The .270's in my house are all used and work well,
..... the 30/06 I own because I believe it is a law or something,
I don’t know about it being a law..(grin), but I think it’s UNAmerican to disrespect it.
Jerry
I just recently picked up a couple of Model 70's in 30-06. Just because everyone should own one. Have not had time to do anything with them except clean them up and stash them in the safe.
Actually, while my memory isn't what it used to be, I suspect the article may have been "I Did Read Jack O'Connor." It was in response to Dave Scovill's column in RIFLE about how he never read Jack O'Connor, especially when growing up in Oregon, because nobody he ever knew read O'Connor. Which, as he pointed out, was why he never had any use for the .270. (Much like the Campfire members who've never used it, yet know they wouldn't like it--or any number of other cartridges.)
Apparently there's a strong contingent of hunters who only believe in personal experience. This isn't unusual in humans, but if all humans believed the same thing not much advancement would have taken place over the past few thousand years, since among other things, rifles and their cartridges would never have been invented.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
When he retired, Jack O'Connor was asked by Jim Carmicheal if he was restricted to one rifle for the rest of his life for all North American hunting, what would it be? O'Connor said without hesitation, "The 30-06. I also heard thad just before his passing he was having Al Beisen build he a .280 Remington on a Ruger action. That from Mr. .270 himself. Interesting. I got my first .270 way back in 1973, a commercial FN Mauser that shot pretty good. I did take a dislike to 130 gr. bullets as they made a mess out of eating meat so went to the 150 gr. Sierra Game King. I only used it for a short while off an on mostly going with a 30-06. That same year I also bout a Remington 660 in .308 as the 03 Springfield 06 and Mauser .270 were a bit too heavy when I hinted near the top of Mt. Lewis which was roughly 9,500' MSL at the top. A bit hard on me as at the time I was a heavy chainsmoker. I quit in 1975. I took quite few deer off that Mountain with that little .308. When I transferred from Nevada to Arizona in 1979 I stayed with the .308 and in fact didn't use the .270 at all until 2009 when I did my first antelope hunt. After all I read about hunting them I figured the .270 would be my best bet as shots were supposed to be way out yonder. Turned out the shot was at an easy 75 yards after one of the easiest stalks I've ever done. The old 150 gr. Game King did a nice job with almost no meat loss. I took that .270 on an elk hunt in 2010 but missed the elk by way more that I thought was right so later in the day I used my .35 Whelen back up to take a nice juicy cow elk. Turned out the scope on the .270 died a serious death. When I sight in or check a rifle I always do a couple dry fires to make sure I'm settled in the way I like. When I did this, the reticle seemed to jump up about half way to the roof of the scope. The scope was an original Redfield Tracker that had given good service. AFAIK it wasn't bumped or dropped or suffered and form of trauma but it just crapped out. Not sure if I'll ever take the .270 on a hunt again but that doesn't mean I won't consider it. I just have too many other guns that need attention. Paul B.
Our forefathers did not politely protest the British.They did not vote them out of office, nor did they impeach the king,march on the capitol or ask permission for their rights. ----------------They just shot them. MOLON LABE
John, I too have a memory that should not be trusted but in this case mine seems to be OK. You wrote an article titled “Jack O’Connor Was Right”. It starts on page 50, Volume II, Issue 2 of the Game Journal 1993. An excellent review of why, Jack was and continues to be spot on!
Don't understand the "still" part of the question.
D D, it makes perfect sense to those who used one.
Jerry
Oh. Well, try as I might life ain't long enough to like them all I guess. Won't bother y'all with the list of the ones I still like, it's kinda long. I have fond memories of the 20mm.
I thought that I would throw a 30mm into the mix. I never worked on a 30mm, but I've spent a lot of hrs with the M61A1 and M39 20 mm guns. Here are the M61 and a GAU 8 guns firing. Nice groups. Those A10s are so quiet. By the time you hear them, you're dead.
A-10's were all built in my hometown, Hagerstown, MD, by Fairchild. Everybody I knew, it seemed, worked on that project at one time or another including two of my BIL's. It would also seem that everybody in that town has a dummy 30mm souvenir round- employees swiped them by the car trunk full.
As for .270? Whyinhell not? Dead is dead no matter the source of it. My personal avoidance of .270 is because there is, like, five molds for .270 cast bullets vs. a couple hundred for .30 caliber.
I have about 15 different 30 cal moulds, and only two in .270. But that's no hindrance.
The RCBS is a beauty. Their basic rifle design has worked incredibly well in every caliber I've tried it, though. The 270 version is no exception. They end up at 155 grains gas-checked with my alloy that is a mix of wheel weights and range scrap that I water-drop, and will shoot into less than an inch for 5 at 100 with 34 grains of 3031. Basically one hole. I'm sure that'd do for deer/elk/whatever out to a few hundred yards. Need to get them chronographed and get them out hunting. They are well above 2k fps.
The Lee shoots just as well, but I haven't been able to get them shooting as fast. Casts at 138 with gas check, same alloy as the RCBS. 21-23gr 2400 and I was sniping half-liter water bottles at 200 yds. 26 gr of IMR 4198 shot faster (flatter) and about as accurately. Never got a chronograph on them.
I am lucky to have a M77 tang safety rifle stock that came on a 7x57 M77 that Bill Ruger gave to Jack. I suspect Jack asked for that caliber when visiting the Ruger factory. Long story short the stock was broken and after a couple of owners I wound up with it. The original 7x57 action and barrel was restocked for Jack by Jay Frazier, a gunsmith that Al Biesen recommended to O'Connor. I believe that Jack died before this was completed and Frazier bought the restocked rifle from Eleanor. I put a .270 I had on hand in the original repaired stock and never considered any other caliber. It was my favorite deer, antelope, and coyote caliber for a long time.
When I read threads like this, I wonder why some people think Jack O'Connor only used or recommended the 270. A few are surprised to discover that he actually used other cartridges or rifles other than Model 70s.
Sadly, it seems that he won't be remembered for much else, despite the other subjects he covered in books and magazines.
He's probably in heaven chatting with Leonard Nimoy, Bela Lugosi, George Reeves, Adam West, and other persons of note, all of whom are only remembered for one thing.
I am lucky to have a M77 tang safety rifle stock that came on a 7x57 M77 that Bill Ruger gave to Jack. I suspect Jack asked for that caliber when visiting the Ruger factory. Long story short the stock was broken and after a couple of owners I wound up with it. The original 7x57 action and barrel was restocked for Jack by Jay Frazier, a gunsmith that Al Biesen recommended to O'Connor. I believe that Jack died before this was completed and Frazier bought the restocked rifle from Eleanor. I put a .270 I had on hand in the original repaired stock and never considered any other caliber. It was my favorite deer, antelope, and coyote caliber for a long time.
I also heard thad just before his passing he was having Al Beisen build he a .280 Remington on a Ruger action. That from Mr. .270 himself. Interesting. Paul B.
Not to hijack the thread, but that's been my question for a long time: I wonder why? That just seems odd to me: a pushfeed .280 in JOC's hands. Unless someone gave it to him and he was simply having AB restock it for him.
"An archer sees how far he can be from a target and still hit it, a bowhunter sees how close he can get before he shoots." It is certainly easy to use that same line of thinking with firearms. -- Unknown
I also heard thad just before his passing he was having Al Beisen build he a .280 Remington on a Ruger action. That from Mr. .270 himself. Interesting. Paul B.
Not to hijack the thread, but that's been my question for a long time: I wonder why? That just seems odd to me: a pushfeed .280 in JOC's hands. Unless someone gave it to him and he was simply having AB restock it for him.
It seems to me that JOC would have been well aware that the .270 and .280 are like two peas in a pod, so maybe this was just a chance to explore another variation on one of his favorite cartridges.
Why wouldn't you like the .270 Winchester? My wife and I are taking .270's on our antelope hunt this year. I have seen bull elk back flip after one hit from a .270. Unless you are tackling grizzlies, the .270 will get the job done.
"I didn't realize we had so many snipers in this country." by J23
Desertstranger: Indeed count me as an avid and enthusiastic 270 Winchester admirer/user/advocate! Been shootin'em for 52+ years now. Hold into the wind VarmintGuy
I also heard thad just before his passing he was having Al Biesen build he a .280 Remington on a Ruger action. That from Mr. .270 himself. Interesting. Paul B.
Not to hijack the thread, but that's been my question for a long time: I wonder why? That just seems odd to me: a pushfeed .280 in JOC's hands.
Since no one has offered a known reason........
? Maybe just something different ? It would seem to me that JOC had every opportunity to do whatever he desired with the 270.
It seems to me that JOC would have been well aware that the .270 and .280 are like two peas in a pod, so maybe this was just a chance to explore another variation on one of his favorite cartridges.
Originally Posted by jwall
Since no one has offered a known reason........
? Maybe just something different ? It would seem to me that JOC had every opportunity to do whatever he desired with the 270.
Could be. I just always wondered why.
"An archer sees how far he can be from a target and still hit it, a bowhunter sees how close he can get before he shoots." It is certainly easy to use that same line of thinking with firearms. -- Unknown
270/280/30-06 If you have any one of these three, you have all three.
Frank Barnes died in 1992. His 1993 7th edition of Cartridges of the World, still included this passage about the 32 Winchester Special:
Any difference between the two [30-30 and 32sp] exists only in the imagination of the hot stove league.
In 1997 the 8th edition of Cartridges of the World was edited by Michael McPherson and removed the passage. I feel we are losing grumpy old man wisdom.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. -Ernest Hemingway The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.-- Edward John Phelps
I also had a .280 Ackley built for my younger son when he was a teenager. BIG,BAD, MISTAKE! Over the years there has been problems with reloading data and no easy available of components for reloading.......
Overtly dramatic, don’t you think? You’re making false assertions.
"I never thought I'd live to see the day that a U.S. president would raise an army to invade his own country." Robert E. Lee
Yup, Jack liked the .270. Sheep hunters are hit with a different hammer, I can say this because I am so afflicted. Sheep come first, elk moose etc are not even considered when hunting rams. A .270 or .280 suits it perfectly and with enough extra to handle a herd bull elk of any description. Jack liked the .270 ,at the time nothing really compared to it . He would be quite surprised just how capable it is these days. Hey and the .270 wsm really does need a 24" barrel....the wcf works just fine with a 22. Any repeater with a longer barrel is just too long to carry at 10,000 ft and 45* angle of slope. My little old opinion, folks
God's honest truth is that I've got it really bad for a 6.5 PRC. Really, really, bad. So much that I almost purchased a GAP Cableas Exclusive at a bit over 4K from Guns International. I finally decided that at the tender age of 61, I wasn't likely to get enough use out of it as the years are starting to take their toll. Second choice was a Seekins Havak Pro. I could not find one for love nor money. At least not in 6.5 PRC. It was then I realized the plain old 270 Winchester wasn't much different ballistically speaking. I found a CZ Sonoran on closeout. Leica Magnus from Doug. Alaska Arms rings. Barnes LRX ammo. I'll be antelope hunting in two weeks with it. First .270 I've ever owned. Its now my back up elk gun,for when I do my normal fall down the mountain in the dark and land on the rifle routine on the elk opener. So now my battery is 270 Winchester, .338 Winchester, and 375 H&H. If I manage to break all those during my up coming 4th rifle elk hunt, I'm taking up fly fishing.
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