for 100 yd midwest deer. Shoot the interlock or if you must...a 120gr NBT.

Always the same old argument about Nosler BTs. Well, I’ve been shooting them since they were available and killed somewhere around 200 deer with them. Started with 130’s in the 270 and now use 100’s and 120’s in the 260. I have never lost a deer because of the bullet, but did lose one 8 point due to poor bullet placement (found him a month later). Biggest critter killed with the ‘original’ BTs was a hog weighing close to 400 pounds. One shot and down he went. No exit, but the bullet made it halfway through the cartilage shield on his far side.

The bullets can be messy, but that is why the deer don’t go far, so I just try to not hit the best edible parts of the deer. Just shoot em in the lungs. Works every time.

When I switched to the 260, the plan was to use 100 gr BTs on varmints and 120’s on deer, but I wound up using the 100’s on deer. Got an exit every time, but thought the 120’s might be more effective, so for the last few years I’ve used the 120’s. Best I can tell, it doesn’t matter which one I use.

One thing to mention, if it matters to anybody, is that I do not get exits on pigs that are medium to large size. They don’t go far, but don’t expect a big blood trail to follow.

I load SSTs for the grandson’s 308, and they seem to work fine. I just have no personal knowledge or opinion that would let me compare them to the Nosler Ballistic Tip.

When I hunt deer or pigs with the 223, I use the Nosler Partition or the 65 gr Sierra GK. I don’t have enough use data to say one works better than the other, though for pigs I’d probably choose the Partition.

Just curious what you expect out of these bullets and short range impacts at high velocities?

7point62magnum,

Here's a quote from your latest post:

"It's a usage report from my usage. My friends and I tried them in a .243, .264, 7 RM, 7 STW, .308, .300 WM, and .338 WM."

I would be incredibly astonished IF you or your friends actually had a 200-grain .338 Ballistic Tip blow up or fail to pentrate sufficiently from a .338 Winchester Magnum, for two reasons:

First, the 200-grain .338 was the original "heavy jacket" Ballistics Tip, introduced in 1992 in part to address the penetration problems of some (not all) early Ballistic Tips. It was given a jacket that was approximately 3/4 of the weight of the entire bullet, with an extremely heavy base. In fact, some people considered it a semi-monolithic with a little lead behind the plastic tip to facilitate expansion.

Second, I used my first one in 1992, and used a bunch more after that. The first one (from a .338 Winchester Magnum) killed the biggest-bodied bull caribou I've ever taken, out of a dozen from Alaska to Quebec. The range was 200 yards. The bull was almost broadside, so I put the bullet in the pocket behind the near shoulder--and the bullet broke the heavy joint of the far shoulder before exiting. The bull was about the size of a typical 5-point bull elk.

After that I used them on a bunch of both big game, both in North America and Africa. One was a bull gemsbok about the same body-size as that caribou--but gemsbok have heavier and harder bones than caribou, especially in the shoulders, which are also covered with tough, inch-thick hide. The bull was quartering toward me at about 150-175 yards, and the bullet broke the near (right) shoulder above the joint, then broke the spine. The bull collapsed--and the bullet was recovered under the hide of the left ham, retaining over 60% of its original weight.

Have also seen the same bullet break both shoulders in similar-sized elk and other African plains game--and exit. The ONLY one recovered was the one that essentially penetrated that bull gemsbok lengthwise.

Since then Nosler has applied the same heavy jacket to every Ballistic Tip from the .30-caliber 165-grain on up.

I've got to wonder if 762 has ever shot anything with a BT.

For a few years that's all I used from a 308 30-06 and 7-08. During deer season and several dozen crop damage kills.

150s in the 30s and 140 in the 7. All.but a few were bang flops and even the ones that weren't only ran about 100 yards. The runners we're attributed to adrenaline due to the bullets hitting the hearts.

I PM'd Mule, but I'll write it here too. When I typed ".338 WM", it was supposed to be ".325 WSM". I never tried a BT in a .33. I also told him, I've not used BT's in several years. I'm going to order some for my sons 7-08, and for my .300 Win Mag, and try them again.

I know, even then, the Ballistic Tips killed well, unless the shot wasnt ideal. I just prefer a bullet that doesn't shred on impact, which is the reason I don't use Bergers for hunting. I use Partitions and Interlocks when my guns will shoot them MOA or better. I know my choices aren't everyone's favorites either.

2 1/2 hrs ago I witnessed my daughter take her first deer.
She shot it with a .243 win
70 grain nbt
The deer travelled maybe 40 yds after the shot.
She blew the heart out.

I fired my last four "old" .277 140s the other day after dialing in my FN .270. Believe I cranked that batch out around 1995. Might still have one in the box because there were 101 in it.

I cracked a spike head-on in the neck with one of those at about 20 yards, and there was no exit.

I had several boxes of early 139 sst's that were really soft. I shot a lot of them at varmints from a 7-08 and they worked well for that. If they've improved them I'm not sure when it was or how to know which ones you have. I know all my NBTs are the thicker jacketed ones.

I used to really like the regular interlocks from hornady for a good all around non premium bullet. About 10 years of so ago I noticed some big differences between old lots and new lots. New ones had thinner jackets and the interlock rings were smaller and further back. They seemed softer than older ones.

I used to keep a lot of the 308 180 interlocks as an all around for all my older mauser 30-06s and other 30 cals. After being frustrated with a softer lot I took advantage of a sale at SPS and stocked up on 180 partitions. Now that's my all around load for my older stuff I don't shoot much but keep some ammo ready for them just in case.

It would be cool if bullet makers were upfront about changes and you could look up lot numbers and see what you have.

Bb

There was an exit hole too btw.
About the size of a half dollar.

OP here and I appreciate all the input and the details of what happened and exit size etc. I've had exits where I had to part the hair to find an exit and while the deer died, they ran farther and bled less. That was back in the days when I thought that "my" deer deserved to be hunted with a premium bullet which in most cases were too hard for a deer.

Congrats to your daughter! For this season, I got my step son a Ruger American "Go Wild" edition in 7mm-08. He has zero experience with a rifle, so I'm glad this one has a brake. I hope to see him take a deer like you did for your daughter. I have PM'd Mule and asked about the 120 BT. Choice Ammunition loads the 120 to 2950 in 7mm-08.

Windfall, I'm sorry we ended up in a debate in your thread.

I like both. Not sure why guys think they need "hard" bullets to kill things. Oh, and if you don't want meat destroyed, don't shoot at the meat. The vital organs aren't in the meat.

I once tested my favorite, most accurate loads by mangling the lead nose. Flattened some, bent some sideways, even beat a couple on the shooting bench. The accuracy within 300 yards did not change one bit.

I hate to break it to you but the BT is a tougher bullet than a Horn interlock on average.

Lord have mercy......I have NOT used any BT's recently. I will be trying them again. I did let the early experiences steer me away from the NBT. Now that I think about it, it seems silly that I've looked over them because of what happened in the past. I do plan to try the 120 BT in my sons 7mm-08. I will report back when he gets one!

Might give the Barnes TTSX - the tipped TSX, not the TSX - a try.

I’ve shot deer and pigs with most bullets mentioned in this thread and others not yet mentioned. The TTSX has provided the most consistent terminal results. Again, this is specifically the TTSX, not the TSX. The TSX was inconsistent in opening a couple of times and that was the end of using them.

Shoot through the high shoulders and they typically drop where they stand without much meat loss.

The 120 TTSX with a case full of Varget and a F210 is a nice combination in a 7-08.

When was the last time you used one? They were toughed up 30+ years ago.

The 7mm 120's are a stout SOB. You won't likely recover it in a broadside deer.

I will keep that in mind! Thank you!

You’re welcome.

A few years back I tried the 139SST in a 280. Was not impressed with the terminal performance so have not used it since. The comments in this thread indicating that Hornady has toughened up the SSTs prompted me to email Hornady asking them to compare the predicted terminal performance between the 139 SST and the 139 Interloock. Below is the response:

"The SST (Super Shock Tip) in a variation of the InterLock bullet; it has design differences that intend for it to open faster--thus, the name--than the InterLock. The SST has not recently been toughened and is designed to open quickly and dump its energy in an animal and normally will retain about 50 to 60% of its original weight, the InterLock is intended to be more of a controlled expanding bullet and retain 65 to 75% of its original weight; both are very accurate."

That’s my favorite deer bullet for the 7-08. You’ll dig it if the rifle likes them.

Stop apologizing. You're good. Seems you don't claim anything you didn't actually see or do. No GFYs so far so you have been accepted by the rank & file. Oh, Stop apologizing..

And just to muddy the water.......I'm opting off the .284 120gr BT for my wife's A-Bolt Micro in 7-08. As a counter balance to the routine reporting on this little missile, our sample of one whitetail buck got a big negative on the support scale. Loading the 20" barreled rifle nearer minimum than maximum (don't recall the exact weight of RL15 but can check if required) certainly gave a mild velocity according to our shoulder reports. The bullet engaged at about 60 yards and destroyed the neck spine a couple or few inches ahead of the left shoulder. Should have ended up in the right shoulder or lung but did indeed "grenade" on the spine. We butcher our own game so the end result was personally observed. There was a cavity approximately 2 to 3 inches in diameter where the spine used to be. Bone chips, lead & copper fragments, and shredded venison was all that remained. Total depth of penetration was probably around 5 to 6 inches.

Don't know how others have fared with bone hits but that's my report and I'm sticking to it. So all things ain't always equal. This year I'll continue with the 120 BT in a Model 7 stainless with a max load of Varget, but my wife will be shooting the 139 SST with a low end powder charge. Still interested in seeing first hand a broadside shot with the 120 but will take on the challenge myself and provide her with a more comfortable bullet weight in a frame that should certainly hold together at decreased velocity. eom

I've had my 7mm-08 since the early '90's and remember when the only bullets on the shelves here were the Remington 120's and Core-Lokt 140's. Back then I assumed that those 120's were the varmint bullets and the 140's were intended for larger game. I'm still thinking the same way and because our deer are large, the 140 BT seems a more logical choice to assure an exit wound. Our Cabela's here only has the 120 BT's on the shelf, so I've had to look a little harder to find the 140 BT's. Most everything else for the 7mm-08 is in that 139-150 grain range which makes me wonder why Cabela's would only stock 120 BT 7mm-08's? They aren't reduced recoil loads.

At last count, seven tags filled with the 120 NBT from the 7mm-08. Seven complete pass-throughs and several broken shoulders along the way.

Four bucks, two doe and a cow elk. All one shot with minimal tracking (under 100 yards to DRT). Distances from 30 to just under 287 yards.

One instance of a hard hit spine stopping a bullet wouldn't put me off. On this very site I've read various comments about bullets you'd never suspect having trouble with direct spine hits.

Always wonder what guys expect with close range impacts on bone, with higher velocity cup and cores? I've got a pic of an antelope whacked with that 139gr SST out of a 7mag at 100yds, through the backbone. Bowling ball sized exit.